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dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 03, 2018 11:35PM

Dealing with oxalic acid in raw green juice

We know from previous studies l have posted that the sulfated sugars in brown sea weeds can neutralize the negative effects of oxalic acid, but lets not forget that the various bacterias from fermented food DO break down oxalic acid also.

My experience with high oxalic acid juice

Recently l picked chard from a local farm that was extremely high in oxalic acid. The chard juice burned my mouth and dried it out, and it was difficult to consume the juice because it took a long time to drink and wasn't smooth going down.

How l tamed the oxalic acid by neutralizing it

I used 2 oz of rejuvalic per 8 oz of chard juice and the burning sensation and mouth drying went immediately. The juice went from being chalky and hot to smooth.

More nutrition by using rejuvalic in green juice


You also get much less potential mineral binding because the rejuvalic neutralizes the oxalic acid. You would likely get much more bioavailable nutrition from your green drink. Highly recommended!

www.thesproutarian.com



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2018 11:44PM by The Sproutarian Man.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: RawPracticalist ()
Date: January 04, 2018 02:22AM

>I used 2 oz of rejuvalic per 8 oz of chard juice and the burning sensation and mouth drying went immediately. The juice went from being chalky and hot to smooth.

Good post on a very important issue.

I will try it on beet root and leaves juice which are very in oxalic acid.

It will be interesting to see a quantifiable measure of the effectiveness of the ferment in reducing oxalic acid.
The burning sensation may not been felt but the oxalic acid may still be there just like when we add salt to garlic, the garlic will still hurt us.

The only study I am aware of was on carrot juice. [www.dailyiron.net]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 02:41AM by RawPracticalist.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: John Rose ()
Date: January 04, 2018 01:51PM

Thanks for your hard work and for sharing your information.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: Tai ()
Date: January 04, 2018 04:30PM

Kudos to sproutarian man for drinking chard juice. I know it's not microgreens, but it's rich in vitamins and minerals. TSM, chard varies greatly from farm to farm. My favorite farms produce very salty chard and beet greens, while store bought chard is barely salty.

Many people, including raw foodists benefit from fermented foods and drinks. Yet some people cannot tolerate them and even have allergic reactions.
Donna Gates from body ecology, who recommends fermented foods, had to address this issue.
[bodyecology.com]

Therefore, it's good to have non-fermented solutions as alternatives.
The gerson therapy famously includes chard in the juice, but it's combined with mild things like green apple, pepper, lettuce, etc, so those mild things dilute the more potent leaves like chard.

[purejuicer.com]

Green Juice
Ingredients for 8 oz / 236 ml Green Juice:

6-7 big leaves (with stalk) of romaine
Red leaf lettuce
2-3 leaves of escarole
2-3 leave of endive
3-4 leaves of red cabbage
2-3 young inner beet tops (inner leaves)
2 leaves of Swiss chard
A quarter of a green bell pepper
3-4 leaves of watercress
1 medium green apple, Granny Smith or as sour and hard as possible
Try to include as many of the ingredients as possible and do not substitute.
Add enough of the approved ingredients to end up with an 8 ounce green juice.

The gerson program also recommends cooking chard.

Also I have to tell you a California fact. Sometimes we get such massive huge chard in big quantities, there's no way to drink all the juice unless you would give it away. It's no wonder that Europeans pasteurize and bottle vegetable juice for the winter when it snows. Anyway, at times I would make a gallon of pure chard juice (in excess of what I would drink). I would use that to cook sprouted black beans. I didn't use water but only juice to cook the beans. Then i blended the cooked beans with fresh chard juice. I also added other things of course. One bowl was filling for each person. No one experienced oxalic acid discomfort. It seems similar to raw taro root which has dangerous oxalic acid but is softened and made digestible with cooking.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 04:36PM by Tai.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 04, 2018 11:45PM

Quote
RawPracticalist


The only study I am aware of was on carrot juice. [www.dailyiron.net]

Thanks for that study, i've been trying to find that study for years because l lost it.

Quote
John Rose
Thanks for your hard work and for sharing your information.

No problems, it needs to be done because many people are concerned with this issue.

Quote
Tai
Kudos to sproutarian man for drinking chard juice. I know it's not microgreens, but it's rich in vitamins and minerals.

Yes,l am trying to expand my raw diet outlook and experiment with different foods so l am able to help more people. The chard is impressively rich in vitamins and minerals.




Quote
Tai
TSM, chard varies greatly from farm to farm.

The farm l go to seems to have spinach like plants high in oxalic acid. The spinach my neighbour grew was so high in oxalic acid that it brought about great pain that laid me low for hours and it was burning hot. Different growing conditions bring forth variations in phytochemical anti-nutrients. I have some studies to back this up.



Quote
Tai
Many people, including raw foodists benefit from fermented foods and drinks. Yet some people cannot tolerate them and even have allergic reactions.
Donna Gates from body ecology, who recommends fermented foods, had to address this issue.
[bodyecology.com]


Therefore, it's good to have non-fermented solutions as alternatives.
The gerson therapy famously includes chard in the juice, but it's combined with mild things like green apple, pepper, lettuce, etc, so those mild things dilute the more potent leaves like chard.

Excellent points you make. For me to help more people l need to learn to expand my knowledge and be able to use a variety of methods. I am using this current opportunity to learn about low fat living.





Quote
Tai
Also I have to tell you a California fact. Sometimes we get such massive huge chard in big quantities, there's no way to drink all the juice unless you would give it away. It's no wonder that Europeans pasteurize and bottle vegetable juice for the winter when it snows. Anyway, at times I would make a gallon of pure chard juice (in excess of what I would drink). I would use that to cook sprouted black beans. I didn't use water but only juice to cook the beans. Then i blended the cooked beans with fresh chard juice. I also added other things of course. One bowl was filling for each person. No one experienced oxalic acid discomfort. It seems similar to raw taro root which has dangerous oxalic acid but is softened and made digestible with cooking.

If l was on holidays i'd juice a gallon a day for 2 - 3 weeks and use rejuvalic to keep the oxalic acid under control, but that is just me. I used to juice a gallon a hot weed juice...a HUGE bag full. I felt amazing afterwards.

The weed juice from the forest was extra hot and made me feel like a fire breathing dragon, while the weeds from the farm were far less potent. Thistles were always my favourite, but l also got dandelion and would also juice cheese weed and nettle for extra flavour.

www.thesproutarian.com



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 11:52PM by The Sproutarian Man.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: January 05, 2018 12:43AM

TSM,

What do you think of using apple cider vinegar in soak water?

Malic acid and oxalic acid spraying enhances phytic acid degradation and total antioxidant capacity of mung bean sprouts

www.phytopanacea.com

Phyto (of a plant; relating to plants)
Panacea (a solution or remedy for all difficulties or diseases)

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 05, 2018 07:37PM

Quote
jtprindl
TSM,

What do you think of using apple cider vinegar in soak water?

Malic acid and oxalic acid spraying enhances phytic acid degradation and total antioxidant capacity of mung bean sprouts


Yes, ACV is certainly well known for breaking down anti nutrients, and certainly it is a great strategy for those who may not be suited to fermented foods.

(As Tai has got me to appreciate, everyone is different so we must have a wide variety of methods in our tool kit to be able to help various people, otherwise our usefulness to help can be limited).

Remember also, anti nutrients are often phytochemicals with many health benefits, so the key thing is not to have significant nutrient binding or poor health effects from anti nutrients. I have found that building up good bacteria levels in the body do help the body to naturally break down foods much better, and this has been observed by how I can now digest raw legume and grain sprouts much better without any need to ferment them, and I recall the science showing fermented foods building up bacterial levels which then allow better digestion and breaking down of anti nutrients (95% sure of this...I have the study saved up somewhere). None-the-less, if one needs more support they can always use other strategies to break down the anti nutrients before the foods are eaten, and this is where ACV or fermented foods come into it.

www.thesproutarian.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2018 07:38PM by The Sproutarian Man.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: January 05, 2018 08:29PM

Quote
The Sproutarian Man
Quote
jtprindl
TSM,

What do you think of using apple cider vinegar in soak water?

Malic acid and oxalic acid spraying enhances phytic acid degradation and total antioxidant capacity of mung bean sprouts


Yes, ACV is certainly well known for breaking down anti nutrients, and certainly it is a great strategy for those who may not be suited to fermented foods.

(As Tai has got me to appreciate, everyone is different so we must have a wide variety of methods in our tool kit to be able to help various people, otherwise our usefulness to help can be limited).

Remember also, anti nutrients are often phytochemicals with many health benefits, so the key thing is not to have significant nutrient binding or poor health effects from anti nutrients. I have found that building up good bacteria levels in the body do help the body to naturally break down foods much better, and this has been observed by how I can now digest raw legume and grain sprouts much better without any need to ferment them, and I recall the science showing fermented foods building up bacterial levels which then allow better digestion and breaking down of anti nutrients (95% sure of this...I have the study saved up somewhere). None-the-less, if one needs more support they can always use other strategies to break down the anti nutrients before the foods are eaten, and this is where ACV or fermented foods come into it.

How do you get most of your probiotics and do you get a vast array of different probiotic strains? Some fermented foods contain lots of probiotics but are limited in strains.

www.phytopanacea.com

Phyto (of a plant; relating to plants)
Panacea (a solution or remedy for all difficulties or diseases)

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: Horsea ()
Date: January 10, 2018 03:37PM

I will try it on beet root and leaves juice which are very in oxalic acid.

It is not clear to me if beet roots contain oxalates or not. Some say yes, others say not. The leaves - yes, for sure. However, raw beet root juice is famous for burning your throat so I wonder what would cause that effect, ie, something other than oxalates? Anyone know? I love raw crushed beets with lemon juice and don't get the burning effect that way.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 10, 2018 08:09PM

Quote
jtprindl

How do you get most of your probiotics and do you get a vast array of different probiotic strains? Some fermented foods contain lots of probiotics but are limited in strains.

I try not to over complicate things too much when it comes to diet. Why? Because a diet should be simple and easy to follow. Especially these days l try not to get obsessive about too many details.

I basically use various fermented grains and fermented nuts/sprouted seeds to get my probiotics. These foodstuffs are some of the most nutritious nutrient foods you can find and also rich in the highly important macronutrients that create enzymes from starches, fats and protein. Do they contain all the probiotic strains?...maybe not, but do we need to consume all the probiotic strains in order to be healthy?? I'd say no because the body also produces bacterias to break things down. In addition, l also get a variety of prebiotics from various foods also.

All we can do is eat high nutrient food and find a diet that works for us, and reduce stress as much as possible and try to be really good people, + some exercise. We can't do any more than that. See....the formulae is quite simple. Will that be enough to be healthy?...hopefully so.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: January 10, 2018 09:57PM

Quote
The Sproutarian Man
Quote
jtprindl

How do you get most of your probiotics and do you get a vast array of different probiotic strains? Some fermented foods contain lots of probiotics but are limited in strains.

I try not to over complicate things too much when it comes to diet. Why? Because a diet should be simple and easy to follow. Especially these days l try not to get obsessive about too many details.

I basically use various fermented grains and fermented nuts/sprouted seeds to get my probiotics. These foodstuffs are some of the most nutritious nutrient foods you can find and also rich in the highly important macronutrients that create enzymes from starches, fats and protein. Do they contain all the probiotic strains?...maybe not, but do we need to consume all the probiotic strains in order to be healthy?? I'd say no because the body also produces bacterias to break things down. In addition, l also get a variety of prebiotics from various foods also.

All we can do is eat high nutrient food and find a diet that works for us, and reduce stress as much as possible and try to be really good people, + some exercise. We can't do any more than that. See....the formulae is quite simple. Will that be enough to be healthy?...hopefully so.


I wholeheartedly agree!

How would you compare fermented grains, nuts and seeds for probiotics to this product? [hippocratesinst.org]

Have you ever thought about eating natto? It's a type of fermented soy rich in nattokinase (potent proteolytic enzyme), PQQ (pyrroloquinoline quinone), a powerful anti-aging compound that stimulates the generation of NEW mitochondria and lots of vitamin K2.

I think the most important micro-green by far is FRESH brocolli sprouts due to its high levels of sulforaphane. It's a super-nutrient that rapidly detoxifies environmental pollution, targets cancer stem cells, enhances brain function, etc, but it has to be chewed in order to be activated and degrades easily hence why fresh is essential. The effects of sulforaphane also last 72+ hours.

www.phytopanacea.com

Phyto (of a plant; relating to plants)
Panacea (a solution or remedy for all difficulties or diseases)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2018 10:01PM by jtprindl.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 10, 2018 10:18PM

Quote
jtprindl



I wholeheartedly agree!

How would you compare fermented grains, nuts and seeds for probiotics to this product? [hippocratesinst.org]

Good question. I was once reading a scientific study talking about how supplements can miss a large number of probiotic strains. And lets also ask, have all probiotic strains been discovered,and if not, then probiotics from wholefoods would certainly be bettre than supplements. For an average person l think the probiotics from naturally prepared foods are better, but for one who is very ill with a weak immune system a guaranteed clean probiotic supplement would probably be better,so l can understand why HHI sells such things.

And lets not forget the old HHI argument that rejuvalic bacteria is bad, but this flies against the world wide experience of fermented foods being so beneficial to people all around the world and for people in 3rd world countries etc. So many people benefit from fermented foods without being extra careful how they are prepared.


Quote
jtprindl
Have you ever thought about eating natto? It's a type of fermented soy rich in nattokinase (potent proteolytic enzyme), PQQ (pyrroloquinoline quinone), a powerful anti-aging compound that stimulates the generation of NEW mitochondria and lots of vitamin K2.

I prefer to just do a fermented soy bean rejuvalic. It's easier for me.



Quote
jtprindl
I think the most important micro-green by far is FRESH brocolli sprouts due to its high levels of sulforaphane. It's a super-nutrient that rapidly detoxifies environmental pollution, targets cancer stem cells, enhances brain function, etc, but it has to be chewed in order to be activated and degrades easily hence why fresh is essential. The effects of sulforaphane also last 72+ hours.


SPOT ON!!!!! Broccoli sprouts along with dacon radish microgreens is one of the greatest greens you can get because of the reasons you state. The powerful antioxidant action of sulforaphane seems potently unmatched. These are essentials in any serious raw diet. Along with this, the vitamin A and E and C is at crazy levels. The sunflower greens are also a potent weapon and one of the highest antioxidant plants.

Personally l think broccoli and Dacon radish sprouts are the king!



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2018 10:21PM by The Sproutarian Man.

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: January 10, 2018 10:47PM

Quote
The Sproutarian Man
Quote
jtprindl



I wholeheartedly agree!

How would you compare fermented grains, nuts and seeds for probiotics to this product? [hippocratesinst.org]

Good question. I was once reading a scientific study talking about how supplements can miss a large number of probiotic strains. And lets also ask, have all probiotic strains been discovered,and if not, then probiotics from wholefoods would certainly be bettre than supplements. For an average person l think the probiotics from naturally prepared foods are better, but for one who is very ill with a weak immune system a guaranteed clean probiotic supplement would probably be better,so l can understand why HHI sells such things.

And lets not forget the old HHI argument that rejuvalic bacteria is bad, but this flies against the world wide experience of fermented foods being so beneficial to people all around the world and for people in 3rd world countries etc. So many people benefit from fermented foods without being extra careful how they are prepared.


Quote
jtprindl
Have you ever thought about eating natto? It's a type of fermented soy rich in nattokinase (potent proteolytic enzyme), PQQ (pyrroloquinoline quinone), a powerful anti-aging compound that stimulates the generation of NEW mitochondria and lots of vitamin K2.

I prefer to just do a fermented soy bean rejuvalic. It's easier for me.



Quote
jtprindl
I think the most important micro-green by far is FRESH brocolli sprouts due to its high levels of sulforaphane. It's a super-nutrient that rapidly detoxifies environmental pollution, targets cancer stem cells, enhances brain function, etc, but it has to be chewed in order to be activated and degrades easily hence why fresh is essential. The effects of sulforaphane also last 72+ hours.


SPOT ON!!!!! Broccoli sprouts along with dacon radish microgreens is one of the greatest greens you can get because of the reasons you state. The powerful antioxidant action of sulforaphane seems potently unmatched. These are essentials in any serious raw diet. Along with this, the vitamin A and E and C is at crazy levels. The sunflower greens are also a potent weapon and one of the highest antioxidant plants.

Personally l think broccoli and Dacon radish sprouts are the king!


Yeah I don't think supplements are an absolute replacement for fermented foods, but they can help a lot. Certainly more microbiome research needs to be conducted for more information about individual strains as well as interactions between strains.

Interesting, I didn't know broccoli sprouts had high levels of A, C, and E. How much per 100g?

www.phytopanacea.com

Phyto (of a plant; relating to plants)
Panacea (a solution or remedy for all difficulties or diseases)

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Re: dealing with oxalic acid effectively
Date: January 10, 2018 10:55PM

Quote
jtprindl


Interesting, I didn't know broccoli sprouts had high levels of A, C, and E. How much per 100g?

I was talking more about dacon-radish.

Far more vitamin C than oranges and almost anything on earth.
Far more vitamin A than almost anything on earth (very few exceptions)
Far more vitamin E than pretty much anything on earth.

The problem is that they must be had in limited amounts because it is easy to overdose on vitamin K1. Only 100 g of juice every second day at most.

The science on dacon-radish microgreens is mind blowing.Not available online for public viewing unfortunbately, but l did a great summery of this on this forum proving microgreens are far more nutritious than vegetables.

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