CherieRaw Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't take b12 but I also am not sure I'm
> completely doing it right.. Well every morning I
> have barley and sunflower seeds that have the
> whole b complex as well as berry's I also eat that
> with corn or cashews because the tryptophan in the
> corn and cashews is essential for B vitamin
> digestion. I also take the raw vitamin by garden
> of life that had vitamin B12 in it as well.


Wrong! B-12 is also in fresh water algae and nutritional yeast etc.

rzman, I think that's incorrect.

Fresh water algae is not a reliable source of B12. Some algaes test positive for B12, but instead actually have B12 analogs, which are similar to B12 but function to block B12 absorption.

Nutritional yeast has B12 if it's enriched with B12. Red Star sells both the B12-enriched yeast and the non-enriched yeast. Anyone who depends on nutritional yeast as a B12 source should check to make sure it's enriched. If it's purchased from the bin, ask the retailer.

Nutritional yeast is not a raw food.

Wheatgrass supplies b-12!!!

Much peace and love!!!
EarthAngel
Xoxo

Well, Earthangel, I kind of don't think that's correct, at least not in reliable amounts. (sorry)

Correct suncloud, they b12 analogs found in plant foods are useless and are thought to interfere with actual vitamin b12 absorption.

[www.vegankingdom.co.uk]

Hey Powerlifer, maybe you know? Do all sea vegetables and algaes contain b12 analogues? Many sea vegetables like kelp and irish moss are quite nutritious and usefull foods, it would seem a shame if these foods do help block b12 absorption.??

They did a study with all of the raw foods here at optimum health institute to see what the vitamin and mineral levels were, and in a 4 ounce shot of wheatgrass you are supplied with 4 mcg of b12 and the daily recommended for optimum functioning in 99% of the charts in both the holistic aspect and western medicine is 2.4 mcg so if you have a 3 oz shot of wheatgrass daily you exceed your daily intake!! Sounds like a great source!!! It also provides you with 12 amino acids!!!! Dulce also tested for b 12 at a rate of 1.87 mcg per ounce! Nori sheets tested at 2.8 mcg a sheet!! Out of 59 major staple foods in the raw vegan detox Program, including sprouts, seeds, fruits and veggies these 3 things were the only ones to test for b 12!
It was really great to read the different sources of vit and minerals in our food!!! I can send copies to anyone who would be interested!!!

Much peace and love!!!
EarthAngel
Xoxo

Was the wheatgrass grown in composted soil? Or rich organic soil of some sort? That is the only way it would be possible for it to have that level of b12

I personally appreciate earthangel, that your heart is in the right place on this, but I have a hunch that the foods were not tested according to accepted standards.

This is from the article "What Every Vegan Should Know About Vitamin B12", by Dr. Stephen Walsh, Chair of the UK Vegan Society, and Science Coordinator of the International Vegetarian Union:

"Reports that B12 has been measured in a food are not enough to qualify that food as a reliable B12 source. It is difficult to distinguish true B12 from analogues that can disrupt B12 metabolism. Even if true B12 is present in a food, it may be rendered ineffective if analogues are present in comparable amounts to the true B12. There is only one reliable test for a B12 source – does it consistently prevent and correct deficiency? Anyone proposing a particular food as a B12 source should be challenged to present such evidence."

[www.veganhealth.org]

I would advise anybody with interest in this topic to read the entire article, and also note the list of endorsers. Then compare the information with what you may have been told from other sources.

Below is an article that discusses the various methods for testing B12:

(Notice that the "Gold Standard" test is Methyl Malonic Acid [MMA] reduction. If human MMA levels are consistently lowered after a regimen of consuming a new food introduced to the diet, this is the most reliable indicator of the presence of active, bioavailable B12 in that food. When hearing of vegan plant sources for B12, check to see what testing procedure was followed.)

[www.veganhealth.org]

Even if reduction in human MMA levels were determined using the proper testing procedure, that's still not enough to establish reliable cause and effect.

According to the above article:

"Because some bacteria produce B12 and might live in the growing medium or contaminate some foods (e.g., see section on tempeh) it is not enough simply to test a food one time to see if it reduces MMA levels. Numerous batches of the food from various regions, using various preparation methods, should be tested to make sure the B12 is consistently found in the food."

The report from the 35th World Vegetarian Congress (2002) states that wheat grass has "no demonstrated or likely effect" as a vegan source of B12. Nori has an "adverse effect if dried; neutral effect if raw".

[www.scienzavegetariana.it]

(sorry)

Earthangel, I will send you a pm with my address. If the wheat grass etc. was tested according to the standard described above, I would certainly be interested in reading about it. Thanks!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2011 01:20AM by suncloud.

Yes to answer your question the wheatgrass is grown in composted soils, but of only purely organic vegetables that are part of the detox prOgram! All food served is food grown on the grounds in an organic state! So possibly that is why it is testing high for b 12, the dulce and fresh nori are actually from frontier, and not from here, as it must be harvested !
Suncloud I will find out how it was tested and let you know and of course get the info!!!! I am by no means am e pert or even making claims, I was merely sharing documents from a typically very reliable institution!

Much peace and love!!!
EarthAngel
Xoxo

Thanks earthangel! I understand what you're saying, and totally respect your input on the issue.

Great info guys, I have had much nerve damage from an injury to my digestive tract, so I know a bit about the subject, not technically but from true experience. I like to refer to Brian Clements writting for a bit of insight. The main thing he points out is that he and his wife have tested very well for B-12 and they have been vegans for years. This is the reason that they tested well in my opinion and in his. Over the years their bodys have become very healthy again. Of coarse most the other people they tested had deficencies, don't quote me go read the info. I am certianly not remembering the numbers or the details. Once you start a raw diet you should suppliment unless you are very healthy which most of us are not. He also stated that the best and only test is one that tests urine, not blood. Serium levels of B-12 are not the best way to measure what is actually in your cells and thats what they use test for with your blood. Another point is that he says that the H.H.I. B-12 at the time is the only living B-12 available in North America or somthing. I am not computer savy or I would import a link. Aliveraw.com then just do a search. You could also go to Questions and Answers, or Articles. I have so much nerve damage that it is hard to type so I am done now. In ending none of us should claim that we know anything about B12 even Brian Clement and other researcher don't know some of the things I know about the situation. I surely dont believe that a healthy vegan will suffer B12 deficiency, it's just not common sense or logical. G.O.L. does make a raw b12 now I believe.

I tried to edit my last post but ran out of time, so here is my last thought.


The thing I don't believe is that the liver stores B-12 for you to use when you are low. I wasn't a vegan or a vegetarian but when I had my injury I had nerve damage within two weeks with no liver problems. And I don't believe the daily amounts posted as 3mcg or something. I.M.O. the body needs this amount in the blood stream at all times not just for an hour. The body clearly uses up b-12 like anything else and needs to be replentished constantly, therefore 3mcg is bull in my opinion. The people saying this are researchers and are not even using common sense. Common people I am practically brain dead from so much nerve damage and it still doesnt make any sense to me. Lets use some common sense people, if you have a healthy G.I. tract and eat really good raw food, water, probiotics etc. you should be good. Some of the most hard core Raw-Foodists are the worst off, they are sick and don't know it. The diet helps their conditions but they still eat to much fruit for their fungus and pathogen infested immune defiecient bodies! It's best to suppliment and test yourself of coarse but getting a proper b12 is the biggest issue to me. The H.H.I. b12 is a bacteria and it will help propigate more b12 in you.

What kind of injury did you have?

WorkoutMan Wrote:
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> What kind of injury did you have?

I had leaky gut and did'nt know it. For a long time I did not feel the best and never could figure it out. When it got really bad I moved to south florida to seek more knowlegable Wholistic Doctors. Then I started to get better but still my doctor did not know how thin my gut linning was, and did'nt have a clue that I had leaky gut. He also wasnt properly familiar with leaky gut. After taking advice from another healer I started to get better very fast. As I was getting better and felt amazing I took some Powdered Green Food and then Psyllium Husk Powder and had a severe reaction. I would never had done this but I was under a lot of stress living in my mothers home,especially at that moment. Usually I would take major suppliments apart. Anyhow, I don't suggest taking Psyllium husk with anything and have read articles since that back this statement up. Then I experienced much burning heartburn and could feel it going through my small intestine, it hurt on the way out also, lol. I was out of my element and in a house that was what caused me these issues to start with and did'nt listen to my gut! After a week or two I started to have a hard time walking, hands were shakey and was very nervous. I figured it out immediately and started taking sublingual B-12 And the story goes on, I will talk later about it if any are intrested.

I'm not completely convinced we need to supplement with B-12, however I've decide that I likely will do so anyhow now that the B-12 Patch is available because you only need to use it once a wk & it barely takes up any room like supplements normally do. Also, supposedly this is the best form/source to use. I still will likely skip using it for periods of time. My main concern is I've always had issues with absorbing nutrients (which has caused huge issues) so likely I will always supplement on and off with good quality products.

Simple Raw Recipes & Health Tips

Wow! 2500mcg? Mine says only 250mcg. I wonder if I'm not getting enough.

My video to keep me inspired on my health quest: [www.youtube.com]

i work for a major natural foods grocery store and i can tell you there is most definitly a raw vegan source for b12. i guess i can't mention brand names here but if you just do a little research on the net you will find it.

Brian Clement (don't get me wrong, I admire the guy) recommends a LOT of supplements that I'm sure he also takes himself. Just saying...

I think we are missing something here? With my limited comprehension, it seems to me that a person needs a good living-foods source of cobalt! this is what helps senthysize B12 in the gut. I believe this is why Brian Clement promotes the use of algae's and wheatgrass, and has said so in some of his lectures and writings. Please tell me have'nt some of you read the same thing. Eat Raw Live Long.