The problem with E3 Live, is that its klamath lake algae, which has shown to contain toxic microcystins which can cause liver and nervous system damage. That isnt the only toxic compound it contains either sadly.

Should not local food be enough for survival?

Thrive and survive are different states of being. One may be fine for some but others may be after something else.

Is there some truth to the statement that klamath lake contain some toxic microcystins? Or people are just making statements?

Depends who you ask I guess and who you want to believe.


Seems a lot of people have report they felt great on it and all kinds of good things.. so why would they believe there's something toxic in it?

Thanks for the info. I prefer local food, go to the next block, buy your greens organic or not and juice them, and eat fruit. Life is simple.

Prana Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I live in northern California, which isn't that
> far from Klamath lake in Oregon. Around here, in
> all the rivers, the health officials post warning
> about not letting your dogs swim in the river when
> the blue green algae is ripe, as ingesting this
> stuff will make your dog sick and possibly kill
> your dog.


I saw the signs when I was there too...this stuff is toxic, and I just realized, that we used to live really close...lol

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh, mirror in the sky
What is love?
Can the child within my heart rise above?
Can I sail through the changing ocean tides?
Can I handle the seasons of my life?

Most people are so focused on the nutrients, the most important thing is getting the body to assimilate the nutrients, our local ordinary foods have enough nutrients, we are actually overloaded with nutrients, the problem is that they are not getting assimilated, so here less is actually better, simple food, avoid mixing to many food items, eat less, fast regulary, give your system a rest.

You do not need E3 Live, and all the exotic produces from Brazil, go to your local food market and get yourself some mangoes, apples, oranges, and enjoy life

Mangoes and oranges are exotics.

Most produce grown today is nutritionally inferior due to poor soil quality. Supplementing either with concentrated food stuffs (juice, dehydrated powders etc) is a good whole food option for those who want it.

dehydrated powders have very poor nutritional values, for one thing they do not have the organic water we have in natural fresh produce, another is that being concentrated is the problem, you are overloading your system with nutrients of one type. Nutrition is not complicated.

Water is easy to get, easy to filter with a good unit, easy to remineralize if you feel it neccessary. Lots of minerals and vitamins are water soluble and are easily eliminated in the urine if taken in in excess. Nutrition is complicated, especially considering how things are grown these day and the added burden of accumulated toxins in the body and a chronic lack of physical activity in many people that hinders absorption. I think concentrated foods are useful whether they be juice or dehydrated foods.

RawPracticalist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dehydrated powders have very poor nutritional
> values, for one thing they do not have the organic
> water we have in natural fresh produce, another is
> that being concentrated is the problem, you are
> overloading your system with nutrients of one
> type. Nutrition is not complicated.

If i want water ill take a sip or 9 of water that makes no difference to anything.

You want to consume something either for its nutritional content or its phyto-nutrient/unique alkaloid composition. Water content shouldn't even enter the equation.

> And as for that it's toxic.. i don't know anything
> abotu that and would like to know. especially why
> many raw foodists swear by it even though it's
> toxic.

That brings me to another question - Why are raw foodists swearing by it and feeling great on it? Raw foodists tend to be the most sensitive to anything and everything once they clean their system up. People whose bodies know the difference between organic produce and non-organic, who get dizzy and headaches from eating a non-raw meal... yet when taking E3 live they are feeling great. How can something "toxic" not make them feel sick or off balance like an apple coated in pesticides and wax would?

Alot of the sensitive feelings are purely psychological and placebo in my opinion that people feel because they've ate a cracker or something.

Dont get me wrong it does have nutrition and beneficial compounds but it also has a few toxins which can be very potent and damage the liver and nervous system which makes it worth avoiding.

BackAgain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > And as for that it's toxic.. i don't know
> anything
> > abotu that and would like to know. especially
> why
> > many raw foodists swear by it even though it's
> > toxic.
>
> That brings me to another question - Why are raw
> foodists swearing by it and feeling great on it?
> Raw foodists tend to be the most sensitive to
> anything and everything once they clean their
> system up. People whose bodies know the
> difference between organic produce and
> non-organic, who get dizzy and headaches from
> eating a non-raw meal... yet when taking E3 live
> they are feeling great. How can something "toxic"
> not make them feel sick or off balance like an
> apple coated in pesticides and wax would?

The big problem with some raw foodists is they are under nourished. They think that the big thing is being vegan and eating organic, that is totally wrong. I go to the health store to buy wheat berries for growing wheat grass (actually that is the only thing I buy there), I see what most are buying, organic beans, organic kale or spinach, there is nothing wrong with organic, it is just that the store does not supply enough of the organic produce and because of the price, most people will buy a pound or two for a week.

The most important requirement is to have the food raw, LIVING, AND FRESH. Those who are into growing indoor greens or have there own garden to get fresh raw produce are very healthy, those who wait once a week to go the health food store to buy few organic produce and eat beans are not.

When you are living on living and fresh produce and supply yourself with b12 naturally, your body will be very healthy and resilient, eating grandma's cooked meal at a visit or two will not get you sick, your body is resilient.
You cannot get a resilient body on eating 30 bananas a day.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2011 12:39PM by madinah.

While I do agree with eating an abundance of a variety of foods I also think that taking concentrated food sources like juice and dehydrated whole foods, herbs etc is perfectly acceptable. If it nourishes you, heals you, supports you and makes you feel good than it's a good thing.

Your body does not supply itself with B12, this is a fallacy. While there can be B12 produced in the lower intestine it is not usable, it's doing a job in that location that is different than that from a dietary source. Eat foods with B12 or supplement, B12 deficiency is quite serious.

powerlifer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RawPracticalist Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > dehydrated powders have very poor nutritional
> > values, for one thing they do not have the
> organic
> > water we have in natural fresh produce, another
> is
> > that being concentrated is the problem, you are
> > overloading your system with nutrients of one
> > type. Nutrition is not complicated.
>
> If i want water ill take a sip or 9 of water that
> makes no difference to anything.
>
> You want to consume something either for its
> nutritional content or its phyto-nutrient/unique
> alkaloid composition. Water content shouldn't even
> enter the equation.


Water content IS THE EQUATION
Getting water from the food itself is not the same as drinking water after eating the food dried. Water in a tomato or mango is in natural equilibrium with the nutrients and vitamins of that food. It is organic, natural, is about 80 percent of that food. It is the equation.

RP i never seen your post but that is bunk in my opinion, water is water, doesn't matter if its a natural part of a plant its the same thing there's nothing special about it.

Its much appreciated to a large part of society as they often don't drink any water and drink dehydrating beverages so dehydration is a common issue. But for most that live healthy lives they drink water.

If anyone is relying on the fruits and vegetables to hydrate themselves then id say that was an issue. I know your going to tell me water isnt necessary and we can get all the water we need from food but to me that is wishy washy again.

Hydration, especially if exercising is very important and ill drink a good few litres of water a day.

Its also only organic if the fruit/vegetable was grown organic, really it makes little difference if you take a sip of water from a good source or are getting your water from your produce which definitely isn't enough to keep your hydrated unless your eating massive amounts of water rich produce.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/12/2011 06:58PM by powerlifer.

THeSt0rm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> well some people think you can get b12 from algae
> and seaweeds. even grass juice/powder.


These are analogues, they are not true usable B12 and are suspected of even interfering with actual B12 absorption.

THeSt0rm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> well changing the water content of a food by
> dehydrating it changes the way it is digested.
> Some people recommend keeping the water content of
> some foods, especially for digestion.
>
> I'd say it's just different.
>
> Also the water that is in the food, is much more
> charged and highly structured.

This is partially true, but what makes the water content so different in being charged and structured, its just water.

powerlifer my dear raw friend, water is not just water.
The reason why beans, dried grains are not good foods is that they have lost there organic water content during the drying process.
Eating them dried and drink water afterward to compensate will never equal the health benefits of eating them in thier original raw state.
We are 80 percent water at a mininum. That is why dried powder superfoods have little nutritional values, the body has to take water from itself to digest the food.

Water is water though and yes to hydrate yourself eating a water rich fruit/vegetable is going to be better than eating a dried berries, beans etc.

But you really shouldn't be relying on the water content of your food as a means to hydrate oneself. It is merely a bonus and means you can consume less water overall.

Are you telling me you dont drink water now and solely rely on your food to hydrate you?

Many dried herbs and powders have similar nutrition, infact if you bring concentrates and extracts into the equation they often have more. Im not saying rely on these either, food always comes first. Most of these supplements are either as they name suggests a supplement to an already sound diet or to specifically aid a certain problem.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2011 04:14PM by powerlifer.

Eating is drinking. I do not eat foods that are not at least 80 percent water content. If you eat dried foods, the body borrows water from the cells, process the food, and then later when you drink, the body has to process the water and redistribute it, that is more work.
I do drink simple water, but not as much, my body has enough organic water already. Animals in the wild feeding on raw foods do drink but not has much as our domesticated dogs and cats eating dried foods.

That is not entirely true, yeah water is a part of digestion but it is in my opinion one of the least important.

There is far far more to digestion than water such as enzymes, stomach acid, bile and so on. Its good that you choose high water foods but someone who adds in a little dried fruits, beans or powder isn't going to have any problems and you should be drinking a decent amount of water daily regardless to aid in the flushing of waste/toxins.

Animals in the wilds can go for 2 or 3 days without drinking water, they get the water from the foods they eat. They search for water once or twice a week. How often do we humans drink PER DAY?
Most of the water we need should come from the food we eat.

We aren't animals though i don't want to get into this whole theory again. Many mammals can make there own ascorbic acid supply, why cant we should we stop eating vitamin C rich foods course not.

We are not animals what they do bears very very little resemblance to how we should live. Many animals can take in an arsenic level that would kill a human should we take in arsenic levels also because they can.

The whole animals did this and we don't has been done a hundred times.

The requirements that humans should drink 8 glasses of water a day has no scientific basis. What is important is drinking fluid which could just be juices or eating high water content foods. [ajpregu.physiology.org]

RawPracticialist you are comparing apples and oranges when comparing us (humans) to animals.

wild animals are subjected to wild conditions .. humans are not

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

Humans and animals pretty much eat the same foods except that we have denatured ours thru cooking. Animal behaviour provide the natural state we have lost, we have nowhere else to go in looking back. Millions of dollars are spent by scientists to study animal behavour so they can better understand our own. Rawfoodists use the we-are-not-animals argument to support their unhealthy eating habits.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/14/2011 03:21PM by RawPracticalist.

RawPracticalist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Humans and animals pretty much eat the same foods
> except that we have denatured ours thru cooking.
> Animal behaviour provide the natural state we have
> lost, we have nowhere else to go in looking back.
> Millions of dollars are spent by scientists to
> study animal behavour so they can better
> understand our own. Rawfoodists use the
> we-are-not-animals argument to support their
> unhealthy eating habits.

Completely untrue, most of what ive seen some raw foodists use it as an excuse for there theories or justification on why they consider certain healthy foods unhealthy.

Animals will eat insects, excrement and other dead animals and to most around here that certainly is not a natural practice.