organic1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anyone who thinks the body enters some kind of
> "detoxification" mode simply by lowering or
> increasing fats, doesn't really have the first
> clue about how the body's actual real
> detoxification processes work.


You would think that bat shite crazy fresh and john rose had enough time to take at least one lousy biology course from a college over their years of dispensing misinformation, wouldn't you? It's so obvious that they haven't bothered.

I love when the people who failed on a diet tell the people who succeeded on same diet so many very very interesting things and ignore so many other things and have nothing better to say other than batshit crazy blah blah.

organic
Ive been to live festivals with thousands of people, yet you never catch anything.

Tai
I've been to camping events with thousands (mostly omnivores) and they did have a first aid campsite with volunteers and people were constantly being helped for infections, trauma, etc. Clearly with raw food, there is more risk, but still water purity, handling dishes and utensils is still an issue for even cooked fooders. True vegans have far fewer infectious problems than meat eaters. But still some vegans expose themselves to more risk of infection with unsafe practices.

And what are you talking about? Look at how many ecoli outbreaks there are. People die from food poisoning (eating infected meat). People get infected all the time everywhere, How many festivals has Charlie Sheen been to?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2016 08:55PM by Tai.

once again organic1 phrases things just as he likes as that is not what i said.
never said it enters a detox "mode"
the body's ability to cleanse varies based on diet and sleep and other factors and will be lower than ideal on the diet Niko was on

Tai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> organic
> Ive been to live festivals with thousands of
> people, yet you never catch anything.
>
> Tai
> I've been to camping events with thousands (mostly
> omnivores) and they did have a first aid campsite
> with volunteers and people were constantly being
> helped for infections, trauma, etc. Clearly with
> raw food, there is more risk, but still water
> purity, handling dishes and utensils is still an
> issue for even cooked fooders. True vegans have
> far fewer infectious problems than meat eaters.
> But still some vegans expose themselves to more
> risk of infection with unsafe practices.
>
> And what are you talking about? Look at how many
> ecoli outbreaks there are. People die from eating
> food poisoning (meat). People get infected all the
> time everywhere, How many festivals has Charlie
> Sheen been to?


organic1 is not well versed in logic nor is he interested in facts...he just likes throwing out any random sentence that he thinks will get someone riled up by criticizing raw diets or vegan diets, like "why can't these gurus eat their diet for just one day? or just one week?" funny stuff



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2016 09:03PM by fresh.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> organic1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > And when you've got raw food gurus like John
> Rose
> > who claims to dig out his every bowel movement,
> > stick it on his scales so he can weigh it, bag
> it,
> > document it and add it his collection.
> >
> > You can imagine spreading infections is highly
> > likely.
> >
> > And John Rose claims to have weighed every
> single
> > bowel movement hes done since 1994 or
> something.
>
> It's bad enough that the old obsolete fruitarian
> type gurus think they are immune to such things
> but it's horrible that they teach such dangerous
> stupidity to the younger generations - the younger
> generations that end up being, basically, the
> indentured servants to the elite at the WFF.


Also, how the heck were the WFF owners, who I guess don't even really claim to be raw fruitarians at all, crown "raw" vegan "Pioneers" most of whom also were not really raw (we've come to find out) and be in charge of their hiring and firing as though it means anything at all in real life but seemed to have sent the whole raw food community moral into a slow motion tailspin?

And, now that I think about it, wasn't the WFF founder angry and appalled at Durian rider dissing doug graham who he also ended up firing from the WFF "Pioneers" (his way of dissing, lol)?

Who are these Arnsteins? I'm tired of their shenanigans and probably I'm not alone in that. Who will they crown next? Probably Tanny Raw and Tai will be the only ones left who maybe won't challenge their bogus leadership and play along nicely with the Arnstein mythos should they be invited to the royal fake raw vegan WFF court. I doubt TSM would put up with their highnesses BS for a whole two weeks.

I spoke against the pioneer concept and the hierarchy and thought DR had a good idea with his thai festival.

with that said, they have changed somewhat are continue to evolve and most people enjoy it immensely.

where do you think all your negativity comes from?

not enough joy in your life?

it's really sad to see that not only don't you see your own negativity and wasted criticism, but you don't care - it's a sad thing to watch. such a waste of time.

maybe you're undercarbed



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2016 09:31PM by fresh.

Organic:
You sound like you've been camping too, how many times have you caught herpes or other serious infections Tai ?

Tai:
Oh please, I never caught anything. I ate soup that was boiled that other peope made (and I had my own bowl and my own utensils that I washed myself). ANd I ate raw food and lots of raw fruit that I brought myself. I even brought durian because that stays frozen for at least 24 hours. I bought my own coconuts that I ate myself. I bought lots of trail mix. I did eat raw salad but from a friend. I had my own water purifier.

SueZ
Probably Tanny Raw and Tai will be the only ones left who maybe won't challenge their bogus leadership

Tai:
I don't think you quite understand me, SueZ. I really want to find out what works and doesn't work in the vegan diet and for whom. My plate is extremely full with my career. All I want is the truth.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2016 09:45PM by Tai.

" Tai:
I don't think you quite understand me, SueZ. I really want to find out what works and doesn't work in the vegan diet and for whom. My plate is extremely full with my career. All I want is the truth."

OK then. Probably just TannyRaw, that I can think of, for new appointment in the fake raw vegan Arnstein's WFF royal court.

are you all raw vegan Suez? if so, share with us your daily diet as of late and when the last time was that you ate something that was not raw vegan.

I see you and organic1 are so consumed by criticizing others for their imperfect ways - you must be perfect. oh, no, it's not their imperfect ways, it's the lying!! and the alleged lying is never actually identified. and of course suez and organic1 never lie.

(why this needs to be such a competition, i don't know)

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> " Tai:
> I don't think you quite understand me, SueZ. I
> really want to find out what works and doesn't
> work in the vegan diet and for whom. My plate is
> extremely full with my career. All I want is the
> truth."
>
> OK then. Probably just TannyRaw, that I can think
> of, for new appointment in the fake raw vegan
> Arnstein's WFF royal court.

Just to make sure that all readers understand what I'm saying here - although I don't believe that as least one half of the Arnstein WFF royal couple is a raw vegan I do think that TannyRaw most likely truly is raw vegan.

>>Yeah, I have heard that...such as that the pathogens are only eating the waste from the body and the bad tissue we don't need. But even if a stranger promises you that it's legal to run red lights and you do, you will still get pulled over by a policeman one day and get a ticket and maybe even cause a fatal accident.

- do you or anyone else have any evidence that any sickness at the WFF this year or any other year was caused by bacteria or virus?

- science confirms theories by predictions. a prediction would be that the cleaner (longer term) eaters would get ill at an event where there were semi gourmet foods. the reason that the more experienced raw eaters got ill last year or the year before was more likely because they reacted to a poor food combination that their body was not used to, having eaten simple foods over many years and there are complicated pies and nut/seed combinations at the festival. this getting ill is blindly attributed to bacteria or virus without any evidence. as I said i got ill from a raw pizza at a raw restaurant. it was a healthy and proper reaction to an improper food.

- hiv causes aids right? a non natural hygiene, non raw eating professor duesberg explained very logically and scientifically why it does not, and is instead caused by amyl nitrate as well as many other unsavory practices. this is no different from the causation attributed to virus and bacteria for other diseases

- why do i not get ill if those close to me are repeatedly getting ill due to alleged bacteria and virus? just luck right?

fresh
do you or anyone else have any evidence that any sickness at the WFF this year or any other year was caused by bacteria or virus?

Tai:
I wasn't there nor do I personally know anyone who went there. (I met Lou but I never met Dan). Relistening to Dan the Man shows he already had an infection before he went to WFF. IT got out of control and antibiotics took care of it. It it wasn't an infection, the antibiotics wouldn't have worked. I really dislike antibiotics and much prefer herbs. Of course antibiotics are needed, if someone has nothing else. Anyway, Dan has the proof from the hospital lab reports that he had an infection. The fact that he had no insurance and still had to go shows the seriousness of the infection.

Fresh, I am not trying to disparage WFF. People get sick everywhere all the time. WFF is not sterile. It's a lot of hype if someone gets sick there. Who cares that someone or many got sick. Raw fooders need to learn safe practices. There is no way that Victoria or Mike would have ever condoned the coconut cake fiasco. There is no way they could have predicted that such behavior would have occurred. It's a learning lesson for everyone. It's crazy that anyone can call themselves a raw chef. Perhaps to legally use the word chef, a person should have to take an accredited class in hygiene and advanced human nutrition with a grade b or better. So when an employer hires a "chef" they don't have to worry about the chef putting everyone's health on the line.

Fresh wrote

- science confirms theories by predictions. a prediction would be that the cleaner (longer term) eaters would get ill at an event where there were semi gourmet foods. the reason that the more experienced raw eaters got ill last year or the year before was more likely because they reacted to a poor food combination that their body was not used to, having eaten simple foods over many years and there are complicated pies and nut/seed combinations at the festival. this getting ill is blindly attributed to bacteria or virus without any evidence. as I said i got ill from a raw pizza at a raw restaurant. it was a healthy and proper reaction to an improper food.

Tai
You can program your mind anyway you want. I want to be stronger and stronger, not weaker and weaker. I want to withstand poison, if accidentally poisoned. I want to recover from a burn quickly, if accidently burned. I want to bounce back quickly, if accidentally injured. IF you program your mind that cooked food is poison and gourmet raw vegan foods are disasters waiting to happen, so be it. I don't want to be a feather blowing in the wind.
I was a real vegan for 7 years when I got conned into eating meat again. I heard people say they would get very sick when eating meat after being vegan. You know what happened to me? Nothing. I didn't get sick, have vomiting or diarhhea. ULtimately I went back to being vegan, because meat eating was completely unnecessary for me and a violation of my awareness not only of compassion but also of my awesome vegan food prep abilities.
But I will say one thing. Since in my heart of hearts, I am vegan for compassion sake, a few times someone gave me either a bowl of soup or food with a sauce. After one sip, i dry heaved without showing them what happened. I was discrete. I went to a sink privately and spit everything out and washed my mouth. My body was responding to my wishes: to be vegan. Clearly there was some animal product in that liquid. THese people were heartily eating the same food. It wasn't poisoned, but my body knew the ingredients were not what I wanted. SO it helped me. But if my mind had said it was okay, then I would not have dryheaved.
I like the mind and body connection. It works great. I don't have time to share other stories, but I have other really good ones. I have an amazing one from last week from another vegan but no time to share.

You cannot separate your body from your opinions. Your body knows exactly what your wishes and opinions are. Your body will respond to your wishes. at the same time your body will communicate to you to let you know things that you must know. It works both ways.

This is one reason I don't argue with meat eaters. Some meat eaters have convinced themselves they NEED meat. THey feel weak and sickly without meat, but after their body adjusts to living without excess cholesterol and hormones, they might still psychologically miss meat and their body will manifest symptoms to give them reason to go back.

Fresh
- why do i not get ill if those close to me are repeatedly getting ill due to alleged bacteria and virus? just luck right?

Tai
THis is a huge discussion. But just because you don't get sick doesn't disprove bacteria and viruses. I even heard a couple of stories of a couple of prostitutes in Africa or somewhere who did not get HIV even though they were exposed to it. But a couple of lucky prostitutes (omnivores at that) doesn't disprove AIDS epidemic and how it normally transmits. Some say it was intentionally spread via the smallpox vaccine in Africa (they say there was live virus present). I don't know.

Being vegan with a strong immune system and clean organs and a clean lymphatic system with a hygienic lifestyle greatly minimizes risk of infection, that's for sure.

Prana wrote
Dan said in the first video that he worked for 14 days straight, 12 hours a day. This is enough abuse to cause a person to get seriously sick, especially if they weren't feeling well before the event started.

Tai:
I don't buy into that except when Harley and Doug talk about heavy duty exercise requiring more sleep.
I have worked 7 days a week, 12 hour days, for 10 weeks at a time and never got sick, not even a sniffle. Tons of witnesses too. I didn't go to bed by 10 and maybe slept 5-6 hours. I don't buy into Harley's sleep schedule unless you are massively fatiguing yourself from over exercise. IF someone still feels tired after 8 hours of sleep, something is wrong with them that they need to correct in their body...more sleep is not the cure.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2016 07:05PM by Tai.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> organic1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Anyone who thinks the body enters some kind of
> > "detoxification" mode simply by lowering or
> > increasing fats, doesn't really have the first
> > clue about how the body's actual real
> > detoxification processes work.
>
>
> You would think that bat shite crazy fresh and
> john rose had enough time to take at least one
> lousy biology course from a college over their
> years of dispensing misinformation, wouldn't you?
> It's so obvious that they haven't bothered.

And what is stopping them, even now, from taking just one stinking basic university level biology lab course so they can stop being and sounding so ignorant?

If they are afraid of getting poor grades they could always just audit. Maybe their fake "genius level logic" is telling them to wait a couple of years so they can get their senior citizen discounts for taking a class cheaper or something.

Just watched the megan Elizabeth video where she shamelessly states "I don't know how I got into the woodstock food festival because the criteria was you had to be 100% raw. I never was. Nobody ever asked me." ...

Well gee, could it be megan was asked to attend the royal's elite wff court because she fit the Camelot idealized 80-10-10/fruitarian image the also almost truthful Arnstein's were trying to mold the raw vegan community into and were attempting to promote to the four corners of the globe? Was it Megan's easy going "go along to get along" manner that the royal WFF couple sensed in her that made her a shoe in for one of their "it" girls? Could it be they could also see she would be a good actress and promoter of their carnival - their very own Gwyneth Paltrow in a way?

Tai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>IT got out of
> control and antibiotics took care of it. It it
> wasn't an infection, the antibiotics wouldn't have
> worked.

- you do not know what caused dan to get ill. you simply do not know.
- digestive problems can be devastating.
- there is always bacteria in the body to be blamed for illness. it is omnipresent
- your statement above is not true as antibiotics can suppress symptoms


I really dislike antibiotics and much
> prefer herbs. Of course antibiotics are needed,
> if someone has nothing else. Anyway, Dan has the
> proof from the hospital lab reports that he had an
> infection. The fact that he had no insurance and
> still had to go shows the seriousness of the
> infection.
>

you can believe the infection theory. the "flies don't cause garbage" theory is just as valid.


> Fresh, I am not trying to disparage WFF. People
> get sick everywhere all the time. WFF is not
> sterile. It's a lot of hype if someone gets sick
> there. Who cares that someone or many got sick.

I care as it indicates that nikocado is less likely to be correct in his conclusion regarding herpes. that's all.


> Raw fooders need to learn safe practices. There is
> no way that Victoria or Mike would have ever
> condoned the coconut cake fiasco.

it is not a fiasco as reported by nikocado.
if validated by other sources then you can call it a fiasco

There is no way
> they could have predicted that such behavior would
> have occurred. It's a learning lesson for
> everyone. It's crazy that anyone can call
> themselves a raw chef. Perhaps to legally use the
> word chef, a person should have to take an
> accredited class in hygiene and advanced human
> nutrition with a grade b or better. So when an
> employer hires a "chef" they don't have to worry
> about the chef putting everyone's health on the
> line.
>
> Fresh wrote
>
> - science confirms theories by predictions. a
> prediction would be that the cleaner (longer term)
> eaters would get ill at an event where there were
> semi gourmet foods. the reason that the more
> experienced raw eaters got ill last year or the
> year before was more likely because they reacted
> to a poor food combination that their body was not
> used to, having eaten simple foods over many years
> and there are complicated pies and nut/seed
> combinations at the festival. this getting ill is
> blindly attributed to bacteria or virus without
> any evidence. as I said i got ill from a raw pizza
> at a raw restaurant. it was a healthy and proper
> reaction to an improper food.
>
> Tai
> You can program your mind anyway you want. I want
> to be stronger and stronger, not weaker and
> weaker.

I not saying it is true, I am saying it is possible.

when because someone strongly responds poorly to a bad food
that does not make them weaker. the weaker one is the one who does
not respond and the body keeps it inside and creates long term disease.



I want to withstand poison, if
> accidentally poisoned. I want to recover from a
> burn quickly, if accidently burned. I want to
> bounce back quickly, if accidentally injured.

this has nothing to do with what i am talking about.

IF
> you program your mind that cooked food is poison
> and gourmet raw vegan foods are disasters waiting
> to happen, so be it. I don't want to be a feather
> blowing in the wind.

has nothing to do with programming the mind.

for a simple eater it will cause a negative response, and this is a good thing, not a weakness.
I am not talking about a life threatening infection, i am talking about a problem eliminative response.


> I was a real vegan for 7 years when I got conned
> into eating meat again. I heard people say they
> would get very sick when eating meat after being
> vegan. You know what happened to me? Nothing. I
> didn't get sick, have vomiting or diarhhea.
> ULtimately I went back to being vegan, because
> meat eating was completely unnecessary for me and
> a violation of my awareness not only of compassion
> but also of my awesome vegan food prep abilities.
>
> But I will say one thing. Since in my heart of
> hearts, I am vegan for compassion sake, a few
> times someone gave me either a bowl of soup or
> food with a sauce. After one sip, i dry heaved
> without showing them what happened. I was
> discrete. I went to a sink privately and spit
> everything out and washed my mouth. My body was
> responding to my wishes: to be vegan. Clearly
> there was some animal product in that liquid.

by your theory you were not strong then and this is a bad response.

> THese people were heartily eating the same food.
> It wasn't poisoned, but my body knew the
> ingredients were not what I wanted. SO it helped
> me. But if my mind had said it was okay, then I
> would not have dryheaved.

maybe

> I like the mind and body connection. It works
> great. I don't have time to share other stories,
> but I have other really good ones. I have an
> amazing one from last week from another vegan but
> no time to share.
>
> You cannot separate your body from your opinions.
> Your body knows exactly what your wishes and
> opinions are. Your body will respond to your
> wishes. at the same time your body will
> communicate to you to let you know things that you
> must know. It works both ways.
>
> This is one reason I don't argue with meat eaters.
> Some meat eaters have convinced themselves they
> NEED meat. THey feel weak and sickly without
> meat, but after their body adjusts to living
> without excess cholesterol and hormones, they
> might still psychologically miss meat and their
> body will manifest symptoms to give them reason to
> go back.
>
> Fresh
> - why do i not get ill if those close to me are
> repeatedly getting ill due to alleged bacteria and
> virus? just luck right?
>
> Tai
> THis is a huge discussion. But just because you
> don't get sick doesn't disprove bacteria and
> viruses. I even heard a couple of stories of a
> couple of prostitutes in Africa or somewhere who
> did not get HIV even though they were exposed to
> it. But a couple of lucky prostitutes (omnivores
> at that) doesn't disprove AIDS epidemic and how it
> normally transmits. Some say it was intentionally
> spread via the smallpox vaccine in Africa (they
> say there was live virus present). I don't know.
>

it does disprove the usual sickness is transmitted from person to person theory .

read duesberg if you ever get the time.

> Being vegan with a strong immune system and clean
> organs and a clean lymphatic system with a
> hygienic lifestyle greatly minimizes risk of
> infection, that's for sure.
>
> Prana wrote
> Dan said in the first video that he worked for 14
> days straight, 12 hours a day. This is enough
> abuse to cause a person to get seriously sick,
> especially if they weren't feeling well before the
> event started.
>
> Tai:
> I don't buy into that except when Harley and Doug
> talk about heavy duty exercise requiring more
> sleep.
> I have worked 7 days a week, 12 hour days, for 10
> weeks at a time and never got sick, not even a
> sniffle. Tons of witnesses too. I didn't go to bed
> by 10 and maybe slept 5-6 hours. I don't buy into
> Harley's sleep schedule unless you are massively
> fatiguing yourself from over exercise. IF someone
> still feels tired after 8 hours of sleep,
> something is wrong with them that they need to
> correct in their body...more sleep is not the
> cure.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SueZ Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > organic1 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > And when you've got raw food gurus like John
> > Rose
> > > who claims to dig out his every bowel
> movement,
> > > stick it on his scales so he can weigh it,
> bag
> > it,
> > > document it and add it his collection.
> > >
> > > You can imagine spreading infections is
> highly
> > > likely.
> > >
> > > And John Rose claims to have weighed every
> > single
> > > bowel movement hes done since 1994 or
> > something.



> > It's bad enough that the old obsolete
> fruitarian
> > type gurus think they are immune to such things
> > but it's horrible that they teach such
> dangerous
> > stupidity to the younger generations - the
> younger
> > generations that end up being, basically, the
> > indentured servants to the elite at the WFF.



> Also, how the heck were the WFF owners, who I
> guess don't even really claim to be raw
> fruitarians at all, crown "raw" vegan "Pioneers"
> most of whom also were not really raw (we've come
> to find out) and be in charge of their hiring and
> firing as though it means anything at all in real
> life but seemed to have sent the whole raw food
> community moral into a slow motion tailspin?
>
> And, now that I think about it, wasn't the WFF
> founder angry and appalled at Durian rider dissing
> doug graham who he also ended up firing from the
> WFF "Pioneers" (his way of dissing, lol)?


WHO ARE THE ARNSTEINS? Who the eff are they?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/22/2016 07:58PM by SueZ.

i made a couple grammar errors and am not going to correct them all. and my statement "disprove" would be better said as "provides evidence against"

I'm going to listen to the official Woodstock Fruit Festival videos when have the time but what I've heard so far is far less than impressive for '15.

Straight from the horse's mouth...

"A lot of the fruit wasn't organic"

WTH?!! Supporting Monsanto and the rest of the GMO and whole chemical industry with participants money is OK with ARNSTEIN! Were the participants aware of this fact before they signed up?

"A lot of the figs were moldy because we had to buy super deals"

WTF? That just leaves me speechless. Appalling. Even Walmart feeds people better.

"We didn't have enough durian"

Great. So far as raw vegan food goes, that's what most people wanted to try most.

"We didn't have enough coconuts"

Oh right, yeah, I heard about your raw vegan coconut cake horror. The wff is SO resourceful ...

Hi Fresh,
I peeked at Dueburg.

Before I comment on his theory, let's just talk about herbalist Richard Schulze. By the mid 90s he already had like 15 AIDS cases that were cured. One guy had a t cell count of like one or something and was slated to die the day he took him on. In the end, he had no HIV viral load and was normal. So, the cases that were "cured", the HIV viral load became nil.

So a quick peek at DUesberg's ideas is reasonable, imo. He is arguing that conventional viral and bacterial infections plus drug use and malnutrition leads to AIDs, rather than solely or exclusively caused by or independent of HIV. I am sure he had reasons for his idea. FOr example, in rheumatoid arthritis, only some patients test positive for rheumatoid factor, but they have the disease nevertheless. SO, he is saying some people have AIDS but are not HIV positive? I have no idea about this. I never heard of it before. But if that's the case, then he is saying other infections from both virus and bacteria in origin are to blame, which fully verifies that this man of science believes in viruses and bacteria wreaking havoc.

Full blown AIDS cases have a lot of infections going on. It's gnarly. I knew one AIDS man who didn't have any apparent infections but he was on the latest drugs. Of course just with HIV, a person can appear normal, but AIDS cases are very susceptible.

But whether AIDS is caused by HIV or not, with Schulze's patients, the people started with high viral loads of HIV and ended with nil viral loads. The thing with natural healing is that all viruses and bad bacteria get under control. But the people were very sick with high HIV viral loads and exhibited health when the viral loads were gone.

[www.duesberg.com]

"Since AIDS is defined by new combinations of conventional diseases, it may be caused by new combinations of conventional pathogens, including acute viral or microbial infections and chronic drug use and malnutrition. The long and unpredictable intervals between infection with HIV and AIDS would then reflect the thresholds for these pathogenic factors to cause AIDS diseases, instead of an unlikely mechanism of HIV pathogenesis"



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/22/2016 09:17PM by Tai.

good on you to read duesberg, Tai.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm going to listen to the official Woodstock
> Fruit Festival videos when have the time but what
> I've heard so far is far less than impressive for
> '15.
>
> Straight from the horse's mouth...
>
> "A lot of the fruit wasn't organic"
>
> WTH?!! Supporting Monsanto and the rest of the
> GMO and whole chemical industry with participants
> money is OK with ARNSTEIN! Were the participants
> aware of this fact before they signed up?
>
> "A lot of the figs were moldy because we had to
> buy super deals"
>
> WTF? That just leaves me speechless. Appalling.
> Even Walmart feeds people better.
>
> "We didn't have enough durian"
>
> Great. So far as raw vegan food goes, that's what
> most people wanted to try most.
>
> "We didn't have enough coconuts"
>
> Oh right, yeah, I heard about your raw vegan
> coconut cake horror. The wff is SO resourceful ...

Arnstein made a video on how one of the reasons he turned to organic fruit was because pesticides have been linked to Parkinson's disease, which his father has. Yet it's ok for him to serve mostly pesticide laced fruits to his health seeking customers at wwf - even to the children? That's just not right, IMO.

suez, you are complete and total moron.

unless you would like to start your own festival, and do a better job than he does and show him how easy it is to use 100% organic foods .

then maybe you are not a moron.

btw, people eat what you presume is "pesticide laden" foods every day. do you eat 100% organic foods?

did you ever run your own festival?

didn't think so.

so just another stupid comment from suez



look at this TOOL begging for money through his link on youtube
still claiming to be raw, but not.

[www.patreon.com]

suez is frantically collecting loose change to contribute to this young Pedro Almodóvar's YOUTUBE VIDEOS, that must have VERY HIGH production costs!. keep digging suez.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/2016 02:55AM by fresh.

Tai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Fresh,
> I peeked at Dueburg.
>
> Before I comment on his theory, let's just talk
> about herbalist Richard Schulze. By the mid 90s he
> already had like 15 AIDS cases that were cured.
> One guy had a t cell count of like one or
> something and was slated to die the day he took
> him on. In the end, he had no HIV viral load and
> was normal. So, the cases that were "cured", the
> HIV viral load became nil.
>

not sure what your point is here.

did he have the patients engage in health practices to strengthen the body?

> So a quick peek at DUesberg's ideas is reasonable,
> imo. He is arguing that conventional viral and
> bacterial infections plus drug use and
> malnutrition leads to AIDs, rather than solely or
> exclusively caused by or independent of HIV. I am
> sure he had reasons for his idea. FOr example, in
> rheumatoid arthritis, only some patients test
> positive for rheumatoid factor, but they have the
> disease nevertheless. SO, he is saying some
> people have AIDS but are not HIV positive? I have
> no idea about this. I never heard of it before.
> But if that's the case, then he is saying other
> infections from both virus and bacteria in origin
> are to blame, which fully verifies that this man
> of science believes in viruses and bacteria
> wreaking havoc.
>

please see if you can find me a bacteria or virus that has satisfied Koch's postulates. I haven't found any.


> Full blown AIDS cases have a lot of infections
> going on. It's gnarly. I knew one AIDS man who
> didn't have any apparent infections but he was on
> the latest drugs. Of course just with HIV, a
> person can appear normal, but AIDS cases are very
> susceptible.
>

you are using the word infection as if it is the primary cause.

and there is no reason to believe that.

> But whether AIDS is caused by HIV or not, with
> Schulze's patients, the people started with high
> viral loads of HIV and ended with nil viral loads.
> The thing with natural healing is that all
> viruses and bad bacteria get under control. But
> the people were very sick with high HIV viral
> loads and exhibited health when the viral loads
> were gone.
>

not saying bacteria don't exist. I am saying they are not proximate cause.


> [www.duesberg.com]
>
> "Since AIDS is defined by new combinations of
> conventional diseases, it may be caused by new
> combinations of conventional pathogens, including
> acute viral or microbial infections and chronic
> drug use and malnutrition. The long and
> unpredictable intervals between infection with HIV
> and AIDS would then reflect the thresholds for
> these pathogenic factors to cause AIDS diseases,
> instead of an unlikely mechanism of HIV
> pathogenesis"

well he was half way there.

Fresh
did he have the patients engage in health practices to strengthen the body?

Tai
Yes, Richard Schulze had his patients on fresh raw juices, potassium broth, massive doses of herbs to detox organs and blood and build immune system, SIX cloves of garlic daily, super hot habanero and african bird pepper, superfood that was like a vitamin mineral supplement, colon hydrotherapy, intense hydrotherapy, etc etc. FOr people who were not dying of their disease, he allowed them to eat raw food in addition to juices.

Fresh
not saying bacteria don't exist. I am saying they are not proximate cause.

Tai
I don't know one amazingly successful natural healer who says bacteria are a primary cause of disease, because extremely healthy people are very resistant. Natural healers know that when the body is clean, one is very unlikely to get EASILY infected. But at the same time, I don't know any ordinary human natural healer that would knowingly swallow a vial of active virus, no matter how healthy or resistant they think they are..

Natural Hygiene has some interesting ideas about bacteria and viruses. I don't think all NH practitioners agree on this topic. For example, DR. Goldhammer works with Dr. Klapper and DR. McDougall, so they agree on basic medical ideas. I was on the phone with Dr. Klapper last week, as I asked him to talk to a stubborn vegan who was too enamored with water fasting to treat his deficient anemia. Goldhammer would have talked to him, if Klapper was unavailable but Klapper was very helpful and very reasonable. These NH-friendly doctors are normal doctors whose NH beliefs don't defy science.

I feel like dropping this topic now that you said you do believe that bacteria exist. Maybe it was that some NHers don't believe that viruses exist. Of course I believe in viruses. But I also believe in karma particles. Science can only explain so much. Like how can anyone explain how my friend cured a woman of vitiligo without any medicine or dietary change and he unfortunately got the disease immediately after. Vitiligo is not infectious. Of course, he never intended that to happen, but he used a technique that he doesn't have full control over. His story is sadly not so uncommon. I know of so many cases like this in the reiki and energy healing community. Well, no point in talking about these things if one has never heard or encountered these things before.

i do believe in science, but I know there are even more microscopic things that science has not explained yet.

Tai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fresh
> did he have the patients engage in health
> practices to strengthen the body?
>
> Tai
> Yes, Richard Schulze had his patients on fresh raw
> juices, potassium broth, massive doses of herbs to
> detox organs and blood and build immune system,
> SIX cloves of garlic daily, super hot habanero and
> african bird pepper, superfood that was like a
> vitamin mineral supplement, colon hydrotherapy,
> intense hydrotherapy, etc etc. FOr people who were
> not dying of their disease, he allowed them to eat
> raw food in addition to juices.
>

exactly. strengthened the body so it could clean out and remove all toxins. does not mean the primary cause was microorganisms. in fact that is an admission that it is not.


> Fresh
> not saying bacteria don't exist. I am saying they
> are not proximate cause.
>
> Tai
> I don't know one amazingly successful natural
> healer who says bacteria are a primary cause of
> disease,

that IS natural hygiene. the principles that you seemed to be saying were false.

because extremely healthy people are very
> resistant. Natural healers know that when the
> body is clean, one is very unlikely to get EASILY
> infected. But at the same time, I don't know any
> ordinary human natural healer that would knowingly
> swallow a vial of active virus, no matter how
> healthy or resistant they think they are..
>


> Natural Hygiene has some interesting ideas about
> bacteria and viruses. I don't think all NH
> practitioners agree on this topic. For example,
> DR. Goldhammer works with Dr. Klapper and DR.
> McDougall, so they agree on basic medical ideas.
> I was on the phone with Dr. Klapper last week, as
> I asked him to talk to a stubborn vegan who was
> too enamored with water fasting to treat his
> deficient anemia. Goldhammer would have talked to
> him, if Klapper was unavailable but Klapper was
> very helpful and very reasonable. These
> NH-friendly doctors are normal doctors whose NH
> beliefs don't defy science.
>

science is not as fixed or decided as you may think

> I feel like dropping this topic now that you said
> you do believe that bacteria exist. Maybe it was
> that some NHers don't believe that viruses exist.


right . it's been said by some NHers that they are fragments that are given agency but the cells they are allegedly invading are the active agents.

> Of course I believe in viruses. But I also believe
> in karma particles. Science can only explain so
> much. Like how can anyone explain how my friend
> cured a woman of vitiligo without any medicine or
> dietary change and he unfortunately got the
> disease immediately after. Vitiligo is not
> infectious. Of course, he never intended that to
> happen, but he used a technique that he doesn't
> have full control over. His story is sadly not so
> uncommon. I know of so many cases like this in the
> reiki and energy healing community. Well, no
> point in talking about these things if one has
> never heard or encountered these things before.
>
> i do believe in science, but I know there are even
> more microscopic things that science has not
> explained yet.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> organic1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > And when you've got raw food gurus like John
> Rose
> > who claims to dig out his every bowel movement,
> > stick it on his scales so he can weigh it, bag
> it,
> > document it and add it his collection.
> >
> > You can imagine spreading infections is highly
> > likely.
> >
> > And John Rose claims to have weighed every
> single
> > bowel movement hes done since 1994 or
> something.



> It's bad enough that the old obsolete fruitarian
> type gurus think they are immune to such things
> but it's horrible that they teach such dangerous
> stupidity to the younger generations - the younger
> generations that end up being, basically, the
> indentured servants to the elite at the WFF.
>
> Glad to see the younger vegans starting to speak
> out on the young whistleblower's video about such
> practices.

I want to be clear on who I am referring to here as the "elite" at the Woodstock fruit festival. That would be ONLY the Arnsteins. That would NOT be those well meaning people who have been suckered into promoting his festivals and into working for him 12 hours a day at his carnivals.

so in other words you do NOT POSSESS the necessary maturity to admit that your title of this thread and its associated false accusations repeated from an unreliable witness were WRONG. and that you DO NOT apologize for propagating his slander.