ok guys...my basal calorie number is 1407. that means i need that many for my body and organs to function properly right? i am having a hard time getting that many calories in me. i don`t want high fat foods and i`m not hungry enough to fit all the stuff in that`ll take me to that number. how do y`all do it?
patty

don't worry about it. you can't force yourself..

Dewey you can do it .. thats only 14 bananas, heck ill eat 14nanas easy after jujitsu and i only weight 125
also try blending and making smoothies
mocha


> Myspace: [www.myspace.com]
> Blog: [chefdemocha.blogspot.com]

mocha LOL i knew you`d answer this in fact for humor`s sake i was gonna say "mocha need not reply" LOL. i know i can fit it in by eating lotsa dense calorie things like nanas but if i`m trying to cover all by vitamins and minerals i need variety right?
patty
p.s mocha, you are a wonderful soul and i hope your blood tests and all went well.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> don't worry about it. you can't force yourself..

but for optimal nutrition and health isn`t it wise to supply your body with the calories ie energy it needs to function at its best?
patty

Instead of worrying if you are getting all the calories you need and all the exact nutrients for each day, look at getting it in a week, or monthly. It's probably more natural anyway, because who in much of our past history has had such variety of foods on a daily basis anyway?

Foraging, gathering, even hunting seems like it would be seasonal, and sparodic at best.

Love,
Prism

I agree with Prism...check your intake weekly and monthly. I also agree with Mocha...blending and juicing helps you to consume a lot more than you would naturally "eat". You've probably heard me say before I don't particularly like greens. But, for example, I freeze baby spinach and put it in my morning smoothie (can't taste it) along with 2 bananas and some berries (blue or straw). It is filling and very nutritional. I experiment around on fitday with different inputs and combinations to see what I want/need/can get out of foods and I try to plan around that and what I am wanting.

Patty...I'm envious! I wish I didn't have to lose 40lbs and could eat more!

islandgirl Wrote:

> Patty...I'm envious! I wish I didn't have to lose
> 40lbs and could eat more!

friend...i have weight to lose also and i`m sure since you`re doing fantastic on your way of life and eating the weight will melt i am at 144 and i`m 5'7" and my short term goal is 135 i think so i have 9 lbs to go. long term is a fit, toned unjello like thinghs and an uplifted smiley face butt

I can't eat more than one banana at a time

i like prism's response....which was a better way of saying what i said...

Patty, have you tried sweet juicy fruit? I find sweet juicy fruit very saciating and hydrating at the same time. And, I can't stop at just one pice of fruit. I am having mandarines at the moment - a basktefull.

I have not been having too many bananas lately either.

Gosia


RawGosia channel
RawGosia streams

Hi Dewey,

First, where did you get that number? It sounds like it's based on the SAD. Keep in mind that raw foodists take in much more nutrients per calorie than those who eat cooked food. After two weeks raw, much of the mucoid plaque coating the digestive tract has disintegrated, making the body's assimilation way more efficient, and thus requiring even fewer nutrients. That calorie count is based on the number of nutrients needed for someone who eats food leached of its vitamins and minerals due to heat.

Admittedly, I hit 1407 easily by eating oils, nut-based crackers and avocados. But I certainly don't hit it every day--probably not most days. If you're feeling satisfied after you eat, then you're getting enough food. Just be sure you're not skimping on the fat.

If you still want to reach that number, I'm curious: what do you eat in a day that keeps you from getting there?

Betty

"Don't believe everything you think."

--Bumper Sticker

Im sitting here eating a 6nana 2Honey Mango poridge laughing, because my breakfast is over half of your daily needs, Am I a tubby or what? No but seriously, Dr Graham says that it will take time for a normal person to adjust to the calories per bite on raw food. the only other tip I can offer is to take in more sweet fruit, Mostly nanas, persimmons and depending on variety figs and mangos. The figs and mangos are the most nutrionaly dense when it comes to vitimans and also pack a decent caloric punch for thier size. I wish you well dewey and I thank you for your kind words
-Mocha


> Myspace: [www.myspace.com]
> Blog: [chefdemocha.blogspot.com]

Dewey...I'm also curious how you determine the calories you need per day. I had read (somewhere?) that you need 10x your weight just for basic maintanence. Then if you wanted to lose/gain weight, you would adjust accordingly. I read through Dr. Graham's book rather quickly, but I don't recall him addressing specific caloric intake, just the 80/10/10 regardless of how many calories you take in. I'm confused now about how many calories I should be taking in to lose weight, given that eating raw is so different than dieting with SAD. Mocha...have you always been thin or just after eating RAW?

perbetty Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Dewey,
>
> First, where did you get that number?

> If you still want to reach that number, I'm
> curious: what do you eat in a day that keeps you
> from getting there?

i got that number from fitday. i don`t eat many avocadoes or ingest much oil. since i`d like to lose another 10 pounds or so i`m trying not to eat the fat foods even though i know they`re good fat they`re still fat.on the flip side weight is not my motivator so maybe i`m doing myself an injustice. i eat plums,cherries,peppers,lettuces,green smoothies,tomatoes..whatever fresh food i come into contact with! LOL i usually hover around 800-1000 cals a day
patty

Mocha Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I
> wish you well dewey and I thank you for your kind
> words
> -Mocha

thanks mocha and your welcome
patty

Mocha Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Im sitting here eating a 6nana 2Honey Mango
> poridge laughing, because my breakfast is over
> half of your daily needs, Am I a tubby or what?
> No but seriously, Dr Graham says that it will take
> time for a normal person to adjust to the calories
> per bite on raw food. the only other tip I can
> offer is to take in more sweet fruit, Mostly
> nanas, persimmons and depending on variety figs
> and mangos. The figs and mangos are the most
> nutrionaly dense when it comes to vitimans and
> also pack a decent caloric punch for thier size. I
> wish you well dewey and I thank you for your kind
> words
> -Mocha

Mocha,

I thought you had backed off on the fruit and increased the powdered greens and fats, or something like that... i can't remember...

have you changed back?

Patty,

The reason I'm concerned about your cutting down on fat while transitioning to raw is because your body needs it to self-repair--which is what transitioning is all about.

Betty

"Don't believe everything you think."

--Bumper Sticker

perbetty Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Patty,
>
> The reason I'm concerned about your cutting down
> on fat while transitioning to raw is because your
> body needs it to self-repair--which is what
> transitioning is all about.

why? how does fat help it repair?
patty

Yes I wasnt maintaing weight previously with 80/10/10 because I was burning too many calories and wasnt eating enough(im very active) and like I said I got down to 116 for 70.5 inches, not good So i was determined to stay raw and I attempted eating more fats(55-70G) to maintain weight, which worked, but I did reap the consiquences. After coming to the realization that I am slowly poisoning my body just as i did on the SAD diet, but to a more moderate effect, i decided to give Dr. Graham another shot. It worked, and I cannot describe the surge of happniess and life that I expierence now!
-Like I said Dewey, It might not be easy at first, but you can do it ... It may take time for your body to adjust, as did mine, but just hang in there and it will work out


> Myspace: [www.myspace.com]
> Blog: [chefdemocha.blogspot.com]

Mocha Wrote:

> -Like I said Dewey, It might not be easy at first,
> but you can do it ... It may take time for your
> body to adjust, as did mine, but just hang in
> there and it will work out

and if it doesn`t i`m comin to get you!! where are you based again?? LOL
patty

I don't know if fat can help the body to repair. I do know from my own experience that eating lots of raw fat can make the initial detoxification period go on for much longer and stop you from ever experiencing that surge of happiness and life Mocha speaks of. Maybe it's different for people of different body types but for me all those nuts and avocado's didn't work and I feel much better since cutting way down on those. It's early days yet for me on low fat. I've been eating 100% raw for almost five years and high fat for most of those and only started eating low fat about two months ago but it feels so much better. For now it feels to me like the missing key to really feeling great on raw although it's not always easy. I get bad cravings for fat and I'm not always strong enough to resist but I am getting better at it.

Francis

Good Job Francis and I believe we both agree that the 80/10/10 raw lifestyle is, at least for us, the most enjoyable and healthy eating "plan" there is. I feel I sense of euphoria when as ripe banana or a sweet fresh Fig touches my mouth, an experience I never share with nuts or other fat based raw and especially Cooked( I cant even smell cook meat without getting nauseated) food. Now I do admit that I dip into the occasional Durian every so once-in-a-while and I am a raw potluck member in chitown(1nce every 2 Weeks) but life is made for enjoyment, and I highly doubt that a lovely durian is going to present any sudden health risks.
My philosophy, love life .. Eat Happy .. Live Long!
-Mocha


> Myspace: [www.myspace.com]
> Blog: [chefdemocha.blogspot.com]

mocha how did you get so wise at 17?
patty

Mocha Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes I wasnt maintaing weight previously with
> 80/10/10 because I was burning too many calories
> and wasnt eating enough(im very active) and like I
> said I got down to 116 for 70.5 inches, not good
> So i was determined to stay raw and I attempted
> eating more fats(55-70G) to maintain weight, which
> worked, but I did reap the consiquences. After
> coming to the realization that I am slowly
> poisoning my body just as i did on the SAD diet,
> but to a more moderate effect,

Hiya Mocha
What are you refering to as so detrimental with this comment.. was it the extra fat ? and if so what kind ?

> i decided to give
> Dr. Graham another shot. It worked, and I cannot
> describe the surge of happniess and life that I
> expierence now!
> -Like I said Dewey, It might not be easy at first,
> but you can do it ... It may take time for your
> body to adjust, as did mine, but just hang in
> there and it will work out

Was the solution you found to just eat more fruit ?

Patty,

It doesn't take a lot of fat, but it shouldn't be completely cut out. Here's an excerpt of an article I found that articulates the improtance of fat for repair better than I can. It's from [www.askdrsears.com]

"Think of your brain as the master gland that sends chemical messengers throughout the body, telling each organ how to work. An important group of these chemical messengers are the prostaglandins (so-called because they were originally discovered in the prostate gland). Prostaglandins initiate the body's self-repair system. The body needs two kinds of fat to manufacture healthy brain cells (the message senders) and prostaglandins (the messengers). These are omega 6 fatty acids (found in many oils, such as safflower, sunflower, corn, and sesame oils) and omega 3 fatty acids (found in flax, pumpkin seeds and walnuts, and coldwater fish, such as salmon and tuna)....

"Most important to brain function are the two essential fatty acids, linoleic (or omega 6) and alpha linolenic (or omega 3). These are the prime structural components of brain cell membranes and are also an important part of the enzymes within cell membranes that allow the membranes to transport valuable nutrients in and out of the cells.

"When the cells of the human body - and the human brain - are deprived of the essential fatty acids they need to grow and function, the cells will try to build replacement fatty acids that are similar, but may actually be harmful. Higher blood levels of 'replacement fatty acids' are associated with diets that are high in hydrogenated fats and diets that contain excessive amounts of omega 6 fatty acids. Levels of replacement fatty acids have been found to be elevated in persons suffering from depression or Attention Deficit Disorder. A diet rich in omega 3 fatty acids (such as the LNA from flax oil or the EPA and DHA from fish oils) not only provides the body with healthy fats, but it also lowers the blood level of potentially harmful ones, such as cholesterol and, possibly, even reversing the effects of excess trans fatty acids"


I agree that a lot of nuts, especially if they aren't soaked, can undermine energy. But an avocado a day, plus a small handful of nuts or sprinkling of seeds a few times a day, is a good idea during transition, at least while the body adjusts to vegetable proteins. I feel uncomfortable telling anyone how to eat, and whatever feels right is the right choice for you. Just be aware that it's filling effect can make transitioning more comfortable, and a lot of energy comes from the good fats you put in when you're raw. I don't know what types of fats you were eating before you were raw--probably good ones since you're so strict with yourself. The thing is, the high quality fats aren't as likely to be stored in your body as fat; they're more likely to be used for energy. For that reason, you might not want to count on what's already in your body, unless you know what's being stored there.

Betty

"Don't believe everything you think."

--Bumper Sticker

awesome explanation betty, thank you
patty

This is what I learned from The 80/10/10 Diet by Doug Graham:

currently, two fatty acids are thought to be essential: alpha-linolenic acid (ALA) and linoleic acid (L), also called omega-3 and omega-6.Twelve different fatty acids are made from ALA and LA and all of the fatty acids that stem from these are classified as omega-3 and omega-6. So not all omega-3 and 6 are essential. Only the polyunsaturated fats ALA and LA must be obtained from external sources. Current research in nutritional science is questioning whether ALA is actually essential, since evidence exists that the body may be able to synthesize it. Anyway, we don't need to worry about this since both linoleic and alpha-linolenic fatty acids are to be found in the makeup of plant lipids. It seems that their ratio to one another is more important than the quantity we eat. Scientists accept that early man consumed omega-6 and omega-3 fatty acids in roughly a 1:1 ratio which is the ratio of essential fatty acids found in the human brain.

As we started eating more grains and oils with a lot of omega-6 this ratio changed.Current recommendations suggest an ideal ration between 1:1 and 4:1 (omega-6 to omega-3) but the average American's range is a ratio from 10 to 30:1. This contributes significantly to the prevalence of inflammatory diseases and other serious health issues as this seriously skewed ratio compromises the body's ability to convert ALA into longer-chain fatty acids, such as EPA and DHA.

Depending on which source you use we need approx. 3 to 5% of our caloric intake to come from LA (omega-6) and 0.5 to 3% of calories from ALA (omega-3) per day. The World Health Organization recommends 5 to 8% of total calories come from LA and a minimum of 1% from ALA, on a diet where fat totals 15% of calories. The WHO's recommendations for EFA's increases as the percentage of fat in the diet increases, which suggests an inverse rule could apply for lower-fat diets. In 2002, the Food and Nutrition Board of the U.S. Institute of Medicine recommended an "adequate intake" for omega-3 of 1.1 to 1.6 grams per day.

On a 2.000 calorie diet, 0.5% of calories from ALA represents 10 calories. This is approx. 1.1.grams of ALA or omega-3 which falls with the IOM's adequate intake levels (albeit at the bottom of the range). It would follow that the same amount of LA, or omega-6, would also be adequate, given the 1:1 ratio. This quantity of both EFAs is easily obtained through the consumption of whole fresh fruits and vegetables, with the occasional addition of nuts and seeds.

This is where Dr. Graham shows some charts with the EFA contents of various whole foods and goes on to say that based on the numbers obtained from the charts, on a 2000 calorie 80/10/10 diet, we could easily obtain recommended levels of EFAs with the following:

Breakfast: 1.5 lbs. of mangoes (about 3) and 12 oz. blueberries
Lunch: 44 oz. of bananas (about 11)
Dinner: 1 lb. of oranges, 1 lb. of romaine lettuce and 8 oz. of tomatoes.

According to the USDA nutrient database, this meal plan provides 1.3 grams of ALA and 1.4 grams of LA. This maintains the 1:1 ratio and supplies the miminum necessary EFAs without including any overt fats at all. Including healthful (very small) amounts of overt fats will ensure your needs are met.

I hope Dr. Graham will consider this a "brief" quotation from his book otherwise I think I may just have broken the copyright law.

With regards to the article Betty posted, if you're eating raw fats you wouldn't need to eat lots of it to offset the damage done to the brain and body from eating bad fats. In my opinion of course. So this article would be more geared to people eating a SAD diet.


Francis

thanks for the awesome info
patty