[www.arkive.org]

[www.landofvos.com]

"The Anodorhynchus Macaws are known to have the strongest chisel action with the lower mandible of all the Parrot family. Both the Hyacinthine and the Lear's Macaw use the cutting edge of the " chisel " to split palm nuts in two."

" The " acuri " palm nut was found to be most appropriate in relation to chisel width and is indeed preferred by the Hyacinthine Macaw. The" bocaiuva " palm nut is smaller, but still suitable. However the" caranda " palm nut has an unsuitable lignin pattern rendering it inedible and the " babassu " palm nut is usually too large for the macaw to cut, thus only a very small proportion is eaten.

By calculating the ratio of chisel width to suitable palm nut diameter for the Lear's Macaw and the Hyacinthine Macaw, it was possible to extrapolate the nut size and shape most suitable for the Glaucous Macaw."


[www.bluemacaws.org]

My little raw buddy wouldn't let me eat a sunflower-seed "tuna" salad without him!



Or a mini-orange


But many of the "experts" say eating fruits and veg and nuts and seeds is BAD for him. His beak was OBVIOUSLY not designed to crack nuts, seeds nor is it perfect for tearing into the skin of fruits to expertly extract the juicy flesh inside. Feeding him as close to a natural diet as possible will only make him sick, depressed and fat. Only highly-processed, GMO corn and soy laden, preservative and synthetic vitamin laced pellets will do. You know, since processed pellet trees totally grow in the jungle

(Thankfully my mommy ignores the "experts" and feeds me a varied diet of fresh, real foods)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/09/2015 11:00PM by Kiwibird.

They are huge birds who in their native habitat eat 80% fat - 30% of which is saturated fat. They can live 80 years. They can easily snap a broom stick in half with those immense and immensely strong beaks.

Amazing raw vegan high fliers.

it says 28% fat in your article

and it also says they are prone to fatty liver disease

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They are huge birds who in their native habitat
> eat 80% fat - 30% of which is saturated fat. They
> can live 80 years. They can easily snap a broom
> stick in half with those immense and immensely
> strong beaks.
>
> Amazing raw vegan high fliers.


Interestingly enough many species of parrots (especially new world parrots) are opportunistic omnivores in nature and will on occasion scavenge meat, crack bones to extract the nutritious marrow and eat eggs/eggshells (though none is a high portion of their diets). They are primarily vegetarians though. Hy's are unique in their high fat diets, and while I don't know as much about the old world parrots (which eclectus would be) I do know they have specialized diets and can develop severe medical issues from commercial diets.

Very little is actually known or information available per-species about parrots full natural diets and much is presumption. I have (in the interest in providing my guy with as healthy of a diet as possible) done extensive research into their diets. Many 'experts' also never take into account the differences in parrot nutritional needs by species (except hy's and eclectus, as they can develop severe health problems from commercial diets). These birds come from different continents, climates and have vastly different nutritional needs. Sadly, the avian community lumps parrot diet and nutrition all together and formulates these terrible commercial pelleted diets for people who are too lazy to prepare fresh foods to feed them that contain nothing they would eat in nature, nothing even remotely close. 'They' say to not feed them seeds or nuts at all and give generalized recommendations of "fresh produce daily", but condemn fruit because it has sugar and this (as nature intended) increases hormonal behavior at certain times of year. Parrot diet is a fascinating subject to me Kiwi's species actually needs a lower fat diet, as they are prone to fatty liver disease and obesity if on too high fat of a diet. He eats a fruit-heavy primarily raw vegan diet, though he occasionally steals some egg from my omni husband and the shells are a good source of calcium for him. He will not eat meat or bones, though I have seen/know many parrots who instinctively know to crack bones and scoop the marrow and it is healthy for them in small quantities.

There have actually been instances of larger parrots severing fingers and breaking bones with their beaks. Kiwi is about the size of a large pigeon and he can easily crack almonds, hazelnuts (bigger nuts if you start them for him) and can easily split a 1" dowel with that beak. Bigger birds, like the large macaws, chew 2X4's for fun (in nature, most parrots hollow out cavities in trees to nest in). I also observe my bird frequently using his beak as a juicer and he expertly separates skin from the flesh of fruit with it. He uses it like a hook to climb, the bottom portion like a scoop to drink and has been known to hang from his beak. It is a pretty effective weapon too, I've been bit to the bone before and sustained temporary nerve damage from a similar sized bird to mine (different species). The beak of a parrot is a true marvel of nature! If you cannot tell, I love parrots and want to know as much as I can about them. My boy is a rescue, he's about 16 y/o. He was afraid of fruits and veggies when we got him and refused to eat anything but human junk food (that changed ASAP!). I do wish these beautiful animals were never brought into the pet trade and wish more people informed themselves before bringing one home. Diet is an especially important factor to consider with parrots, you don't just pour seeds or pellets in a bowl. They need seasonally rotated variety presented in such a way it simulates natural foraging behaviors.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> it says 28% fat in your article
>
> and it also says they are prone to fatty liver
> disease


Some species are, some aren't. Hyacinth macaws are unique in their high fat/high selenium content diet. Many other species benefit from a fruit-heavy diet with some seed and nuts. My birds species (amazons) is especially prone to fatty liver disease, and many captive amazons meet a miserable and untimely death in the 25-45 year old range due to high fat, primarily seed+nut diets.

I believe this is the woman my mother used to buy her parrots from.

Adorable ...

[www.petparrot.com]

where did you get your 80% figure from for wild birds?

the title of this thread is a lie

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> where did you get your 80% figure from for wild
> birds?

I got it from further research into the nutritional breakdown of what they eat in their natural habitat - not from what breeders feed them in captivity. Do your own homework unless you want to remain a remedial level troll.

> the title of this thread is a lie

That sentence of yours is a lie.

Let the animals go free...

NuNativs on YouTube...

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fresh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > where did you get your 80% figure from for
> wild
> > birds?
>
> I got it from further research into the
> nutritional breakdown of what they eat in their
> natural habitat - not from what breeders feed them
> in captivity. Do your own homework unless you want
> to remain a remedial level troll.
>

I did my own homework . Not even close to 80%.

it says 28% FROM YOUR own LINK for WILD macaws !

I await the results posted here of your research.


> > the title of this thread is a lie
>
> That sentence of yours is a lie.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2015 03:15PM by fresh.

NuNativs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Let the animals go free...


This is one of those statements that gets on my nerves. It's a nice concept, but it's an emotional response and not realistic. If I turned my bird loose, he'd die. Right now, he is a happy, bonded bird who knows no different life than one in a domestic home cared for by humans. The vast majority of captive bred parrots would die if turned loose in the backyard, lucky survivors would die as soon as it got colds and if they were *really* lucky to be released in an area thats warm year round and happened to make it, then they have the potential to become invasive species. Removing tens of millions of parrots from their homes worldwide and transporting them back to their native ranges is not feasible or realistic in any way. Captive bred "pets" have no natural survival skills, many do not fear predators (from being around dogs, cats and children), do not know what to eat (due to being on commercial diets) and are 100% human bonded (i.e. view their human family as their "flock" and don't care about other birds/feel aggression towards other birds). It would take several generations to phase parrots out of the pet trade humanely, which I am all for. Phasing them out, requiring permits to own and banning (pet) breeding operations is the only logical solution. These animals never should have been removed from the wild in the first place, but they were, and they deserve a logic-based solution from humans, not an emotional response that causes more harm than good.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2015 04:05PM by Kiwibird.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SueZ Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > fresh Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > where did you get your 80% figure from for
> > wild
> > > birds?
> >
> > I got it from further research into the
> > nutritional breakdown of what they eat in their
> > natural habitat - not from what breeders feed
> them
> > in captivity. Do your own homework unless you
> want
> > to remain a remedial level troll.
> >
>
> I did my own homework . Not even close to 80%.
>
> it says 28% FROM YOUR own LINK for WILD macaws !
>
> I await the results posted here of your research.
>
>
> > > the title of this thread is a lie
> >
> > That sentence of yours is a lie.


As Kiwibird also tried to inform you a few of the posts back - which you skipped or forgot in your habitual sloppy reading manner...

"Hyacinth macaws are unique in their high fat/high selenium content diet."


And LOL, on you claiming to have done your homework by reading, (obviously uncomprehendingly), a tiny bit of my homework which I posted here. I'm embarrassed for you.

another desperate post from suez.

post some non insulting, relevant words here, where you found that they eat 80% fat.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2015 04:33PM by fresh.

I'm not sure what % of their diet is fat. I do know they eat A LOT more fat than other species of parrots should and have developed a natural ability to process a higher-fat diet because they eat a lot of fat-rich nuts in nature. I think some of this information on hy diet helpful:

[www.hyacinths.com]

And since there was some bird beak admiration going on earlier:

[www.youtube.com]

Read the comments from the owners before judging. For a macaw like this, his cage is merely a toy to chew up. They say he has a large aviary too.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2015 04:57PM by Kiwibird.

kiwi wrote:

" This is one of those statements that gets on my nerves. The vast majority of captive bred parrots would die if turned loose in the backyard..."

Well that really gets on my nerves as WE're basically mutating and weakening animal species for our own misguided interests. Don't get me started on dogs...

NuNativs on YouTube...

the palm nut/fruit is like a small coconut.



[botanicalcraft.com]

it's not just a nut, there's fruit matter between the nut and the shell

the nutritional information appears to be unavailable.
except in the secret vault of Suez, who is apparently keeping it under lock and key , while hurling nonsensical insults in my general direction, missing aimlessly..


"In the wild, the macaw diet consists of the yellow-orange flesh between the brown skin and the cherry-sized nut of the palm fruit. It has the consistency of a raw potato. This made up nearly 100 percent of the macaw diet".

Quote
Well that really gets on my nerves as WE're basically mutating and weakening animal species for our own misguided interests. Don't get me started on dogs...

I don't disagree that humans never had a right to remove animals from nature, domesticate them and use them for our own purposes. But "we" (humanity) did. With some species (like dogs and cats), we began domesticating them tens of thousands of years ago before we as a species evolved morals and ethics. We can't change the past, we have to face the reality of the current situation and find the most compassionate solution. The solution though isn't to just open the door and turn them loose to nature to wreck havoc on local ecosystems or die. That is simply not the way to go about things. I think that there are solutions that could be started now and within a few generations have phased keeping animals out of human culture, but there is no quick-fix solution to this issue.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2015 06:08PM by Kiwibird.

Kiwibird Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
>
>
> I don't disagree that humans never had a right to
> remove animals from nature, domesticate them and
> use them for our own purposes. But "we" (humanity)
> did. With some species (like dogs and cats), we
> began domesticating them tens of thousands of
> years ago before we as a species evolved morals
> and ethics. We can't change the past, we have to
> face the reality of the current situation and find
> the most compassionate solution. The solution
> though isn't to just open the door and turn them
> loose to nature to wreck havoc on local ecosystems
> or die. That is simply not the way to go about
> things. I think that there are solutions that
> could be started now and within a few generations
> have phased keeping animals out of human culture,
> but there is no quick-fix solution to this issue.

I agree.

Some domesticated animals that our ancestors spent centuries upon centuries upon centuries of special purpose fiber breeding could be lost in one generation if the "quick-fixers" had their way. Thank God there aren't too many of those.

I'm a supporter of some breeders of rare and endangered long wool sheep, etc.. The wool of these sheep is far superior to most any Americans, at least, have ever seen of felt. These breeds are endangered because of technicalities having to do with industrial machinery specifications and sometimes due to recessive color genes which make industrial toxic chemical batch dying uneven. It is a shame that PETA has led a lot of people astray with their information on a mainly one sheep breed's problematic breeding horrors which they have erroneously spread as being true of all of sheep breeds.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I believe this is the woman my mother used to buy
> her parrots from.
>
> Adorable ...
>
> [www.petparrot.com]

While checking how close this breeder was to our area tornado last night ...

[www.youtube.com]

I discovered she was in the safety zone, too, thank goodness.

That was one big honking tornado which, had it landed not many miles further along in it's course, could have ended up right on top of the Byron nuclear power plant...

Either provide the data that you "researched" to support your 80% number,

or withdraw your statement and say that you assumed or made it up, or made a mistake, or it's a side effect of norovirus, or some other reason.

Or take the jtprindl route, and continue to blame and insult me.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Either provide the data that you "researched" to
> support your 80% number,


Figure out how to do your own research or ask your mother to help you. The information is public. I found it so your mother can find it for you little guy. Go bother someone else. I've had it with you and your blinders and bias. Scat.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fresh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Either provide the data that you "researched"
> to
> > support your 80% number,
>
>
> Figure out how to do your own research or ask
> your mother to help you. The information is
> public. I found it so your mother can find it for
> you little guy. Go bother someone else. I've had
> it with you and your blinders and bias. Scat.


In other words you are LYING about the 80% fat intake
and too ego stricken to admit it.

If it was available, you would simply provide it.

What you can't understand is that people RESPECT those who admit error. What you can't understand is that there is nothing wrong with me asking you where you got your information.

This is the same kind of BS that jtprindl did when presented with his LIES in black and white. Blaming me and storming off in a huff and claiming that he had been insulted.

There is nothing more sickening than this kind of behavior, this lack of intellectual integrity that you are displaying.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SueZ Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > fresh Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Either provide the data that you "researched"
> > to
> > > support your 80% number,
> >
> >
> > Figure out how to do your own research or ask
> > your mother to help you. The information is
> > public. I found it so your mother can find it
> for
> > you little guy. Go bother someone else. I've
> had
> > it with you and your blinders and bias. Scat.
>
>
> In other words you are LYING about the 80% fat
> intake
> and too ego stricken to admit it.
>
> If it was available, you would simply provide it.
>
> What you can't understand is that people RESPECT
> those who admit error. What you can't understand
> is that there is nothing wrong with me asking you
> where you got your information.
>
> This is the same kind of BS that jtprindl did when
> presented with his LIES in black and white.
> Blaming me and storming off in a huff and claiming
> that he had been insulted.
>
> There is nothing more sickening than this kind of
> behavior, this lack of intellectual integrity that
> you are displaying.

Please get a full battery of lab work done by a competent real doctor. There is something basic very wrong going on with you. You can't even seem to concentrate long enough to read and comprehend simple articles, like those I've posted in this thread, well enough to respond meaningfully without error - even after your error has been pointed out to you. If you can't understand the simple stuff you wouldn't understand the harder stuff. It's a useless endeavor I won't take on. Get your mother to help you. I'm done trying to.

blah blah blah.

where is your 80% reference?