Hi durianrider

Thanks for comments (and at the same time can I THANK PAUL for starting the thread in the first place? It's certainly got me thinking over the past few days - it's all fascinating stuff!)

Durianrider, Paul did say he was on a 100% raw diet, and I think we should take that on face value, unless we're VERY sure that's not the case currently. Paul's a good guy and I don't think he would say this if it wasn't so.

But I have noticed that some others who tell people what they should, and shouldn't do on the raw food diet, whether coaches, nutritionists, doctors etc, aren't actually following a raw food diet themselves.

For example, eating lots of fruit could certainly cause problems for those eating cooked food, even if that cooked food is only, say 20% of the diet.

If fruit was eaten within even a few hours of, say, a baked sweet potato, there'd very likely to be indigestion (basic food combining rules - starchy foods +sugar is a no-no). And there might be wind, eg the heavier food still in the stomach, the fruit needing to exit quickly, but can't.. - result fermentation, blow-up, 'fat'(looking) tum, and of course acidity resulting from fermentation (cancer cells love that I've heard). And the more fruit eaten, the worse the discomfort.

Similarly, some/all of those things would happen if one was eating fruit on a diet that included (for example) cooked grains.

So, it's good news to hear that Paul (at least) is on a raw diet.

Also, my own experience is that the more cooked eaten the less fruit will be desired. When I was cooked I rarely desired fruit beyond the odd satsuma. When around 80% raw my fruit consumption rose significantly. But it wasn't until I moved to 100% raw that my body started singing for fruit! Also, I remember that when 80% raw, I still used to get 'fruit tummy' (as explained above) occasionally, and, as I almost never do now, I must put that down to the percentage of cooked food in my diet then (which would have been cooked grains in the form of bread).

The high-raw diet is a fantastic diet, light years ahead of the average in terms of health - I'd be over the moon if a fraction of the people I know outside raw would adopt one. And I can also see why a high-raw diet would 'cure'(note quotes)/'reverse' all sorts of illness, including major, as of course most high-raw diets kick out the worst of the baddies, ie remove some of the major causes of illness.

But, of course, cooked food, and baked root veg, steamed grains, whatever, are still damaged food and as such there will be consequences for the body (if anyone's interested see

debbietookrawforlife.blogspot Jan 27th entry for more).

Even if a person's high-raw diet gives them sufficient vitality to be able to eliminate any toxins created through, eg baking, on a daily basis, this sort of food in the diet must still be having some adverse effects on their body (eg cooking destroys some B vitamins, which means the body has to raid its own reserves, thus...deficiency!)

And someone on this sort of diet will very likely have problems when they start eating lots of fruit, as explained earlier. But it's not the fault of the fruit!

So, as I said, always relevant to check that a fruit-warner is actually following a raw diet themselves, or simply a high-raw diet, which is obviously going to colour their own experiences of fruit-eating in quantity.

'Naul Pison' made a good point - 'don't interrupt others to say it can't be done when they're doing it.'



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2009 02:41PM by debbietook.

debbie,

Thanks for your post. I think we tend to underestimate the chemical impact that just a smidgen of cooked food may have in throwing off a metabolism that might run exceptionally efficiently if no cooked food whatsoever were consumed. It's good to keep this in mind, and I am looking forward to cataloging the results of this in my own journey.

duriandrider,

Are you sure you're talking about the same Paul Nison as we are? You state that he eats cooked food. But Paul Nison is one of the staunchest advocates of 100% fresh, ripe, raw food. That's kind of his mantra, actually If he's gone back to eating anything cooked, I'd be really surprised. BTW, if you're the same Durianrider whose videos I've watched on You Tube, your insights are unique and really valuable. Thanks!

To me .. wether he eats cooked or not it just seems a bit odd that if someone advocates 100% raw .. and starts a thread that says cooked food won't kill you , it just seems hypocritical to me .. ie: I don't eat it .. but its ok IF YOU DO! his message is ok .. his delivery is faulty

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

Paul Nison Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >.......... Below is an article that I highly
> suggest anyone interested in eating a raw food
> diet, or any diet for the matter read. I’ve been
> eating according to these guidelines now for over
> 14 years..........

> INTERNATIONAL LIVING FOOD SUMMIT
> Vibrant Health Through Plant-Based Nutrition
>
> This historic summit was held at the Hippocrates
> Health Institute in West Palm Beach Florida on
> January 14, 2006. The summit convened to unify the
> leadership in the Living Food Movement,
> establishing scientifically based common standards
> for optimum health.
>
> Leaders from eight countries (with a combined
> total of 411 years following this lifestyle)
> agreed on the following standards:
> (Compiled and Organized by Jameth Sheridan, N.D.)
>
> The Optimum Diet for Health/Longevity:
> • Vegan (no animal products of any kind, cooked or
> raw)
> • Organic
> • Whole Foods
> • High in nutrition such as vitamins, antioxidants
> and phytonutrients
> • Highly mineralized
> • Contains a significant quantity of
> chlorophyll-rich green foods
> • Contains adequate complete protein from plant
> sources
> • Contains a large proportion of high-water
> content foods
> • Provides excellent hydration
> • Includes raw vegetable juices
> • Contains all essential fatty acids, including
> Omega 3 fatty acids from
> naturally occurring plant sources
> • Is at least 80% raw (the remaining to be Vegan,
> whole food, and organic)
> • Has moderate, yet adequate caloric intake
> • Contains only low to moderate sugar and
> exclusively from whole food sources (fruitarianism
> is strongly discouraged)
> • Is nutritionally optimal for both detoxification
> and rebuilding
>
> We also agree that:
> • Supplementation with Vitamin B-12 is advised.
> • The addition of enzyme active superfoods and
> whole food supplements is also advised.
> • This way of eating can be further optimized by
> tailoring it based on individual needs (within the
> principles stated).
> • Benefits derived by following these principles
> are proportional to how well they are followed.
> • We will remain open-minded, and this information
> will be updated and expanded upon, if necessary,
> as new research becomes available.
> • Diet is a critical piece of a healthy lifestyle,
> yet not the entire picture. A full spectrum,
> health supportive lifestyle is encouraged. This
> includes physical exercise, exposure to sunshine,
> as well as psychological health. Avoiding
> environmental toxins and toxic products is
> essential. Paramount is pure water (for
> consumption and bathing), the use of natural fiber
> clothing, and non-toxic personal care products.
> Also consider healthy options in home
> furnishings/building materials and related items.
>
> All leaders agree that the main objective of
> eating in the above mentioned fashion is to
> promote health, and equally to prevent and
> minimize disease.
>
> The following leaders support these principles:
> (listed in alphabetical order)
> Solveig Almqvist – Secretary of the Enzyme Swedish
> Living Foods association - Sweden
> Tommy Axelsson – Secretary of the Enzyme Swedish
> Living Foods association - Sweden
> Fred Bisci, PhD – USA
> Tamera Campbell – Vision - USA
> Rajaa Chbani – Pharmacie L’Unite - Morocco
> Gabriel Cousens, MD, MD(H) – Diplomat American
> Board of Holistic Medicine - USA
> Brenda Cobb – Living Foods Institute - USA
> Anna Maria Clement, CN, NMD, PhD – Hippocrates
> Health Institute - USA
> Brian Clement, CN, NMD, PhD – Hippocrates Health
> Institute - USA
> Carole Dougoud – Institute Haute Vitalite -
> Switzerland
> Kare Engstrom – Dietician - Sweden
> Viktoras Kulvinskas – “Grandfather” of the Living
> Foods Movement - USA
> Marie Christine Lhermitte – Chemin du mas Magnuel
> - France
> George Malkmus – Hallelujah Acres - USA
> Rhonda Malkmus – Hallelujah Acres - USA
> Paul Nison – The Raw Life - USA
> Claudine Richard – Naturopath - France
> Michael Saiber – Vision - USA
> Jameth Sheridan, ND – HealthForce Nutritionals -
> USA
> Diana Store – Raw Superfoods – UK/The Netherlands
> Jill Swyers – Living Foods For Health –
> UK/Portugal
> Walter J. Urban, PhD – USA - Costa Rica


For the record, Paul Nison refers to the above statement as an "article".

The last person on the list, Walter J. Urban, refers to the "International
Living Food Summit (of Jan. 14, 2006)" article as a "statement" issued by "the
leadership" in April of 2007 --

"In April 2007, the leadership of the International Living Food Summit issued a
statement on the Optimum Diet for Health and Longevity, returning to the
ancient truth that the body heals itself when given the nutrients it needs."

[www.drwalterurban.com]

Participants, Paul Nison and Walter J. Urban, refer to this as an article or
statement respectively, not "scientifically based common standards".

The only participants, that I could find, that display this article on
their websites are Hippocrates associates.

In conclusion, it seems to me, this is simply an article of Hippocrates,
compiled by Jameth Sheridan of Hippocrates, and issued in April of 2007.

I hope we can all agree that the one great thing we have in common is our love for a raw food vegan diet. That's a huge step, and surely each individual deserves respect for following a raw food diet, regardless of whatever details within that diet are not shared commonly.

I think Paul Nison brings up some good points, but I personally don't agree completely in my own case.

I think lots of good fresh ripe organic fruit can't hurt me (if I brush my teeth and/or rinse appropriately).

I normally do eat lots of fruit, and it usually feels just perfect.

BUT in the past, I've deliberately OVEReaten fruit in an attempt to compensate for craving some other raw food - like nuts, seeds, or greens. I feel that's often a mistake - at least in my case.

I believe fruit is the cleanest and most healing of foods, and - temporarily at least - a fruit-only diet can very quickly bring about absolutely amazing changes in energy and appearance.

This understanding/belief created a dilemma for me in the past, since other raw foods compared to fruit seemed like a downer, and even caused me some physical and emotional grief. Can't live with them, can't live without them. But luckily, I've found solutions to the dilemma that work for me.

I eat much more fruit than suggested by Paul Nison. But at a certain point during any given day - usually BEFORE I've eaten 30 bananas - something is different in my body's reaction to the thought and taste of fruit. That's when I know I've had enough. If I still want to eat, it's time to eat something else.

So I eat some nuts or seeds, or an avocado, or some greens, and maybe even a little raw wheat germ. Then I'm feeling good, my body is getting the nutrients it says it wants, and I can forget about food.

AND, regular exercise plus regularly scheduled intermittent water fasting, plus an occasional longer water fast are CRUCIAL for me, to make up for toxic buildup from raw foods other than fruit. I find water fasting to be a lot easier and more beneficial than monoeating.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Someone mentioned that bananas are an herb, not a fruit. Here's what's up with that: The bananas that we eat are FRUITS. The banana PLANT is an HERB, not a TREE. It can be confusing sometimes when people see bananas referred to as an herb. That reference is to the plant that bananas grow on, not to the fruit itself.

For a reference, click this link, and then click the "suggested" link:

[www.ochef.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2009 02:53AM by suncloud.

And yes, thanks Paul for bringing this up.

Fruits, greens, and/or nuts/seeds.

I go for all three, whenever they feel right. Plus sufficient exercise and fasting. This is my conclusion after decades of being raw food vegan, and living sustainably on my own organic farm.

But of course, I'm still learning and hopefully have a long way to go!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2009 03:11AM by suncloud.

I think most of what they are saying is pretty reasonable. Except I don't buy the limit fruit bit. If you don't get your calories from fruit, you have to get them from one or more of

protein
fat
starch
alcohol.

I'm not convinced that excess protein is a good thing.

I'm not convinced that extra fat is a good thing.

I'm not convinced that starch is necessary, starch sources are sating but they tend to be not so nutrient- and phytochemical-dense.

We all know alcohol is just empty calories.

I don't see any problem with fruit per se as long as vitamin, mineral, amino acid, and essential fatty acid requirements are met, in fact I think it's probably the best of the five possibly choices for calories after one's requirements are met. But I guess that's the real problem: some people who eat only or mostly fruit are not meeting their basic requirements.

It seems to me that what arugula says is true.

makes sense to me

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist