"then you change your story and add in the word moderate. you don't need a huge dose for damage."


I never changed my story. Prove that you don't need a huge dose for damage.

[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov] - "At low concentrations, allicin was not toxic to either sporozoites or mammalian cells."

"but i don't make up medicinal justifications for it."

The benefits of garlic are far from made up - the studies I posted are just a fraction of what's out there.

"constantly eating things over time that desensitize one's digestive system is what i was talking about."

I just recently started eating it consistently and have never had any digestive troubles. Perhaps the garlic was giving you detox symptoms from killing off some form of unhealthy bacteria in your gut.

"the disregard of normal bodily processes and implication of the necessity of garlic."

Once again, something does not need to be necessary in order to be beneficial.

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "then you change your story and add in the word
> moderate. you don't need a huge dose for damage."
>
>
> I never changed my story. Prove that you don't
> need a huge dose for damage.
>

i provided several references indicating the effects of allicin from reputable sources.

your original statement was for me to show that it damages HEALTHY cells.

that is what i showed.

i do not need to show a pubmed study.

then you change to "moderate"

then you change to my word "huge"

so you're always moving the goalposts, which is why it's pointless to engage with your ever changing requirements, and how you maintain the illusion of your unending need for "rightness".

> [www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov] - "At
> low concentrations, allicin was not toxic to
> either sporozoites or mammalian cells."
>

this study is irrelevant. depends on their definition of toxic.


> "but i don't make up medicinal justifications for
> it."
>
> The benefits of garlic are far from made up - the
> studies I posted are just a fraction of what's out
> there.
>

we have been through this before.

there are studies for anything.

many things have "effects"

you do not consider what the body is already doing.
you always look to outside agents.

i do not.

we are both permitted to do what we do and there's no point in continuing to talk in different languages.

> "constantly eating things over time that
> desensitize one's digestive system is what i was
> talking about."
>
> I just recently started eating it consistently and
> have never had any digestive troubles. Perhaps the
> garlic was giving you detox symptoms from killing

very funny. among other effects, anal irritation clearly associated with garlic ingestion, testing multiple times, has nothing to do with detox. nice try though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2015 04:57PM by fresh.

"so you're always moving the goalposts, which is why it's pointless to engage with your ever changing requirements, and how you maintain the illusion of your unending need for "rightness"."

Confrontational yet again for no reason.

"your original statement was for me to show that it damages HEALTHY cells."

Yeah, and my second statement was for you to provide the dosage required in order to damage healthy cells. Too much oxygen can damage healthy cells. And on second glance, you really didn't provide any evidence that it damages healthy cells - your source was from a textbook and didn't reference any studies.

"you do not consider what the body is already doing.
you always look to outside agents."

The body alone isn't always enough to save you, and just because the body is always attempting to heal doesn't mean outside remedies do not heal.

"among other effects, anal irritation clearly associated with garlic ingestion, testing multiple times, has nothing to do with detox."

And I never experience anything negative from garlic except garlic breath, same with many others. There could be various reasons you do that have nothing to do with you just being more sensitive.

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "so you're always moving the goalposts, which is
> why it's pointless to engage with your ever
> changing requirements, and how you maintain the
> illusion of your unending need for "rightness"."
>
> Confrontational yet again for no reason.
>

the reason is quite clear.

> "your original statement was for me to show that
> it damages HEALTHY cells."
>
> Yeah, and my second statement

your second statement is an indication of your refusal to acknowledge the evidence answering your first statement. then you come up with a 2nd statement, then a 3rd and 4th statement, etc.

was for you to
> provide the dosage required in order to damage
> healthy cells.

how do i know the dosage? too many variables.

Too much oxygen can damage healthy
> cells.

more irrelevance.

And on second glance, you really didn't
> provide any evidence that it damages healthy cells
> - your source was from a textbook and didn't
> reference any studies.
>

studies are not the be all end all as i have already stated.

go drink some hydrochloric acid. i can find a study that shows that it kills cancer cells.


> "you do not consider what the body is already
> doing.
> you always look to outside agents."
>
> The body alone isn't always enough to save you,
> and just because the body is always attempting to
> heal doesn't mean outside remedies do not heal.
>

as powerlifter rightly told you, you tend to play doctor here, leading people in directions without considering side effects, necessity of intervention, or anything else. all you do is find a study, then prescribe. "everyone should take garlic every day" . i say your advice is wrong and can be very injurious, but people here are of course free to accept or reject. most here accept, as it aligns with the medical model that is ingrained.




> "among other effects, anal irritation clearly
> associated with garlic ingestion, testing multiple
> times, has nothing to do with detox."
>
> And I never experience anything negative from
> garlic except garlic breath, same with many
> others. There could be various reasons you do that
> have nothing to do with you just being more
> sensitive.

your junk food/drug past is a more likely reason for your lack of reaction, as well as the many stimulating/irritating elements that you ingest that desensitize you.

"the reason is quite clear."

Mental instability? Anger? Irritability?

"your second statement is an indication of your refusal to acknowledge the evidence answering your first statement."

Not even close lol - it's an indication of wanting specific details. Anything can be considered toxic at a high enough dose. For example, if it takes eating 10 pounds of garlic in one sitting to damage healthy cells, it obviously has zero relevance to any human being, though it can still be technically "toxic".

"studies are not the be all end all as i have already stated."

And you have no evidence that allicin is toxic outside of a textbook you haven't read and have no clue about how they came to their conclusion.

"you tend to play doctor here"

Once again not even close but I understand that is your never-ending false perception. I've had many people thank me for offering advice that has helped them and I'm certainly not going to stop offering remedies because it ruffles the feathers of a few people who have some type of personal issue with myself for whatever reason (jealousy, different views, etc.).

"your junk food/drug past is a more likely reason for your lack of reaction, as well as the many stimulating/irritating elements that you ingest that desensitize you."

Lol sounds like a bunch of garbage-talk and a made-up version of events based on unscientific N.H. philosophy. I don't think smoking marijuana would make someone insensitive to garlic, especially when there are other things that have stimulated my digestion. I don't ingest anything irritating or stimulating, except raw cacao sometimes.



[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov] - "The influence of garlic extract on the chronic toxicity test were examined orally in Wistar rats for 6 months. There were no toxic symptoms due to garlic extract even at dose level of 2000 mg/kg for 5 times a week during 6 months. High dose of garlic extract did not inhibit the body weight gain, while the food consumption decreased slightly for the nutritional effects of it in both male and female rats. There were no significant differences in urinary, hematological and serological examinations compared each groups. In the histopathological findings, no toxic signs were observed on any of the tissues and organs examined."

> Once again not even close but I understand that is your never-ending false perception. I've had many people thank me for offering advice that has helped them and I'm certainly not going to stop offering remedies because it ruffles the feathers of a few people who have some type of personal issue with myself for whatever reason (jealousy, different views, etc.).

Lol no ones jealous of you here, just thought I'd throw that out there.
It's great you've helped people. But Fresh is trying to offer you insight
and be helpful as well and you've thanked them by calling them names such as:

> Mental instability? Anger? Irritability?

Many herbs in general that are deemed as having "medicinal qualities",
have research opposing claiming they are toxic.

It is an interesting concept to think about.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2015 06:35PM by Exeggutor.

"Lol no ones jealous of you here, just thought I'd throw that out there."

Like you would even know.

"But Fresh is trying to offer you insight
and be helpful as well and you've thanked them by calling them names such as:"

I didn't call him any names, those were questions. And he admitted to being confrontational, as he is the majority of the time. Not the sign of someone following an ideal diet.

"Many herbs in general that are deemed as having "medicinal qualities",
have research opposing claiming they are toxic."

Anything can be toxic depending on the dosage and situation.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2015 06:46PM by jtprindl.

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Lol no ones jealous of you here, just thought I'd
> throw that out there."
>
> Like you would even know.
>

oh yes, me so jealous !!!!




> I didn't call him any names, those were questions.

that is the most dishonest statement i have seen a while.

> And he admitted to being confrontational, as he is
> the majority of the time. Not the sign of someone
> following an ideal diet.
>

no i didn't . i said there was a reason. for my response in the manner in which i responded. you called it confrontational.

JTP:

Confrontational yet again for no reason.

Fresh:

the reason is quite clear.

Exeggutor wrote:
"Many herbs in general that are deemed as having "medicinal qualities",
have research opposing claiming they are toxic."

If you're talking about things like echinachia, or golden seal you're right. If you're talking about the primary tonic herbs like ginseng and ho sho wu, you're wrong...

> I didn't call him any names, those were questions. And he admitted to being confrontational, as he is the majority of the time. Not the sign of someone following an ideal diet.

May I ask for a general description of your diet?
Just generalized. Doesn't have to be specific.
Just out of curiosity.

> If you're talking about things like echinachia, or golden seal you're right. If you're talking about the primary tonic herbs like ginseng and ho sho wu, you're wrong...

It was just a generalized statement. I meant nothing by it.

"May I ask for a general description of your diet?"

Fruits, algae's, green juices (including sprouts/grasses), nuts, seeds, herbs. and various 'super foods'.

In what proportions? I'm curious as to what the bulk
of your diet consists of.

I'm sure green juice can be very beneficial.
I've tried before and just couldn't do it..
The taste makes me nauseous.

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "May I ask for a general description of your
> diet?"
>
> Fruits, algae's, green juices (including
> sprouts/grasses), nuts, seeds, herbs. and various
> 'super foods'.

Exeggutor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In what proportions? I'm curious as to what the
> bulk
> of your diet consists of.
>
> I'm sure green juice can be very beneficial.
> I've tried before and just couldn't do it..
> The taste makes me nauseous.
>
> jtprindl Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > "May I ask for a general description of your
> > diet?"
> >
> > Fruits, algae's, green juices (including
> > sprouts/grasses), nuts, seeds, herbs. and
> various
> > 'super foods'.


It varies - I don't keep track but I'm probably around 35% fat. My main source of fat recently has been hemp seeds.

Interesting. I don't have much of a taste for nuts/seeds.
I know many people on raw enjoy them frequently.

I love fat. By taste alone, I could eat it all day, but it does make me feel heavy, decadent, and afraid that I am wasting calories that would serve me better.

That the CR people in Luigi Fontana's studies had some superior biomarkers compared to the raw vegans impresses me. They are more interested in optimization of energy intake. To them, there is more to the ideal intake than not using heat.

Lowering nonessential fat intake is a part of this, but not the only part.

But honestly, if you gave me a bag of pistachios, I would not stop until they were gone. This is one reason why I do not buy them.

Pistachios are the only nut I really have a taste for.
I do love sesame seeds made in to a hummus.
I love avacados and coconut but eat neither in large amounts.

I don't normally crave any fats.

I found that garlic reduced my heart rate and blood pressure too much.

Why should I eat something that my instincts tries to protect me against?

"Allicin has antibacterial and antifungal properties. The sulfur contained in its structure is responsible for these antibiotic properties but is also why garlic can irritate the soft tissues of the anal canal in some people."

Garlic is the best vegetable against cancer!!!! Best goddam vegetable against cancer!!! EVER!!! Garlic slaw has got it all!!!!! YEAH BABY.

Allium and cruciferous veggies got da sulfur and it's that that puts the kybash on cancer!!! Got crush em raw and wait 10 minutes for allinase and myrosinase to do their job. Cook em first and you got not benefit at all... slaw!!!! Dat's rights.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2015 04:38PM by CaptainColeslaw.

CaptainColeslaw Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Garlic is the best vegetable against cancer!!!!
> Best goddam vegetable against cancer!!! EVER!!!
> Garlic slaw has got it all!!!!! YEAH BABY.
>
> Allium and cruciferous veggies got da sulfur and
> it's that that puts the kybash on cancer!!! Got
> crush em raw and wait 10 minutes for allinase and
> myrosinase to do their job. Cook em first and you
> got not benefit at all... slaw!!!! Dat's rights.

the study is very good evidence against my philosophy since they compared to healthy cells.

unless the effects in a petri dish do not correlate to the body.

also the results were contradictory. some veggies did nothing for certain types of cancer and killed other types.

fruits that fight cancer

[nutritionfacts.org]

> Why should I eat something that my instincts tries to protect me against?

This ^^
And this vv


fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fruits that fight cancer
>
> [nutritionfacts.org]
> -cancer-better/

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> CaptainColeslaw Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Garlic is the best vegetable against cancer!!!!
>
> > Best goddam vegetable against cancer!!! EVER!!!
>
> > Garlic slaw has got it all!!!!! YEAH BABY.
> >
> > Allium and cruciferous veggies got da sulfur
> and
> > it's that that puts the kybash on cancer!!!
> Got
> > crush em raw and wait 10 minutes for allinase
> and
> > myrosinase to do their job. Cook em first and
> you
> > got not benefit at all... slaw!!!! Dat's
> rights.
>
> the study is very good evidence against my
> philosophy since they compared to healthy cells.
>
> unless the effects in a petri dish do not
> correlate to the body.

I think you are right that by itself it doesn't prove garlic is effective in protecting humans from cancer. But there are epi studies supporting it. epi studies

I agree with Captain Coleslaw.