Yesterday I went to a family party. I usually bring food to these types of things or eat an advance. I didn't get a chance to this time. I was hungry and was going to wait until afterwards, but then decided to just eat a cold pasta salad. It was vegan but not raw. I have been 100% raw for a couple of moths now (and close to raw for along time before that). I decided it was no big deal to eat cooked this one time. Later on that day I had a pretty bad headache and today I feel a little sick. I feel tired, with a slight sore throat. I am not sure if it due to eating the pasta or not. Could it be related? Maybe because body just not used to things like pasta I reacted strangely to it.

I think eating cooked after getting "clean" is probably not going to go down well. My experience with eating cooked after being raw has been limited as it has only happened 3 times to me and each time I ate just a little cooked food either with raw food or by itself and each time I stopped as quickly as i could get a grip on myself as I do not want to go back to where I was before when I ate cooked foods. I feel much better physically and mentally as a 100% all fresh raw vegan. What I want to say in this post is about the after effects of eating the cooked food that I experienced. Each time I ate a little cooked food it was like I stepped onto thin very smooth ice and I felt like I was either going to crash through or take a big fall because of unstable footing. The thoughts of cooked food haunted me for several days and were strong enough that I had to "white knuckle" it to stay raw. I now understand why/how people fail and go back to their old ways and I can sympathize with them because cooked food becomes a very strong temptation to the raw foodist who steps out on the ice. Good luck and I hope you make it OK back off the ice.

I hear you. It's all about what YOU want.....and what YOU choose to express in consciousness. If food is an expression of that.....for you....then don't allow circumstances to dictate YOUR decisions. They don't have to.

-David Z. Mason

WWW.RawFoodFarm.com

Thanks. I just have to be more careful next time to have food with me. Maybe getting a little sick was a good thing because the memory of this reaction will help to keep me totally raw.

I think it serves a purpose too as you've mentioned Joanne. Honestly this is what keeps me raw also -- sort of as negative reinforcement. 99% is positive as this is a choice for me to be Raw, but I've gotten very sick eating cooked food since becoming a raw foodist. On foods that I used to eat everyday! Like veggie burgers, brown rice and such. They were not fun experiences spending entire evenings on the bathroom floor. They are seared eternally in my memory. Aside from the occasional emotional attachment that surfaces to some aromas and cooked foods, I have no desire to go there ever again. During the transition, I think having food handy is definately helpful. I always have a piece of fruit or even a lara bar in my bag for emergencies. I think you're more at risk to succumbing when you're hungry. :-D

While we're on the subject...

Last night, a friend who's staying with me made a salad with peanut butter, yogurt, boiled egg and I don't know what else she put in it. You know I wanted to say something, but I minded my own business - kept my mouth shut! haha. Anyway because I was also hungryy, for a split second the peanut butter was calling my name. I tell you what though... I made my own salad with yellow peppers, spinach, radishes, cucumbers with meyer lemon juice, and a splash of extra virgin olive oil and it was soooo good. I immediately just felt connected to the food and enjoyed every bite. I don't know when the cravings for non-raw foods stop, but I know the power of eating raw foods is so much stronger on so many levels.

Part of what has really broken my addictions for me was going back to the foods I craved one last time. I know it sounds odd... maybe I'm one of those rebellious punks who have to learn the hard way.

Anyway, my boyfriend and I went to Niagara Falls for our anniversary. We didn't have reservations for dinner anywhere, and there was a 2+ hour wait for any place I could have gotten a respectable salad at.

We ended up getting Chinese food delivered to the hotel. I thought a little vegetable stir fry would do no harm...

I felt so horrible, I fell asleep by 9PM. I had the WORST stomach pains, it felt like there was a ball of fire in my chest. We couldn't keep our plans to go dancing, there was no magic... it really killed our entire night. It was a super expensive suite and we didn't even really get to make use of it. Plus the anxiety produced by the entire situation was a nightmare!

Needless to say, if I ever do get Chinese food cravings again, I know PRECISELY how transparent they are. And because I concretely KNOW how these foods make me feel now that I have a more functioning gut, I truly don't want them.

The only thing I haven't eaten since I've been raw has been some Indian food--and it's kind of haunting me. I might have to go get sick on it one last time... otherwise the thought will always float in my mind and keep haunting me. =S

Even though the temptation is there to eat cooked foods I have to keep in mind the flavour of them has changed to me. They don't taste like they use to. I have been raw for a week after several months away from the raw food. I am just starting to feel better. I have temptation every day as I have to cook for my family and smell the foods. I feel stronger now in my resolve to eat raw foods.

A lot of what I used to like don't taste good to me any more. Like I used to love rice cakes with lots of spice powder and oil.. i tried it that day and I could not even eat teh spice powder and oil. could not even taste it as teh smell of oil was so not pleassant any more.. Yes, taste changes a lot when we do more raw foods. Also I can't tolerate big cooked food meals.

Take care
A Iyer

One of my favorite and most enjoyable progress markers on the raw journey has been paying attention to how my tastes constantly improve!

I should have mentioned, that every time I went back to cooked and did get sick, the things I ate NEVER tasted as good as I remembered. I was shocked once to be totally full from about 1/4 of a falafel (it tasted like a battlefield explosion in my mouth, too)--fried food is a nightmare for my body, I can't believe how much I used to eat.

i just had a couple of slips last week...I work in a a little resturant and we have all these beautiful desserts...so i ate a couple of bites of dessert for 3 or 4 days...WHAT A MISTAKE

Ive been contipated like %@?*##% for the whole week!!! I just started going to the bathroom as i usually do, like this morning!!

So now im just sooo scared to eat cooked stuff, being constipated panics me!

If I was getting sick from few bites of cooked food, I would not attribute that to a cleansing reaction but to my system not being healthy enough and resilient.

I drink green juices and eat plenty of raw items every day, the result of that is a very resilient body which can tolerate cooked food whenever I want to. Even animals in the wild eat cooked food from wild fire.

It is not the food and it is the body not being healthy enough, not resilient. If raw food is working for you, it should make you resilient.

I've been 100% mono eating raw for a rather long time (about year and a half) and for the last 3 days i've been eating cooked food as well as avoiding all food combining rules.
I don't feel any bad effects though, to my surprise it seems that I don't have any problems at all.

However I have gained a lot of weight, which isn't bad too since i'm still rather lean.

I have tried slightly fried mushrooms for the first day.
The next day I ate lots of raw honey with lots of raw nuts and baked potato with avocado and cooked wild rice with nuts and honey. It tasted very good also and I felt great actually.
On the third day I felt great aswell, needed only 4 hours of sleep, I ate cooked wild rice with vegetables, lots of raw honey with raw nuts, Shrimps with soy sauce and cooked white rice and marinated olives, baked corn and a salad which consisted of marinated cucumbers, marinated cabbage, baked potato, baked beet, peas and olive oil. I ate a lot of this salad and it was really good.

Today is the 4th day, I have slept for only 4 hours again and I fell rather good lots of energy. I don't want to eat at all so I'm fasting.

This is a very interesting expirience for me. Maybe being 100% raw isn't the best choice in all situations and also I'd like to mention that I don't crave any cooked food and I don't care about any cooked junk food (sweets, pizzas etc.)
Another interesting thing with cooked food for me is that I can control how much I eat much better. and with raw fruits it is very hard to stop eating until I'm feeling very full.

I would like to know if there are some cooked foods that are actually good and healthy. For example what is wrong with rice and baked beets, potatoes etc.?
Maybe I've been too pure and too strict... There are healthy traditional diets that people were following for thousands of years and they lived healthy lives and all of them includes cooked food so it makes me wonder maybe there is a helthy diet, not not necessarily 100% raw but without any junk and salt, sugar, flour etc.

Raw food isn't all the same aswell as cooked food doesn't have to be junkfood, fastfood and etc. Raw can make me feel bad, fpr example raw onions and garlick makes me feel very bad and



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/23/2008 06:02AM by Walkern.

Sure Walkern. There is no 'fixed' right and wrong.....only what works for YOU....based on the goals YOU have identified...consciously and unconsciously. If your goals don't REQUIRE raw....then it will seem like a silly discipline and too strict and burdensome. It will seem like you are 'giving up' something. As such, each person needs to be supported in THEIR goals......and the fuel that gets you there is a secondary consideration.

-David Z. Mason

WWW.RawFoodFarm.com

I find a huge difference between cooked vegan whole foods and junk foods. I can eat a baked potato with no REAL side effects (sometimes a runny nose, sometimes delayed bowel movements)--but if I drink alcohol, have white rice, white sugar, breads... that's when I'll feel ill and start having problems.

I love yams/potatoes... they do make me feel very large and weighed down, though. They're awesome for transitioning, especially on rough days. =)

Although, fresh, raw fruits and veggies are still nutritionally/digestively superior to potatoes.

That is an intriguing post Walkern.

I don't believe that cooking food will instantly make it toxic enough to deliver noticable negative experiences to those that eat it. It is my feeling that everyones bodies are in different states of health and have differing tolerances. Even though cooking destroys the nutritive properties of food, most people will be able to assimilate the extra demands placed on their body without noticable reaction for a long time.

There is then also the emotional effects. If a cooked food transfers an emotional high and is not too toxic like sugar or meat etc.. then maybe the emotional effect on the body will counterbalance to some degree, the extra burden that it has in metabolising the food. It is all very well to focus on the effects of what we eat, but I think that peoples emotional and physical lives are just as relevant to how healthy they are, and how long it takes for signs of the bodies stress to appear.

I very much disagree with the attitude of
madinah
Date: June 23, 2008 12:43AM

"If I was getting sick from few bites of cooked food, I would not attribute that to a cleansing reaction but to my system not being healthy enough and resilient.

I drink green juices and eat plenty of raw items every day, the result of that is a very resilient body which can tolerate cooked food whenever I want to. Even animals in the wild eat cooked food from wild fire.

It is not the food and it is the body not being healthy enough, not resilient. If raw food is working for you, it should make you resilient."

---------

With that attitude one might as well expect oneself to drink and smoke with the gang at the local pool hall...

It is a macho attitude, a show off attitude that completely fails to understand the rationale of raw food diet.

Nobody would treat their car that way: "Hey look everybody I can put sand in my gas tank cause it's a strong tough Ford truck."

How silly can you get?

===========

joanne81

"Could it be related? Maybe because body just not used to things like pasta I reacted strangely to it."

If you put garbage in a garbage pail it won't smell any worse,
but if you put garbage in your dresser drawer with your nice clean clothes boy will it make a difference!

A clean body (feed with raw foods) knows the difference.
A racing car runs on racing fuel.

Pasta is wheat, glue is made from wheat.
Wheat is inedible unless cooked.
Therefore it is not a natural food.
(It is a product of agriculture.
"Primitive" woman could never have collected enough in the wild to make it worth bothering with, even if it had existed then.
Starch must be mixed with pytalin in the saliva in the mouth to digest properly.
Pasta is already water logged and it's too slippery to chew properly.
It does not belong in the human body.
When it finally gets in the gut it's food for Candida, blocks absorption of good food, most likely coats the walls of the intestine, ferments and may produce alcohol and other toxins.

Yes it was related.

Personally I would rather skip a meal or two, any day, than eat garbage to please others, or appease my fear of a little hunger, or give into an emotion of neediness.

happyway
There is no question that rawfood gets us healthier but it is not an absolute necessity to be healthy, many were doing ok before becoming raw and millions are doing fine without being raw as long as they follow the basic principles of health.

Luigi Carnaro made to 102 on a non raw diet. [www.drbass.com]

The key is not that the food being raw or not raw, it is the ability of the body to assimilate the food. It is true that assimilation is easier when the food is raw.

For me the main keys to healthy living are:
1. attentive eating [www.drbass.com]
2. food assimilation
3. exercise



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2008 08:11AM by madinah.

Some cold store bought pasta salads give me a stomach ache whether I am on raw or not. Having read the ingredients to a few brands, I find all of them have some artificial colorings and preservatives. Because there are multiple ingredients that could be the culprits, its hard for me to know which one they are.

My husband had vegan soup with pasta in it twice after we'd gone raw. Both times he felt extremely sick, feverish, weak, tired for a couple days.

It's enough to make anyone stay raw (o;

Sunflower
Raw Food Chef and Writer
Comfortably Raw
[www.comfortablyraw.com]

Be very, very careful. At one point, after many years I tried various, what others would consider healthier cooked foods. I then paid dearly for it, and this would be an understatement. It's not something that will always be obvious either to notice. Anotherwords, you don't eat and then get a stomach ache. It can come about as a slow unfelt progression.

Whatever the case, be careful whoever or whatever you try :O)

<< Re: Question about a raw-foodist eating cooked... new
Posted by: madinah (IP Logged)
Date: June 25, 2008 04:05AM

happyway
There is no question that rawfood gets us healthier but it is not an absolute necessity to be healthy, >>

===Exactly it is a question of quality--why not choose to go first class?? (also it sort of depends on how you define "healthy", many raw fooders tell stories of being the only one in an office in winter that doesn't get the cold or flu that is going around, that all the "healthy" people get every year)==
===and once one chooses to go first class one finds oneself on a tightrope--there is no backing up.....when you switch from a "diesel truck" to a "racing car" you can't put in diesel fuel with impunity=====

==if an important life goal is to be in the best possible health, one has to sacrifice certain things...
==if one's goal is to be a great anthropologist obviously one will visit different cultures and eat what they eat, perhaps another type of sacrifice...
===But if one wants the best health, the notion that one can get stronger by following intelligent rules, and then after one regains health, then violate those same rules ( biting the hand that feeds one :-) ...then one is simply wasting one's efforts ( and most likely deluding oneself with rationalizations)===

<<...many were doing ok before becoming raw and millions are doing fine without being raw as long as they follow the basic principles of health.>>

==What a casual approach you have ! Folks on this board are experiencing life changing results:

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]



<<Luigi Carnaro made to 102 on a non raw diet. [www.drbass.com]>>

==So what?==Hitler was a vegetarian===So what?

<<The key is not that the food being raw or not raw, >>

==This is where I believe you are really missing (or ignoring) some absolutely vital facts: cooking denatures proteins ( [www.ecologos.org] ), destroys vitamins, the list goes on and on....as this information is readily available I will not repeat it all here ( in case you are just ignoring it - -if not, do yourself a favor and read-up), and many cooked foods are "foods" in name only on top of which the dishes as well as the menus they are a part of are often quite toxic in combination, and cooked foods are rarely eaten as mono meals===

<<it is the ability of the body to assimilate the food. >>

====Yes thats part of it===

<<It is true that assimilation is easier when the food is raw.>>

==Yes, why do you think that is so?====

<<For me the main keys to healthy living are:
1. attentive eating [www.drbass.com]
2. food assimilation
3. exercise>>

==Really? think you can live happily without these?:

==90 something % of humans have some social needs, that are usually vital to well being and HEALTH
==having goals, expressing creativity
==environment: fresh unpolluted air & water
==environment: sunshine, shelter, & clothing
==sleep and rest
==the opportunity to learn, or a stimulating environment
==among the social needs are what some might call "spiritual" needs: expressing compassion, meditation, etc.
==and unfortunately acess to good medical, dental, and eye care
==a cheerful or positive attitude

==in Any Case to leave the Quality of the Fuel out of the equation of how best to run the human Machine in a Healthy manner is obviously incorrect.

==Again you may believe that there are higher goals for humans than health,
for example: you may wish to become a nun in one of Mother Teresa's Missions of Charity and work in the streets of Calcutta, serving the poor...in which case you will eat what the other nuns are eating.
I would never argue with you about such a choice of values.

==As regards health however: The fact that some tibetan monks with the power of "internal heat" can perform amazing feats ( drying wet cloths placed on their naked backs in freezing temperatures) high in the Himalayan mountains, and that they probably eat rice--does not mean cooked rice is a good diet for someone trying to overcome cancer.
==That some weight lifters eat lots of cooked meat, processed cheese, french fries, white bread and sodas does not mean that those are superior foods, that will make you strong.

==The case of cigarette smoking is perhaps the clearest.

It doesn't matter to a smoker if she smokes a few more or less one day,
but for a non smoker even smoking one cigarette will cause great distress.
Once a person quits...
If they only quit for a few days they can easily go back to smoking with no obvious distress to themslevs, in fact they may feel Better after they light up!!
But if they quit for longer, say 3 months, so that most of the nicotine has been eliminated their reaction may be different...
And after a few years they may tear and cough like a healthy person.
Suppose that after a few years they take up running. Would it then be wise for them to say to themselves: "Now I'm so strong, I can go into a bar
and hang out once a week and smoke and drink with my buddies; and besides lots of great writers and artists and musicians smoked, so I will too." ?

For me the important "things" to focus on now are inspiration
[rogerhaeske.com]
and possibilities and potentialities...

I am still only about 2/3 raw, but it's enough that if I eat a cooked meal or (gasp!) a peice of cheese, it messes with me. My AWESOME solution has been digestive enzymes. Take them whenever you eat non-raw food. It REALLY helps. The ultimate problem with cooked or processed food is that it is devoid of enzymes. Raw food in it's natural state contains enzymes that cause the food to break itself down, as well as your body breaking it down. It's a team effort. But cooked food no longer contains the enzymes so your body is struggling to break it down with no help, and at least 50% of the food usually remains undigested. Your body considers the undigested food to be a foreign object and begins using your immune system to attack it. That's why you feel sick.

I guess people on a constant diet of cooked and processed food have adjusted to the undigested food floating around in their system--it's a survival mechanism. The human body is programmed to survive. OBVIOUSLY people can "survive" on nutritionally devoid food, but that's why they are overweight and diseased or heading for disease. But once you are clean, your body is SOOOOOO much more sensitive. Listen to your body!

The evidence does not support the claim that cooked food destroy proteins, vitamins, and is totally harmful to the body.
People making those claims have lived on cooked foods for years and just because they found raw food, everything cooked is bad.
How do you explain that children fed exclusively on cooked milk can survive and grow into adult?
There is no question that raw is better but it does not imply that cooked is useless to the body.

madinah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The evidence does not support the claim that
> cooked food destroy proteins, vitamins,

Check out the same portion size of the USDA for raw as well as cooked, boiled or whatever and see what you find then.

Raw is better I agree but it does not imply that cooked is bad.

I did some research tananwana
[www.dispatch.com]

[curezone.com]

Quote

Posted by: phantom
Date: June 23, 2008 06:50PM

I love yams/potatoes... they do make me feel very large and weighed down, though. They're awesome for transitioning, especially on rough days.

I am still struggling with cooked foods in my diet (see my posts above). It has been like opening a door to cooked foods and finding a hurricane on the other side pushing to keep the door open. I went 10 1/2 months 100% all fresh raw with no problem and then wham. Its been very humbling and I now appreciate this aspect of going raw in a new way. I tried phantom's baked potato/yam and it is working as a transitional food and I am back to about 95% raw. I eat fresh raw foods all day and when/if I cave in I have a baked potato. At least its a simple mono meal but I am going to continue to transition back to 100% because I can definitely tell the difference the cooked makes once its in my stomach. I have always considered myself to be very strong willed and thats why I am having trouble accepting my weakness since opening the door to some cooked food. If I get the door closed again I intend to be more careful not to open it even a little bit. Hopefully posting about my humbling experiences will help someone here in their raw journey.

EZ rider

<<I have always considered myself to be very strong willed and thats why I am having trouble accepting my weakness since opening the door to some cooked food. If I get the door closed again I intend to be more careful not to open it even a little bit. Hopefully posting about my humbling experiences will help someone here in their raw journey.>>

Many raw fooders actually consider cooked foods to be addictive, hence the title of the book:

12 Steps to Raw Foods: How to End Your Dependency on Cooked Food by Victoria Boutenko and Gabriel Cousens
# Paperback: 264 pages
# Publisher: North Atlantic Books; Rev. and Expanded Ed edition (May 8, 2007)
# Language: English
# ISBN-10: 1556436513
# ISBN-13: 978-1556436512

So don't fault yourself on willpower, instead realize what you are dealing with.

EZ (or anyone else who is ADDICTED to cooked food!), I hear you totally. I only grab the yam when it's really between the yam or ordering poisonous, unsanitary, greasy, questionably prepared takeout (a hugely comforting emotional investment of so much of my life). But even that little bit of cooked leads me down such a slippery slope... It leads me to eat more, want more--it initiates a maelstrom of cravings that don't intend to stop until they are satisfied. A brutal battle of wills.

I don't mean to advocate eating yams as a staple or as superior to focusing on fresh, live foods. Just... when you have to pull the e-brake. If you could smoke a cigarette with no nicotine because it's so hard to break a ritual (that you've been repeating 5 times a day/your whole life). If the physical demands are literally too intense, even if I'm breaking raw, a yam is not slipping back into utter self-destruction. It won't stick to my arteries, it won't impede the quality of blood going to my brain. It might take longer to digest, but it won't leave my GI tract rife for a parasitic invasion.

It doesn't make me glow, though. There is a huge difference between a bit of least-damaging cooked and 100% fresh raw with oodles of fruit.

So, psychologically, right now, I'm sticking to the mono-eating and investing some downtime on my holiday vacation to figure out the deeper roots of WHY I want to binge in times of stress. Why I just want to eat something other than what is utterly good for me and makes me feel amazing. What I'm so afraid of facing. Why I would constantly crave things contrary to my wellbeing, and how much money (money = resources to meet your needs of living) I invest in cravings.

Myself? Myself feeling awesome? Myself being a radiant embodiment of joy all the time?

It's a serious commitment sometimes! The worst is dealing with me constantly reasoning with myself... "You've been raw for so long now! Why not just eat XYZ?" (followed by intense, sensory-engulfing flashbacks of whatever cravings are pleading with me)

If it weren't an addiction, would this be a support group?

phantom

I say to myself if others can do it,
I can do it.

Remove the payoff of failure.
Tell yourself
no matter how many times you fail
you will simply begin again, and again and ...
just like you did when
you learned to walk
no big deal.
but you've got to
want it.
You wanted to walk
you didn't want to be in a support group
for crawlers
remove the payoff for failure.
imagine you have already succeeded
and your future self is looking back
and telling you how you did it,
and how you are using your new energy and confidence
to accomplish goals that are deeply meaningful to you,
go for what you really want.

It is possible and maybe advisable but not a necessity to be 100 percent raw to enjoy good health. Cooked food is not toxic and should not bring to us the feelings of guilt and failure. Good nutrition is more than the food we eat, it is how we eat, the quality, quantity, the enjoyment and many other factors. Steamed vegetables can be added to a raw diet and the joy we get from eating the food we like can make us succeed on the raw path.
People want us to believe they got sick from a small bite of cooked food, were we really healthy to begin with? Feasting on watermelon or other fruit for days may put the body on perpetual fasting and cleansing state for those who are not prepared, we may feel healthy but the system internally is weak. We can survive in a perfect organic world but the world is not perfect.