HIYA!

I'm intrigued by the idea of mono eating. I've never tried it as a way of life. But when I consider whether a person could get all the nutrients they need EACH day (or even most days), it seems unlikely. I could go to fitday.com and the other one but I'd rather ask for comments here! Or, I'll do the other as well, but not just now.

Bryan, I've seen where you posted some typical days' meals for three seasons. Again, I haven't checked those days' food intakes with fitday and the other, but I'm guessing that you don't meet the Recommended DAILY Amounts. I do believe you're doing well with this way of eating.



This way is not compatible with Zen practice. This way IS Zen practice. - Dr. Doug Graham

Nothing whatsoever should be attached to. - Buddha

For cleasning especially yes.Besides that I wouldn't make to much A HABIT Of it as our food these days aren't the ones we once had,nutritionally.

IMO-it;s the ideal way of eating.Just whether or not our surroundings can match it.

Laters...

See you at the top!!

Well, if you are doing 80-10-10 and you eat 2000 kcal of monomeals, which might be, say

10 bananas
10 oranges
1 head of romaine (5% of kcals)
25 g almonds

You will not meet your daily needs for protein, vitamin E, iron, selenium, sodium, zinc, or omega6 fatty acids. [not counting B12 or D which must be addressed separately].

But instead, if you substitute some different things for some of those bananas, oranges, and almonds, keeping fat and kcal levels the same and keeping the lettuce, say like this:

collards
celery
apples
spinach
cucumbers
tomato
flax
onions
grapes
strawberries
wax gourd
watermelon
papaya
brazil nut

You will meet all vitamin needs [again except B12 and D] and all mineral needs. You'll get about 50% more protein and three times as many essential fatty acids.

Plus you will get a much wider variety of protective phytochemicals which are beneficial. Plus you will be avoiding concentrated sources of potentially adverse things from a particular crop or site that might have had something like contaminated fecal matter from the nearby cattlefarm that had poor cows infected with the E. coli variant O157:H7 that comes from the irritated intestines of cows fed with grains that don't suit them.

But you will probably eat less if you monoeat, and possibly feel a greater sense of "purity."

so 1000kcals a day would be half?is this too little to eat being a raw foodist on a weight loss program?thanks taylor

omg I think I am on the road to mono.

I like to cut up fruits and make non fruit salads of avocados and tomatoes,cucumbers etc.. the past few times the taste of salt, even a little bit, ruins the dish..

that is a miracle, all my life I have been addicted to salt..

I have a whole bag of himalayan SS I need to give away..lolI know my next step is just to savor the flavor of fruits individually..





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/24/2007 08:16PM by coconutcream.

taylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> so 1000kcals a day would be half?is this too
> little to eat being a raw foodist on a weight loss
> program?thanks taylor

It depends on your height, weight, etc. 1000kcals a day seems awfully low to me. If you go too low, you can do your body/weight loss more harm than good.

coconutcream Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> omg I think I am on the road to mono.
>
> I like to cut up fruits and make non fruit salads
> of avocados and tomatoes,cucumbers etc.. the past
> few times the taste of salt, even a little bit,
> ruins the dish..
>
> that is a miracle, all my life I have been
> addicted to salt..
>
> I have a whole bag of himalayan SS I need to give
> away..lolI know my next step is just to savor the
> flavor of fruits individually..

I used to have the same problem...I would salt everything on a cooked diet salad, pizza you name it!

It's just like anything else once you cut it out for a long time, your taste buds change and then you don't find it appetizing anymore...isn't it nice?

taylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> so 1000kcals a day would be half?is this too
> little to eat being a raw foodist on a weight loss
> program?thanks taylor

This all depends on your height weight female or male? How much exercise are you doing, how intense? etc.

I still find it amazing that my tastes have changed so much. Things that used to taste good really just don't appeal to me at all. It really is wonderful.

Some people say calories do not matter when raw (I understand that fat matters, however). What do you all think about that. I can't imagine that arugula's 2000 kcal diet example would cause anyone to gain weight but I could be wrong about that. I would love to know what raw individual experience says about the theory that a calorie is a calorie or to the belief that counting calories is unnecessary when raw.

Peace,
Inner Beauty

I have been all mono...all raw...all fruit for several years now. I am the healthiest guy I know. I just finished 23rd out of 200 at the last 5K run. LOL. Remember that diet is a small part of where we are going as a person. There are other things like light exercise, good/deep breathing, joyful job and passionate daily living, pure water, sunbathing and sungazing, service work, etc. Intend to be kind and loving to yourself....and you may or may not be lead to different ways of living. There is certainly no ONE way for humans - in my opinion. But of course, I personally am a big fan of improvement of diet as a direct way to improve one's health. Just my personal take. Power to you. Everyone here is a great support and resource to me!

-David Z. Mason

I would like to meet you Dave, next time you come up to Miami

Dear Yogamama-i know what u mean.i had shredded up raw collard greens with diced up raw zucchini,grated carrots,broccoli flowerettes tonite-made a big salad and i got 1/4 a avocado and mashed it and put some sun-dried tomatoe sauce i had made and mixed it in the avocado and used it as a dressing on my salad and carrot,celery,broccoli juice with flax seed mixed in to drink.all so very very good. how could i of ever liked some of the bad stuff i did?so i sure know what u are saying.everything is very good.taylor

<innerbeauty> Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some people say calories do not matter when raw (I
> understand that fat matters, however). What do
> you all think about that. I can't imagine that
> arugula's 2000 kcal diet example would cause
> anyone to gain weight but I could be wrong about
> that. I would love to know what raw individual
> experience says about the theory that a calorie is
> a calorie or to the belief that counting calories
> is unnecessary when raw.
>
> Peace,
> Inner Beauty


Inner Beauty,

calories do matter raw or not. If you eat more than you burn for a period of time, you will gain weight. I was eating a lot of nuts on a daily basis for a few months and before I know it, I had gained 10 lbs. Obviously I ate a lot of fat so yet that's why I put on the weight but never the less the nuts were raw. But I'm sure the same thing would happen with fruits and greens...you'd have to eat a whole lot and really just sit around on your ass all day... : )

My opinion is that one should not bother with counting calories.One should observe one's body closely and interpret the signals given.I say, eat when you're hungry and eat until you're satisfied.You cannot pour a bucket of water into a cup and expect the cup to hold it and you cannot pour a cup of water into a bucket and expect it to be full.2000 cals(or any amount) is just a figure and if it's not enough for you you'll feel hungry, and cranky among other things and if it's too much then the body has to spend precious energy trying to get rid of it.Yes,even the healthiest of foods can be unclean to our system and has to be gotten rid of if one overeats.
Now I know that if one doesn't eat plenty of calories there's is the risk of not getting all the nutrients the USDA recommends but raw foodists do not believe the USDA suggestions on many things,why suddenly see their calorie count and nutrition data as gospel truth? Observing your body will tell you more than any Goverment recommendations.
One example is on the lack of vitamin B12 the USDA says is in a vegetarian diet.My grandparents were from India and they were vegetarians all their life.They lived to be 102,94,88,64yrs of age(the 64 yr old died of an infection).They didn't even know what a vitamin was,much less B12. Go tell the hundreds of thousands in India that their vegetarian habits (going back centuries) has made them deficient in B12.They would laugh at you.
I say, be careful of the people who try to show you the "truth" because it was done in some study.Most studies have financial motives behind them.Most of these very people are struggling to be healthy.Their data isn't doing them good.And look at the person who eats and lives simply,who listens to his body and you generally will see a more radiant and healthier person.This is my view.Peace.
Brian

"Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent." -- Calvin Coolidge

Oh sure Coco! I should be down the weekend of the 3rd or so. I'll head over to the Saturday Glaser Farms Market about 11 am and hang! I'll be the guy wearing the green T-shirt that says: You are what you eat! Ha! ha!

-I'll drop you an e-mail just to let you know I'm heading down that way. The Avocados are on me!

-David Z. Mason

brian1cs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One should observe one's body
> closely and interpret the signals given.I say, eat
> when you're hungry and eat until you're
> satisfied.

This should prevent people from gaining or losing.
But we have a lot of people who have "messed up" signals
from a lifetime of bad habits in a toxic food society.
So it doesn't always work. Also some people who limit
fats on a raw vegan diet will have difficulty getting
enough kcals.

> Observing your
> body will tell you more than any Goverment
> recommendations.


But we have now sophisticated tests that can
detect insufficiences before symptoms manifest
so there is no reason to wait for actual harm
to develop before taking action.

Also there is a lot more literature and a lot
more detailed information. Also people in academia
have a mandate to publish or perish. They put their
best into publishing high quality material: nobody
wants to run a junk study. But some of them will have
turned out to have chased after the wind, that is
certain.

> One example is on the lack of vitamin B12 the USDA
> says is in a vegetarian diet.My grandparents were
> from India and they were vegetarians all their
> life.They lived to be 102,94,88,64yrs of age(the
> 64 yr old died of an infection).They didn't even
> know what a vitamin was,much less B12.

If they were vegetarian and not vegan, that would
explain it. Vegetarians generally have low but
adequate B12 status. It's the long-term vegans
who are most likely to run into problems.

TroySantos,

Over the last 12 months, I've eaten 2 varieties of durian, mangosteens, dragonfruits, 2 varieties of pineapples, 8 varieties of mangos, white sapotes, 6 varieties of tangerines, 3 varieties of apples, 4 varieties of pears, 3 varieties of oranges, 5 varieties of bananas, tamarind, 2 varieties of papaya, 2 varieties of grapefruits, 4 varieties of avocados, 10 varieties of tomatoes, 5 varieties of cucumber, celery, 8 varieties of lettuce, 3 varieties of cabbage, 7 varieties of grapes, 3 varieties of strawberries, wild blackberries, various wild greens (purslane, lambsquarters, miners lettuce, mallow), 6 varieties of figs, 4 varieties of persimmons, 8 varieties of red watermelon, 2 varieties of yellow watermelon, 6 varieties of orange melon, 4 varieties of green melon, 4 varieties of plums, 6 varieties of peaches, 4 kind of nectarines, etc, etc.

I get quite a bit of variety. Most of that foods I eat are organic, and high in vitamins and minerals. The USDA charts for nutrient are for commercially grown foods, known to be lower in nutrients than organic foods.

It is not necessary for me get variety in each meal. Over the year, I am getting quite a bit of variety in the foods I eat.

Many of the nutrient in the RDA are overstated for political reasons. This includes protein, zinc, etc, the nutrients that are associated with animal products.

Also, cooking reduces the quality of the proteins, fats, and carbohydrates in foods. It also diminishes the vitamin and mineral quality of the food. I've learned that the amino acids become deranged with application of heat, and the body uses these deranged amino acids to build deranged human proteins. It is understood that the body loses under 8 grams of protein a day from shedding skin, hair, nail, semen, etc. These 8 grams need to be replenished with high quality raw protein, and anything more than that is probably used for energy rather than building blocks. There may be billions of cells that die in the human body each day, but for the most part, the amino acids are recovered and recycled into new living cells. The same is true for minerals in the body.

Minerals are consumed in the body to neutralize acidic conditions. A person with my kind of diet isn't going to have an acidic body, so this isn't going to be a big problems. In my body, I am so mineralized that I suspect most of my food needs are for fuel rather than nutrients. But I've been 100% raw for over 5 years, and eating in an 80/10/10 fashion for over 4.5 of those years.

There are very few on this board who have the experience I have. Dave is one of them. And both Dave and I are saying that we feel good from out diet alone, and we are not worried about being properly nourished or deficient, based on the way we feel, and based on how we are seeing our bodies operate.

I did a 3 day water fast over the holidays, and it was only necessary for me to drink 1/4 to 1/2 cup of water a day. For most people, this would seem outrageous. But it was effortless for me, and I wasn't thirsty. Its funny, that I when I am eating no foods, I require a half cup of water, and there are people out there eating 3000 calories a days and consuming a gallon of water, or that one woman on a juice fast drinking a gallon of juice a day, and still needing to drink water on top of all that juice.

Arugula> But we have a lot of people who have "messed up" signals
>from a lifetime of bad habits in a toxic food society.
>So it doesn't always work.

It always works and doesn't take long.

Arugula> Also some people who limit
>fats on a raw vegan diet will have difficulty getting
>enough kcals.

Speak for yourself.I already asked you to post your picture up here(since you getting the correct amount of kcals)so people can see what you look like.You have avoided that like the plague.

Arugula.>But we have now sophisticated tests that can
>detect insufficiences before symptoms manifest
>so there is no reason to wait for actual harm
>to develop before taking action.

Raw fooders have a sophisticated way of eating that can correct insufficiencies and heal even after symptoms manifest. It all begins by observing your body.

Arugula>They put their
>best into publishing high quality material: nobody
>wants to run a junk study.

Tha's a lie as sure as the sun rose today.Lots of junk studies are done and pushed down the people's throats as truth and I can see you've done your share of gobbling because of the stuff you regurgitate.

Arugula>Vegetarians generally have low but
>adequate B12 status. It's the long-term vegans
>who are most likely to run into problems.

My grandparents ate no animals or animal products.They didn't run into b12 deficiency problems.So have countlessssss others.

Bryan, a lot of your foods are in the same family, genus, or species. So such choices might not provide as much variety as you suspect. But you are avoiding the problem of overreliance on products from contaminated fields.

Another thing is that organic foods can be higher in some nutrients and lower in others. I have not read any studies showing consistenly higher levels across the board. There is still a great deal of debate. The bottom line always seems to be: eat more f+v, organic or not. That is also my position, although if I were wealthy I would buy more organic, if only to support the producers.

I had read, in my salad days, that the US RDAs were politically motivated, and I still suspect that to some extent it might be true. But after seeing RDAs for a number of Asian countries, Europe, and Australia, and seeing how remarkably consistent they are except for the wildly anomalous calcium (which I think is too high), I don't think there is any signifiant conspiracy.

I agree that there might be a justification for lowering some nutrient needs based on uncooked foods that are undamaged. I strongly suspect that a good deal of the benefits from methionine restriction are directly related to how easily that amino acid is oxidized.

But just how much damage jacks up the need for everything else remains a matter of speculation. I doubt it's much at all for minerals. It might be a little bit for some vitamins, But most vitamins are not a problem on raw, it's the minerals and some of the essential aminos and lipids that are more problematic.

>My grandparents ate no animals or animal products.They didn't run into b12 deficiency problems.So have countlessssss others.

It has been discussed that fertilizing one's produce with human excrement and possibly that of animals can stave off a B12 deficiency. It has also been discussed that in locales with less sanitation there is less of a risk for deficiency because there are traces of feces and dirt in the produce.

I am not showing my pic because I prefer my privacy. No manner or number of insults or insinuations will change that. So why don't you stop? Your manner is inappropriate.

I am on a new mission to play more with mono-eating. It is easy for me to do for breakfast and lunch but by dinnertime I am ready for the smoothie or the salad or sometimes it's serial mono-eating: eat one thing till i've had enough then i switch to something else so my appetite is stimulated again, then i can keep going!

I have an intention to play more with the mono-eating. A friend suggested I try doing a day of all-mono-eating, once a week. So I am looking at that. Just to have my own experience about it instead of going by someone else's experience or by something I read in a book.

If anyone else would love to play here with me, I would love it!

Love,
Uma

arugula Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am not showing my pic because I prefer my
> privacy. No manner or number of insults or
> insinuations will change that. So why don't you
> stop? Your manner is inappropriate.

Arugula,

My experience of you is that you always come from what you "know", not what you "experience". You seem to always be quoting this or that study, recommended nutrient level of this or that, analysis of food components and so forth.

If you expect people to take your sharing seriously or have it make a difference for them please share with us how all of this knowledge is making a positive difference in the day to day quality of your health. By photos or experience sharing.

From where I stand you have already disposed of your privacy in your sharing of your opinions and laid yourself bare before your readers, so whether or not you care to include your photo makes no difference. Just don't expect me to buy your defense that it is a privacy issue.

A story. The master had been in a long meditation and when he came out of it he exclaimed to his tantrika partner that he had finally achieved god realization, to which she replied, "Yes, but what good is it if you can't take it off your mat?"

Arugula, What good is all of this knowledge you espouse if we can't see that it is working for someone in a practical manner in day to day life?

I have good plasma levels, I still get carded at 43. Etc. I am doing pretty well, actually. But I am a little too thin, thin side of normal. This is actually deliberate. If I gain, it won't go where I want it to go, it will go where I don't want it to do. And also, more importantly, fewer kcals when nutrients are at least adequate are associated with longer life and lower rates of diseases.

I am careful to quote/cite for credibilty and to clearly state where I am expressing my opinions and what I think when it's merely what I think. This is motivated by concientiousness and not by any other reason. Fie on those who think poorly of it! They are completely misinterpreting my input.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/25/2007 04:49AM by arugula.

Arugula,
Thank you for the follow up post. It adds a fuller dimension to your sharing. Carded at 43 is a good thing, right? You're not short. Short is my big sister at 4',10".

I know somebody has worked out all the numbers and factors for what "normal" body weight is for sexes and age brackets. Why the judgement of yourself for being "too thin"? By who's measure? Are you happy and do you feel good?---where you are weight-wise seem to me to be the valid criteria.

Quality of life not quantity. A old friend of mine just died last month at 100 --- San Francisco photographer Ruth Bernhard, one of the greats. A shining example of "what would you say or do if you didn't give a s--t what others thought of you," a life lived fully and full of love.

Love To You,

arugula Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am careful to quote/cite for credibilty and to
> clearly state where I am expressing my opinions
> and what I think when it's merely what I think.
> This is motivated by concientiousness and not by
> any other reason. Fie on those who think poorly of
> it! They are completely misinterpreting my input.


I love you arugula!

uti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Quality of life not quantity. A old friend of mine
> just died last month at 100 --- San Francisco
> photographer Ruth Bernhard, one of the greats. A
> shining example of "what would you say or do if
> you didn't give a s--t what others thought of
> you," a life lived fully and full of love.

Well, yes, I would dearly love to reach a stage
where I didn't care what people thought. I am not
that highly evolved yet. People when they see me are
probably thinking: she would be more attractive with
about 5 more lbs. (or 10)

And yes, I am more interested in quality, not quantity.

At this point I feel that being able to learn more about
the life sciences improves the quality of my life. It is
adding a richness and depth to my understanding and imparting
an heightened sense of appreciation for what I see around me.
It is all mystery and splendor.

When I was young, I had the opportunity to devote my life to
such study and turned my back on it, instead taking a direction
(technical) that in retrospect was probably wrong for me.

I am now trying to make up for lost time.

arugula Wrote:
> Well, yes, I would dearly love to reach a stage
> where I didn't care what people thought. I am not
> that highly evolved yet. People when they see me
> are
> probably thinking: she would be more attractive
> with
> about 5 more lbs. (or 10)

That's what people say about to me as well, you need to put on 10 lbs. blah blah. Don't listen, if you feel comfortable with where you're at and healthy then that's all that matters!

Arugula>It has been discussed that fertilizing one's produce with human excrement >and possibly that of animals can stave off a B12 deficiency.

-I guess you discussed that with the voice that you're hearing in your head.
-You said in a previous post"Those are the people who are most likely to post their pics" meaning the better looking people.So I say that maybe that's the reason why you didn't.
-I believe that for all your data and studies you still don't have good health.
-I want to ask you something if I may-What credentials/degrees do you have in nutrition?
-Your making up for lost time seems be mentally taxing on you and you want to take some people along with you.
-I don't know why but when I read your posts I am reminded of the binary/octal/hex number system.
My advice to you-get a date and forget the data.

Wow, are you projecting! You must be a very insecure person.