was there a thread about this somewhere?
i think i recall
or maybe not
or maybe its just a word
i think sometimes a toad or an ant or a bright lime colored grasshopper could be more enlightened than i

but they probably don't laugh as much as i do

or cry

so .... what does it mean?

just curious

does that word actually mean ANY thing at all?

wondering

Yes, dear there was a thread about this--you started it!

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]

Me, I'm still as perplexed by the term as I was then : )

Well.. just like I probably mentioned in your first iteration LaV I reckon it is a completely individual understanding.. like all things.

I think that the general meaning is associated with a commonly agreed level of awareness that someone has of our devine nature, and the subsequent behavioural paterns that are associated with it. Although my own idea of it will still vary from the next persons, because I will attribute subtly different character traits based on my own experiences of it.

Mine are :
1) Someone who has a strong relationship with humour.
2) Someone who places their energy into the things which inspire or support themselves and others.
3) Someone who holds all life as precious.
4) Someone who is accepting.
5) Someone who respects.
6) Honesty and kindness are assumed.

la_veronique Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> was there a thread about this somewhere?
Yes, I remember this Topic. Everyone who was unenlightened
tried to explain what it is like to be enlightened. I was one of them.
When D.T. Suzuki was asked that question, he said "Just normal everyday
life, except about 3 inches off the ground".

[en.wikipedia.org]

I believe that genuine enlightenment is what happens when one reaches the upper end of this diagram:

[drbass.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/29/2009 02:57AM by Omega.

wheatgrass

i think unenlightened people are the definition of enlightenment then according to your version

lightform

i really totally dig that list
i especially liked #1 having a strong relationship with humor

tamukha

HA HA!! yeah.. now i remember
i did start it
thanks for excavating it from rawfood never never land

omega

that is a cool pondering diagram
i can relate to it
especially the top end of it

zest for life
yep

that's me

most of the time

but its also cuz i also explore the other end

so it REALLY makes me appreciate the light
that much more

a difficult question indeed.....

it like asking someone what an apple tastes like if you have never tasted one.

the lower can never comprehend the higher. a person with no background in physics has no way of understanding a doctor of quantum physics. it would be like ......duh????


since i am not an enlightened being ( although i am sincerely working ) i can only share with you the best of what i have encountered on my journey.

her again is one from nicoll:

to see things as they are,apart from imagination and our subjective ideas(Objective Consciousness).before we can reach such a state we must first attain and transcend a lesser state called Self Consciousness which is a genuine awareness of "I" or Self-Remembering. this is a most illusive state since every one takes it for granted and supposes that they surely are a Self-Conscious being. ( it would take pages to go into more detail here, so may it suffice as is).


direct from maurice nicoll: psychological commentaries


"in the religions of all nations there are indications of the possibility of such a state of consciousness, which is called "Enlightenment" and other names, but which cannot be described in words for it transcends all words. When a man prays for enlightenment he prays for Objective Consciousness. But he must first be in the 3rd state of consciousness (Self-Consciousness) for it is only in this state 3rd state that can be touched and retain the meaning of any experience or help coming from those who are at the 4th state of consciousness (Objective Consciousness). but you must realize that if a man prays for enlightenment,say about himself, he is praying to awaken and if a man fully awoke to himself and saw himself as he really is, that is objectively, he would go mad. it is better to think of praying for more understanding."



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2009 01:43AM by juicin' john.

geez
i didn't understand all this third state ness
and 4th stateness

oh well
i am happy to be in the alleged state of delusions and illusions
i feel good because i like the fact that all that light is not pouring into my eyeballs all at once

it would probably scar my cornea or something like that

then again

i think its a myth that people think they are not enlightened


i think that enlightened means being in the light

and there are two ways to be

dead ( no light)

or alive ( still have light energy within)

so maybe everyone is enlightened

i like being alive

sure beats being dead

dead is so boring

but then again, who knows

I try to get enlightened daily. When someone says something I don't get I ask WTF? So then they explain & I say "ah, I see!" & then I have been enlightened!

If you want to get enlightened just ask someone about something you don't know, tell them "enlighten me!".

If you're looking for someone who knows all & see all though, some guru in a mountain (or on a website), you are wasting your energies. Anyone who says they're enlightened on all matters is a colossal goof. Almost everyone has some level of understanding & everyone has some level of misunderstanding/delusion. To think that you'll ever understand it all is... well, it's just not happening.

Now you may have an a-ha moment. You may feel a brief sense of oneness with all beings & in-tune with the flow of the universe, etc. etc. but that's not enlightenment. That's just being in the flow. It passes, life moves on, you fall out of the flow. You try to get back in. Maybe someone, somewhere is in all the time. Maybe they or others think that's enlightenment. Who knows, the whole word & concept seems terribly pretentious to me. "I'm enlightened, you're deluded". Me, I'm just here to learn & to have fun. A world where the goal is to have some instant awakening & then you know it all & just shuffle around in a white robe & sleep with your gurupies isn't all that appealing (some appeal of course but not enough). Forget enlightenment, just try to increase your understanding & enjoyment incrementally.

“The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know. The more I realize I don't know, the more I want to learn.” - Albert Einstein



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2009 10:36AM by communitybuilder.

I thought this was a neat passage I clipped some time ago

Life is a moment to celebrate, to enjoy. Make it fun, a celebration, and then you will enter the temple. The temple is not for the long-faced, it has never been for them. Look at life--do you see sadness anywhere? Have you ever seen a tree depressed? Have you seen a bird anxiety-ridden? Have you seen an wild animal neurotic? No, life is not like that, not at all. Only man has gone wrong somewhere, and he has gone wrong somewhere because he thinks himself to be very wise, very clever. Your cleverness is your disease. Don't be too wise. Always remember to stop; don't go to the extreme. A little foolishness and a little wisdom is good, and the right combination makes you a buddha

Osho I Celebrate Myself Chapter 4

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2009 11:56AM by Jgunn.

<< A little foolishness and a little wisdom is good, and the right combination makes you a buddha >>

what if i just have a lot of foolishness

does that make me an uber goober buddha?

communitybuilder:

no? you don't like people with long white flowing robes telling you "follow me"?

what if the robes were made out of hemp and hand woven and ... and....

ahh... its all good

babies are enlightened

because they never lie

when they are born

at least

they are honest

kind of

i guess

or maybe its all one big fat lie

and babies are no more enlightened than adults who are no more deluded than babies

i don't know

if something is one way

then there must also be the other facet as well

maybe we are all just a bunch of babies learning to walk .. spiritually speaking

Babies are pure but I wouldn't say they are enlightened, they are just wide open & receptive. Babies don't have any misconceptions about knowing it all, they know they have so much to learn & do so at a furious pace & without self-reproach. We can all learn from them in that regard.

I think it's rather that babies lack self-awareness, the blessing and curse of the over 18-monthers. I know someone who insists that babies can manipulate you, can play you like a violin. I am having the hardest time explaining that this is insane. Adults do that. Well, unenlightened adults.

Hey, maybe that's it! Maybe enlightenment is being totally self-aware and yet totally self-fulfilling!

hey tamukha

i like that totally self aware and totally fulfilled at whatever is happening at the present moment

all the time

or ... maybe enlightenment is being happy no matter what i feel

like i am happy that i am sad
i am happy that i am tired
i am happy that i feel frustrated
i am happy that i am happy

i am happy that i am healthy
i am happy if i get a cold
i am happy no matter what
for no particular reason at all

cb

you are right
we could all learn from babies

they are always in wonderment at life
things are brand new

i like looking at life through their eyes

sometimes

Yeah, happy that I am sad. I feel that sometimes.

communitybuilder Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> If you're looking for someone who knows all & see
> all though, some guru in a mountain (or on a
> website), you are wasting your energies. Anyone
> who says they're enlightened on all matters is a
> colossal goof. Almost everyone has some level of
> understanding & everyone has some level of
> misunderstanding/delusion. To think that you'll
> ever understand it all is... well, it's just not
> happening.
>

You better be wrong !! I just spent big bucks on a internet correspondence course that garauntees full enlightenment in just 31 days. It is soo good that it also grants a free playstation 3 with graduation.

I think that most religions are basically selling spirituality. IMO any time that a person is asked to surrender some form of personal sovererignty, the underlying adgenda is for control and power.

You get all these "loving, benevolent teachers" who are keen to share their peace and serenity with you, so long as you pay at the door. Go figure ! I think I'm just feeling like having a rave Bless them all, but it sure aint my cup of tea. Enlightenment is when you realise that to reach your enlightenment carrot, you are actually swimming through tropical fruit salad.

Lightform,

"Enlightenment is when you realise that to reach your enlightenment carrot, you are actually swimming through tropical fruit salad."

Brilliant!

hey i got hungry reading that

i want lightform and tamukha to make me some tropical fruit salad

please PLENTY of kiwis from new zealand as well as yummy papayas and don't forget to dice some carrots in there too ... i like to have my enlightenment and eat it too

Quote

You better be wrong !! I just spent big bucks on a internet correspondence course that garauntees full enlightenment in just 31 days. It is soo good that it also grants a free playstation 3 with graduation.

I think I saw an ad for that on the banner once.

i wan't my money back

I think one aspect of genuine enlightenment is the realization that Genesis 1:29 is REAL, and that the living God not only intended everyone to be happy and healthy, but still desires us to return to his Law today (I mean this in a non-religious way).

Only Genesis 1:29? How about Isaiah 13 verses 16-18. It is also particularly beautiful, no? Truly our God is a glorious & merciful God!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2010 12:01AM by communitybuilder.

I think that when God created man, she was only joking