Why are there complications with eating a high fruit diet and moderate amount of fat?
What percentage of calories from fat should I stay under if I want to eat high fruit?

i don't know how sound it is; but what i read from 80/10/10 is that when you eat fruit, your blood sugar raises, there for the more fat in the blood, the harder it is for the sugar to pass through or something..
It's recommended to stay under 10% calories, which on a 2000 calorie diet would be like 6 oz. of avocado or 1 oz. of nuts or so.

though, that's only if you're ONLY eating fruit and greens; if you're eating mostly fruit, and also more complex carbs like buckwheat or something, brendan brazier (author, "The Thrive Diet" eats a diet around 60/20/20; that's 60% carbs, 20% protein, 20% fat; and he says fruit makes up most of his carbs - he's also about 80-90% on a raw diet; but all his cooked recipes are relatively low heat and non-processed; gluten-free and soy-free so it's cool what he does. He's a smart guy.

anyway, hope i got a little answered for you

The majority of my diet, scored by bulk (because I don't count calories), is fruit. I get most of my fat from avocados which has a very good for you fruit fat. Its mostly monounsaturated fat: [en.wikipedia.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/20/2008 06:53PM by EZ rider.

It doesn't matter what kind of fat it is. Fat is fat.

"Fat travels from the lymph system directly into the blood. Too much fat will thicken the blood, causing the red blood cells to clump together so they cannot deliver oxygen to the cells. Excess fat also blocks the acton of insulin in bringing sugars to the cells, which leads to diabetes and other blood sugar problems" (taken from 80/10/10)

I think it is best to bring your fat consumption down slowly as it takes time to learn to feel satiated from fruits alone. There is a comfort to be had from eating fats especially when you are denying yourself other foods that you have been used to. (I'm not directing this at you Rufio but offering it as advice generally)

actually different fats deposit differently in the bloodstream
for example, saturated fats (found in animal products) are known to cause sudden increases in triglycerides, decreasing the flow of blood to the heart and through the arteries
trans fats (hydrogenated) are known to be the worst and linked to cancer
however - there have been multiple studies to suggest that the type of saturated fats in tropical oils, such as coconut, have no harmful effect on the heart. If you think about it, this is similar to the theory that protein from plants is much less threatening then from animals - the book "the china study" did an experiment on mice suggesting that mice fed a 20% animal protein diet vs. a 20% plant protein diet - both were injected with carcinogens; 100% of the mice with the high protein diet got cancer, and 0% of the plant protein diet got cancer. It was shocking to read. (though the ethics of animal testing are a bit out of whack)

if you notice, most people that get type 2 diabetes, heart disease, high cholesterol..they're all hefty.. this is related to weight gain, no doubt. Fat just happens to have 9 calories per bite, and is very easy to over eat and this is how you become obese - eating tons of calories. I read of a man who simply cut out all man-made fats and dropped 60 lbs.

thin blood can be caused easily by not getting enough fats or protein from a diet and too many carbs; this can also dilute and weaken digestion, acid and enzymes and reduce overall absorbtion

i wouldn't swear by what 811 says..it is not incredibly scientifically sound

fats..
-provide calories, ENERGY - this is why humans have developed a taste, they think, for fats - because the more energy you ate, the higher your chance of survival.
think about it - eating fat will not make you fat --eating calories and not burning them off leads to the storage of those calories. Fat happens to have 9 kilocals, as opposed to 4 in carbs and protein.
-used by the body to make hormonal substances that control blood pressure/heart functions
-help the body absorb fat soluble nutrients such as vitamins A, D, E, and K; and it's said antioxidants are much easlier absorbed with the presence of fat

i just did some reading from this website..it's most likely the most accepted scientific info about fats or somewhere near there
[www.realage.com]

here's another article:
[runews.rockefeller.edu]
though the study doesn't say what they were eating; and if simple sugars compensates for fruit! fruit is often thought of as complex carb. but it's still a pretty sound article to think about - converting sugar to fat. yep, the body has it's interesting ways.

I'm still looking for a more direct answer for your question; now you've got me all curious too! i'm going to be all over google..hahaa.. you'll see me post again with hopefully more in depth scientific articles about sugar and fat. and what kinds and which where and who what

oh my bad, it does state what they were given - a liquid formula diet - sorry i was half way through reading when i sent that haha

In this 1995 study of strict raw vegans they were found to eat comparable quantities of fat as omnivores though of different types: [www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

"Fatty acid composition of erythrocyte, platelet, and serum lipids in strict vegans.

"Agren JJ, Törmälä ML, Nenonen MT, Hänninen OO.

"Department of Physiology, University of Kuopio, Finland.

"The fatty acid composition of erythrocytes, platelets, and serum lipids was compared between subjects who had been eating a strict uncooked vegan diet ("living food" for years and omnivore controls. The vegan diet contains equal amounts of fat but more monounsaturated and polyunsaturated and less saturated fatty acids than the mixed diet of the control group. In vegans, the proportion of linoleic acid was greater in all lipid fractions studied. Also, the levels of other n-6 fatty acids were greater, with the exception of arachidonic acid levels, which were similar in most fractions. In erythrocytes, platelets and serum phospholipid fractions, this increase was mainly at the expense of the n-3 fatty acids. The proportions of eicosapentaenoic and docosahexaenoic acid were only 29-36% and 49-52% of those in controls, respectively. In vegans the ratio of n-3 to n-6 fatty acids was only about half that in omnivores. In addition to the lower levels of n-3 fatty acids, the proportions of palmitic and stearic acids were lower in serum cholesteryl esters, triglycerides and free fatty acids of vegans. The proportion of oleic acid was slightly lower only in serum cholesteryl esters and erythrocyte phosphatidylserine. The results show that, in the long term, the vegan diet has little effect on the proportions of oleic and arachidonic acids, whereas the levels of n-3 fatty acids are depressed to very low levels with prolonged consumption of the high linoleic and oleic acid components of this diet."

The concentration of fat in the bloodstream does not seem to have been studied here..? but the depressed "proportions" of n-3 fatty acids were noted "with prolonged consumption of the high linoleic (n-6) and oleic acid components of this diet".

I don't know what the raw vegans in Finland had been eating to account for the low n-3 proportion and high n-6 fatty acid consumption, or if it is characteristic of raw vegans worldwide..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2008 03:27PM by loeve.

..in the previous study the low n-3 levels of raw vegans relative to an omnivore control group might be partly because in Finland they eat a lot of fish, annual per capita consumption of 30.3 kg compared to 16.1 worldwide.

[www.st.nmfs.noaa.gov]

..also the Finns eat a lot of Rainbow trout which are especially high in omega 3's (n-3) as I recall.. [cat.inist.fr]

i dont think the study could possibly relate to raw vegans worldwide ..

first of all finland has a very short growing season and no tropical fruits

[countrystudies.us]

ie: Finland's climate and soils make growing crops a particular challenge. The country lies between 60° and 70° north latitude-- as far north as Alaska--and has severe winters and relatively short growing seasons that are sometimes interrupted by frosts

.."However, because the Gulf Stream and the North Atlantic Drift Current moderate the climate, Finland contains half of the world's arable land north of 60° north latitude. ... Despite these shortcomings, Finland's agriculture was efficient and productive--at least when compared with farming in other European countries."

let's not forgot tropical fruits aren't the only thing people are supposedly meant to eat; we obviously migrated thousands of years ago beyond the tropics.

About sugar; i read something quite interesting about the difference between america and other european countries, like Germany and France; I definitely had a sneaking suspicion about it too.. SUGAR! it's ALWAYS hidden in some way in food ingredients and always one of the 1st or 2nd or 3rd ingredients..it turns out it makes everything taste better and makes YOU want it more. they even add sugar in restaurants..natural cane syrup, high fructose corn syrup, fructose, glucose, etc. it's in almost all canned and packaged foods here. Even in a box of weet-bix i got from sydney when i was there, it read "RAW SUGAR" literally in huge letters. kind of funny
here's the fun article:
[www.huffingtonpost.com]

jeez. why, america are you so behind! needs to shave it's bush. HA; that would only solve some things unfortunately,

The ONLY time I EVER experienced immediately discernible negative effects from combining fruit and fat, was when I made a GIANT fruit salad with 13 different fruits (I counted, laughing to myself, yelling, "EAT THIS, GABRIEL COUSINS!!!" and 3 types of seeds.

The result? Horrible burps that smelled like rotten eggs for a day. >8)

I had a lot of mental anguish about my raw diet when I realized, in the beginning, I was probably eating 2000+ calories in nuts a day. Now, nearly a year later, I can say, that I am much better now (20% calories from fat, some days 10%!), and no longer feel a need to keep nuts in the house. A gradual reduction of fat intake, patiently and with love over time seems to have lasting effects. =)