I recently came across a new forum by Dr. Doug Graham. Here is the link: [the801010forum.com]

I started reading the threads and there are interesting posts with interesting questions and answers commonly found within the raw vegan lifestyle. I got a lot of information from it as well, as I'm continuously trying to educate myself about this amazing lifestyle.

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Raw vegan for life. Vegan for the animals. Raw for my health.

It's great as a short term cleansing diet, but has a 99+% failure rate long term, so beware. It all sound so great in theory, but how many people are able to sustain themselves on it after the initial euphoria wears off.

The good thing about 80-10-10 is that it is very popular and appealing (a great advertisment for eating fruits and vegetables that has reached many people), so it gets more people into exploring a healthy lifestyle and makes fruit and veggies cool. Even if people do fail on it and start eating meat again, at least people will appreciate fruits and vegetables more and hopefully will contiue to have more of these things in their diet.

Besides, if people do fail on the diet they can always tweek their diet and try to make it work better. Failure on certain diets doesn't spell the end of a raw lifestyle...it can be the beginning of learning how to make a raw vegan lifestyle work. Learning the lifestyle can take years. It's not all about food, it is many lifestyle factors we need to take into account. I see any people who fail on 80-10-10 being at the very start of their raw food journey. There are so many things we can try to try and make a raw diet work for us.

Diet should be ideally very simple, but that truly depends on the circumstances. For some a simple diet doesn't work, for others a simple diet does work. It should be simple in an ideal world, but unfortunately people's circumstances means that a simple diet is not always enough. I always needed a complex diet, but now my diet is simple...it all depends on the circumstances.

What about Harley? He was at the very beginning of his raw food journey, but he gave up before he found something that could have worked better for him. We need to open our minds to all types of possibilities and try things for a while and implement strategies to make things work better. We need to experiment, and nobody has experimented more than l have with diet combinations and strategies.

If higher fat doesn't work, then maybe various foods need to be added to make higher fat work better. You never know until you try everything and stick with it for a while to see what really happens. It can take years to really learn what is going on.

I say to the failed 80-10-10 folks...you are only at the beginning of your journey. The raw diet takes a long time to master in many cases.

www.thesproutarian.com



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2015 02:43AM by The Sproutarian Man.

TSM, it's not about trying and failing, it's about warning newbies about any lasting damage that might be done so they are aware of all the facts. You only get one body in this lifetime!

Some people end up having serious teeth issues from a too one sided fruit diet deficient in minerals. Also, 80/10/10 advises people to keep eating and stretching their stomachs. Once they find it doesn't work for them in the middle to long term and they have stretched their stomachs then they have issues being satisfied.

It's alright if you have a rock hard stomach than can cope with a dozen bananas, but other than Doug, Harley and a few others, most people can't cope with that much fruit in one sitting. And after 8 years of 100% raw mostly fruit Harley has ended up with dentures - and he's not even 40. I know that people will use the pre existing condition as his excuse, but it's just an excuse.

How many people on this board now follow 80/10/10 or would recommend it as it is with no salt, fermented foods ( rotten as Doug would refer to them ), supplements, etc? Do we even believe he is able to follow it or is following it?

I think it's great that people are encouraged to eat as much raw as possible, but why not guide them so they don't have issues afterwards.

BJ Wrote:
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> TSM, it's not about trying and failing, it's about
> warning newbies about any lasting damage that
> might be done so they are aware of all the facts.
> You only get one body in this lifetime!


Good point. There is always going to be those extremists who don't know when to quit and ignore all the warning signs. BJ, there needs to be much better education put out there from these gurus pushing these diets that are notorious for being difficult to sustain over long periods, but...do these gurus have the answers to these problems,l am not so sure that they do. Hmmm, something is definitely amiss with all this.

We need to be responsible and focused on people and not ourselves when we are raw leaders, and if people are suffering problems with the diet we need to take it seriously and look for solutions. And if we can't solve the issues we need to admit it and issue a public warning. You don't want to become rich and famous if people following your diet are losing their health and not able to sustain it. We have to act with professionalism and integrity, and we have to be on the side of the people and put them first. If the fame and money interests you, you have already developed a mindset which could strongly interfere with acting with integrity and putting people first over your self interest in business. Having people getting the results from following your diet is what should matter, and money and fame should just be a biproduct of your success. If people have little success following your diet then you have no success and are just an empty name, and one could see the money and fame obtained through promotion of these diets as being irresponsible, because if lots of people fail and many harm themselves then maybe the books and promotion should be stopped and public warnings issued. We need to be responsible if we get it wrong.

People really need to take their eyes off their own self interest in business and be responsible to the public when they lead a movement of thinking. It's important to have a reputation as a good person, because without that you don't have anything.

www.thesproutarian.com

DO you think its better than this forum, how long does it take for someone to respond to a post or comment? Ela, I m asking you.

What do they talk about?

I tried 811, I do like raw vegans, of all sorts.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2015 06:05AM by suvine.

BJ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's great as a short term cleansing diet, but has
> a 99+% failure rate long term, so beware. It all
> sound so great in theory, but how many people are
> able to sustain themselves on it after the initial
> euphoria wears off.

How do you define failure? I ask because many people I know, family, friends, acquaintances, co-workers are on one diet or another and they all follow their diet about 70% of the time but yet they don't count themselves as failures.

It seems to be more of a private email club than a public forum. They want your account info before you are even allowed to read anything posted. Ha.

Anon 102 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> BJ Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > It's great as a short term cleansing diet, but
> has
> > a 99+% failure rate long term, so beware. It
> all
> > sound so great in theory, but how many people
> are
> > able to sustain themselves on it after the
> initial
> > euphoria wears off.
>
> How do you define failure? I ask because many
> people I know, family, friends, acquaintances,
> co-workers are on one diet or another and they all
> follow their diet about 70% of the time but yet
> they don't count themselves as failures.

exactly

the claimed difference is that 811 is uniquely dangerous, which is false. you can take b12 and not think your stomach needs to be stretched and it's still 811. the fact that weak humans don't do something 100% says nothing about the validity of it.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It seems to be more of a private email club than a
> public forum. They want your account info before
> you are even allowed to read anything posted. Ha.


Actually they hurriedly changed the log in format because they got a tip off that you were coming.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anon 102 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > BJ Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > It's great as a short term cleansing diet,
> but
> > has
> > > a 99+% failure rate long term, so beware. It
> > all
> > > sound so great in theory, but how many people
> > are
> > > able to sustain themselves on it after the
> > initial
> > > euphoria wears off.
> >
> > How do you define failure? I ask because many
> > people I know, family, friends, acquaintances,
> > co-workers are on one diet or another and they
> all
> > follow their diet about 70% of the time but yet
> > they don't count themselves as failures.
>
> exactly
>
> the claimed difference is that 811 is uniquely
> dangerous, which is false. you can take b12 and
> not think your stomach needs to be stretched and
> it's still 811. the fact that weak humans don't
> do something 100% says nothing about the validity
> of it.


Yep.

811 to me is

Its like super down the rabbit hole raw.

It is a super extreme diet for super extreme personalities.

They may always be drawn for the THINSPO and be like what is this strange thing, and it may resonate with them, like the grain of truth RAW VEGANISM IS....

and a small percentage may succeed. Its also a lottery.

one never knows how much you are going to weigh...

Suez what u think





Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/03/2015 04:24AM by suvine.

everything is relative, right?

so another way of thinking about 811 is how we sometimes think of meat eaters. they couldn't do it except for cooking and for someone else killing the animal.

same thing for non 811 raw diets. they are all artificial and only possible through modern technology.

811 is the most natural in a wild environment. if we say no cooking, and sufficient food available so that resorting to animal products is not necessary, then 811 is natural, normal and the diets that most raw people are on with the nut butters and snacks and seaweed and oils and bee pollens and juicing are unnatural and not possible.

in other words, what is extreme? a diet that cannot possibly be done without processing (collecting and packaging bee pollen, squeezing out oils) is extreme, not picking leaves and fruits. from a logistical standpoint.

FRESH good point.

Its like the king of extreme, of extreme on top of that extreme. I get you.

I was more like what is considered extreme in our society.
Like it is normal to eat meat and cooked food. And we know THAT IS THE EXTREMIST diet. And 811 may be so simple. Without the calorie calculator.





Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/06/2015 04:57PM by suvine.

Coconutcream, I'm sorry I just now answer your question, after all this time...
I've been reading almost all posts on Dr. Graham's forum, and I must say I really like his forum, once you post your reply, you get an answer very quickly. I like the fact that the forum is an opportunity to communicate with Dr. Graham himself, which I find is such a great thing. It's indeed a really supportive forum of the 80/10/10 followers like myself. I go back every day to his forum reading the posts with a lot of interest, and I found great answers to some of my questions / areas of interest. The posts there are about anything related to the 80/10/10 diet and lifestyle: fitness, food, lifestyle balance, spirituality, health, science, plus some general posts. It's very interesting, I totally recommend it.

SueZ, yes, you need to be logged to view the posts and the replies, which is fine with me, I already have my account on Dr. Graham's forum, and I have no problem with this.

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Raw vegan for life. Vegan for the animals. Raw for my health.

I wonder if I have ever been on the 811 forum.





Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/15/2015 06:43PM by suvine.