-----
[www.healthline.com]

Glucose is the source of energy for all of our body functions, especially the brain. The only energy the brain can use is from glucose. Glucose is also the primary source of energy for muscles, backed up by other sources if it runs out. Proteins, for example, are for building the tissues that use glucose. Fat is a storage depot as backup for when glucose runs out—however, in the case of excess glucose, fat storage remains high.

---------
[www.livestrong.com]

The human body stores energy in two ways -- as fat, and as a carbohydrate called glycogen. While most of the energy stored in the body is stored as fat, glucose is so important to normal function that the liver and muscle cells store a certain amount of it for times during which blood glucose levels begin to run low. Note Garrett and Grisham, without glucose, the body can't store glycogen. This leads to fatigue and muscle weakness.
--------------

[www.extension.iastate.edu]

Carbohydrate spares the use of protein as an energy source. When carbohydrate consumption is inadequate, protein is broken down to make glucose to maintain a constant blood glucose level. However, when proteins are broken down they lose their primary role as building blocks for muscles. In addition, protein breakdown may result in an increased stress on the kidneys, where protein byproducts are excreted into the urine.
--------------


so if the brain uses 120g glucose and one ingests 500g carbs, that leaves 380 carbs for the body to use. Can anyone show (besides just exclaiming that's too much sugar!!!) that the body cannot handle that, and in fact all of those non"sugar" foods eaten need to for the most part be converted to sugar to fuel the body anyway?

[www.ttobey.com]


"In non-diabetic individuals, an average sized person will produce about 35 units of insulin per day in total. This means that there is a small but continuous supply of insulin secreted by the pancreas 24 hours per day, which turns out to be about ¾ unit of insulin per hour. This totals about 18 units of insulin per day. The other 17 units of insulin are released at mealtimes and with snacks. This would be about 5 units of insulin with each meal and a couple of units of insulin with snacks. The amounts could be larger or smaller based upon meal size"


So assuming 20g carbs needs 1 unit insulin ...of course this varies and is for demo purposes, that's 120g carbs for each of 3meals, 6 units per meal. Plus the baseline insulin released.

Therefore the yelling about too much sugar seems unfounded. Of course it could be a problem with large smoothies but I don't see a reason to draw any firm conclusions ...

Dry mouth and other symptoms or bs monitoring would provide more evidence but again it seems within reason to me, and does not warrant fruit bashing, but feel free to provide evidence.

Yes, l have been long searching for a strong sugar argument to put in my `fruit is bad' files to compile a super strong argument discouraging the practise of eating large amounts of fruit, but l have been unable to find a strong scientific argument against the sugar in fruit to put the final nail in the coffin lol.

Even yesterday l brought up the issue with a smart doctor and he couldn't provide me with one either. I thought l was about to stumble onto something BIG when he spoke about sugar and cancer and fruitarians, and I thought he might have had a nice little study in his bag, but alas, it was the same old stuff...only extracted fruit sugars.

I've tried and tried to find info on the dark side of consuming lots of sugar from fruit, but all l come up with is studies on fruit sugar extracts and unreferenced studies.

If l can find one single strong study l will pounce on it immediately.

Why l look for info on the dark side of eating lots of fruit is because l am convinced that eating poor nutrition non fresh post harvest food high in calories is not the way to go. A strong sugar argument would make my case extra potent hehe.


Note: of course l say the above message with an element of cheek and humour.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/29/2014 05:03AM by The Sproutarian Man.

aha, so "non fresh post harvest food *low* in calories" is ok.

how about this, the Okinawans eat low fat,salt, and SUGAR !

I loved the 90 year old climbing the tree (vid from panchito) - awesome...

"how about this, the Okinawans eat low fat,salt, and SUGAR !"

I don't think they eat lots of sugar. From my knowledge they eat vegetables, whole grains, purple sweet potatoes, soy, seaweed, and a little bit of animal foods.

No I meant low fat low salt and low sugar.
is what the vid said.

thereby supporting tsm and yourself

Such studies, if they even exist, will be very difficult to locate because the scientific community prefers to study isolated variables. If they want to study glucose, they will unfortunately isolate glucose and study it. I'm not so sure the evidence exists, not because it isn't real, but merely because of the way studies are done.

However, here's an interesting case study of a child raised on a strict raw fruit and vegetable diet:

Malnutrition in infants receiving cult diets: a form of child abuse

Summary: A thirteen month old child that was raised only on breast milk, raw fruits and raw vegetables had severe protein deficiency (kwashiorkor), severe anemia, osteoporosis and no detectable levels of b12. When he was switched to cooked foods his health rapidly improved.
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

Note: Nutritionists who knew the family say that the child was raised on a "fruitarian" diet.
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

Now, this study doesn't prove anything (there could be many variables that weren't discussed), but it is good to be aware of possible complications.

Living Food Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> However, here's an interesting case study of a
> child raised on a strict raw fruit and vegetable
> diet:
>
> Malnutrition in infants receiving cult diets: a
> form of child abuse
>
> Summary: A thirteen month old child that was
> raised only on breast milk, raw fruits and raw
> vegetables had severe protein deficiency
> (kwashiorkor), severe anemia, osteoporosis and no
> detectable levels of b12. When he was switched to
> cooked foods his health rapidly improved.
> [www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]
> 4/pdf/brmedj00058-0014.pdf
>
> Note: Nutritionists who knew the family say that
> the child was raised on a "fruitarian" diet.
> [www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]
> 4/pdf/brmedj00063-0050d.pdf
>

EXCELLENT!!!

People greatly underestimate the potential downside of an all raw vegan diet. This is a wake-up call that just because a diet is raw, it doesn't mean it is good. It is often the same when struggling raw vegans eat cooked food, their health improves.

Ideally...l don't think you should eat cooked foods, but to do it successfully, things need to be done well, and l wouldn't recommend most people go 100% raw because it is tough to make it work. I wouldn't recommend most people go 100% vegan either, unless they are prepared to work hard at the diet and make it their life.

Raw foods can cause a lot of problems, but most people will never talk about that. People need to build the body up to get it into a condition where they can handle the raw foods...this can take years. If you don't build the body up and digest those raw foods properly you can end up shortening your life through starvation.

I tell people this stuff all the time so they know what they are getting themselves into. If you can get it to a point where the body can thrive off raw foods and sustain, WOW. But many people are not able to do that because they follow all these raw food leaders on the internet who promote silly ideas that don't make any sense. We have such poor teachers that us raw vegans are well behind the eight ball before we even start.

It's time to throw out much of the garbage we were taught and start again. And it's time to throw away the gurus with big egos and start think tanks with people who study the science, use common sense and are open to discussing ideas without being defensive. I recently made a suggestion to some raw food leaders to get togeather and discuss things without trying to be heros trying to be right..just to discuss the science, common sense and try to move forward. These discussions would not include Dr Clement or David Wolfe or Dr Jubb...because those folks always want to come across as being right. We want people who are humble and are prepared to listen to others ideas and consider them. We want people who don't want to be right at all costs. We want people who are happy to be proven wrong in public and are happy consider other ideas. I want to have a recorded discussion where we discuss ideas, and l want a certain science person there to bust our heads when we stray into pseudoscience....heir can keep us on the straight and narrow.

I am sick of people trying to be heros...less and less of us are fooled by that act anymore. Lets just be real people and admit we don't know much. And lets try to combine our brains to come up with good ideas instead of people fighting them to fluff up their own beloved theories. If you talk to certain raw food leaders right, they will admit they don't know much and they become open to listening and considering new ideas. The leaders take down their barriers and become humble....they tell you what they do know and what they don't know. In most cases it is what we don't know. And if we don't keep an open but critical mind, we will never know much of anything. That's why so many raw food leaders are dumbed down...they don't want to listen to anything outside of their comfort zone regardless of what the science and failures of their diets around them.

Sometimes we need to play the role of a child and regular dumb dumb and just listen to what people have to say. I do it all the time when l come across someone with good knowledge. Don't try to prove to raw gurus how much you know to impress them...tell them how much you don't know.I've been playing the roll of a baby for the last 4 weeks and have learned HEAPS of stuff. Being a baby can be good stuff, reeeely good stuff.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/29/2014 09:15PM by The Sproutarian Man.

Summary: A thirteen month old child that was
> raised only on breast milk, raw fruits and raw
> vegetables had severe protein deficiency
> (kwashiorkor), severe anemia, osteoporosis and no
> detectable levels of b12.

very misleading.

b12 deficiency is primary and can cause the others, as it impacts all aspects of metabolism.

to say "protein deficiency" is misleading. b12 problem, causing other problems like protein deficiency.

oh no! The world is doomed


people die from eating greens

[www.huffingtonpost.com]


people die from eating sprouts

[www.cnn.com]


people can die from eating plants

[en.wikipedia.org]


Yeap, I eat helthy to die



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/30/2014 01:33AM by Panchito.

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> oh no! The world is doomed
>
>
> people die from eating greens
>
> [www.huffingtonpost.com]
> oses-on-brussels_n_2347448.html
>

I wonder if this was the man who overdosed on the brussels sprouts
[www.youtube.com]