i`ve wondered this many times. some say the body/flesh dies and our souls go to be with God. some say the energy that we are doesn`t die it just changes form. well what type of form? some say we die period. what do y`all think?
patty

I think this life is just like our dreams, it's one of the dreams, we are dreaming what is in our minds, and when we die, it is the dream finishing, and then we go on to another dream (life). If you ever Lucid Dreamed, you would know how real dreams are, just like this life seems real.

Also, I think we (our consciousness) are huge, and we are not only experiencing this life right now, but we are experiencing other lives on other parallel universes, other planes, other dimensions.

Also, I read that when we die, for about three days we are pure consciousness, like in Heaven, and then after that, we go to whatever level of consciousness we are ready for.

Also, I think we run into the same people in other dreams (lives). I once had a lucid dream that I was in a room with my family members and I knew who would be which relatives in my next life. So I knew I was dreaming and I wanted to remember who would be who next time around, so I took a pencil and paper and wrote it all down and put it in the pocket of my plaid shirt, and when I woke up in the morning, I looked in the pocket of my flannel pajamas, and the paper wasn't there. hehe

And all I could remember was that my mother in this life will be my husband in my next life, which will be a huge drag.

Lois Wrote:
>
> And all I could remember was that my mother in
> this life will be my husband in my next life,
> which will be a huge drag.

that`s funny. define heaven.some peeps think it`s an actual place and some think it`s just oneness with the universe...kind of a euphoric state i spose. the same way some define hell as separation from god, creator, spiritual being whatever you want to call it.
patty

i do think individual consciousness is a gift in this lifetime only, that it dies with the body and as such is something to be fully honoured and appreciated every moment of each day. we are matter, atoms vibrating with energy and that never dies, only changes shape and form. this is the only reincarnation that i believe in. that the atoms in my body will go on to be other things, an apple on a tree, a leaf in the breeze, etc.
people are so terrified of the "unknown" that they make up all kinds of stories about it to assuage their fear but i think all that does is take away from being right here, right now. if this is all there is why not live it to the fullest instead of waiting for some "eternal reward"? heaven and hell, all the stories in all the holy books, all metaphors for what is going on in the here and now.
be here now, live it, love it. fearlessly embrace life in all it's multifaceted glory. that's what i try to do.

JMHO.

[people are so terrified of the "unknown" that they make up all kinds of stories about it to assuage their fear but i think all that does is take away from being right here,]

Yes.

Some people are more successful at convincing themselves that these stories are real than others.

I never could grasp the concept of an afterlife. When we die our bodies decompose and break down into smaller components and disorder. There is no special receptacle for our thoughts or "selves" without flesh.

The brain's orbital complex, amygdala, thalamus, dorsal prefrontal cortex, and dorsal and ventral anterior cingulate regions govern what we think of as the ego and the superego, our thoughts and non-emotional reasoning and projections of consequences of planned actions
into the future and our emotions as inhibited by the orbital cortex making us spiritual, ethical, moral, and hopefully, socially correct.

When these governing parts of the brain die, their functions cease to exist as do our "selves" our "souls" or the term that you prefer.

All those myths about the afterlife were developed before we knew much about neuroanatomy.

coco Wrote:

> be here now, live it, love it. fearlessly embrace
> life in all it's multifaceted glory. that's what i
> try to do.
>
> JMHO.

that`s me as well. i was talking to my hubby tonight about my summer. i have had the best summer break and i didn`t go on any vacations. i lived each moment for the moment and tried to be present as much as i could/can. i appreciate each hour for what it is. i am however having somewhat of a rough time trying not to dread going back to work because if i`m thinking about that i`m not in the present moment...i`m concerned with the future and i don`t want to do that.
i don`t have any concrete beliefs about what happens after i die. some part of me would like to think i would be reincarnated into another life to learn any lessons i haven`t learned yet. some part of me thinks as you do....my atoms being redistributed into other things.
patty

arugula have you heard of the neuroscientist who experienced herself having a stroke and became completely emerged in right brain activity? it`s an amazing story
patty

people get caught in that trap of wanting more, More, MORE! as though the miracle of being alive at all, just this once isn't incredible and enormous enough! i get boggled just thinking about the amazingness of us, how we manage to be alive, like a living battery, what is that spark that animates us, wow! it's truly spectacular and if this is all there is it's enough, isn't it? how can we ask for any more than this incredible gift? how selfish can we get eh? wow. it's like a slap in the face instead of being grateful to expect something even more tremendous than this, i think. i mean, whoa, i am overwhelmed by how indescribably wonderful it is to be alive. it's the best, the BEST! there is nothing better, more delicious, more painfully delightful than this feeling of living. i know people want to put a name to it but i am happy just to know what i know and trust that all the rest is taking care of itself. i don't have to have or make up answers to put things into their "proper" files and boxes in my mind. i am happy not to know or think i know anything other than the fact that i am here, you are here, i see, i feel, i think, i love, i hurt, i cry, i dance, i sing, i live, i die. it's all so good and i am so grateful for it.
*love*

Yes, dewey, I saw her video on ted.com.

It brought tears to my eyes.

Hi dewey,

Sometimes I wondered, when I was alone, nobody sees me what I'm doing, and so will my doings go unnoticed just like that? When I killed an insect/mosquito, will it just disappear/vanish from this world forever? And there are things that happened in my life when I was small which I couldn't recall at all, are those memories are going to just fade away and nobody is ever going to know it? It doesn't sound logical to me when I think of it, and in Buddhism we have an explanation for all these issues, which are the concept of reincarnation and the eighth sense.

Every soul will undergoes reincarnation after the body has come to an end and every little things we did in life will be kept in our eighth sense. Dr Brian Weiss, who has personally collected more than 20,000 cases of reincarnation through hypnosis, said that almost everyone who has died will undergoes this process: A process of screening through our entire life like movie. During the progress he or she will get to see the entire life that he or she has gone through, in details. Many finds that they are looking at scenes that they have long forgotten. At the same time they see all the positive and negative energies that they sent out to the surroundings through body, speech and mind and the same energies will eventually returns to themselves, always.

After they have screened through their own life, each of them (us in the future when we died) will have a chance judge his or her own actions as a role of third party. They will decide for themselves where the person they have watched deserved to be and what happens next is they'll begin to step into their next life and in Buddhism, this is where the danger lies. The next step they are about to take is unstoppable and most of them stepped into three realms, which are animal, ghost and hell, instead of human or heaven. Having said that, what people read in sutra and bible is true, the level of sufferings in hell is way beyond our imaginations. This is what we called karma. That is why the main goal of a Buddhist is to be free from reincarnation in this life itself.

In order to be free from reincarnation in this life itself (and I think only Buddhism talks about it), there are many many ways to do it but they are all categorized into 2 sections: One is by our own strength to escape reincarnation and one is by the strength of others to pull us out of this reincarnation stuff. Here, you might think that I'm start talking nonsense but if you don't mind I'd like to continue..., the truth is that it's extremely difficult to free ourselves from reincarnation using our own strength and Buddha had told us that in this time the best thing for us to do is to rely on a Buddha named Amitabha Buddha in Pure Land to pull us out of this reincarnation issue. What we need to do is just to believe in the existance of Pure Land and want to go to Pure Land when our life on Earth has come to the end of it. It's that simple. After we reached Pure Land we won't have to be miserably reborn anymore and Pure Land is the perfect place for us to continue our spiritual practices until we have attained Buddhahood.

Now people may ask, even if I believe in the concept of reincarnation, why must I choose to free myself from reincarnation in this life? Can't I do it gradually in many lives? And I don't feel why I must be free from reincarnation because I don't see there's anything bad to be reborn as a human, or even better off in the heaven. Hmmm... the thing is that we have no control or empowerment over our life once we were reborn, you see. Basically we forgets everything we did in our past lives and there'll be nothing left for any principles that you hold on to in your past lives. You never know what you might do in your next life. It's a complete mystery and that's what makes reincarnation so dangerous for us.

Ok... before you starts to think that I'm some sort of weirdo I think I better stop. Basically that's all I know about Buddhism, really. Thank you and have a nice day! :-)

All the Best,
Wong

Remember you are a soul playing a human part and than in next life you will play another part.

Just don't be to attached to the part.

globalresult Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Remember you are a soul playing a human part and
> than in next life you will play another part.
>
> Just don't be to attached to the part.


right on Global, we are spirits having a human experience.
John lennon said dying is like getting out of one car and into the next, just `hope its not a ford. anyway one world at a time.

riverhousebill,

Thanks for the John Lenon saying.

It is like the butterfly or snake shedding it's skin.

Your soul never dies.

Our ego's have a tough time with this.

Once you understand this "no Fear".

hi wong

Pure Land
i will think of this
it sounds so tranquil

if i love someone
and wish to be with him forever in many lifetimes
i would rather be an unenlightened attached ego suffering individual
than enlightened and be without him

this is how i feel right now

enlightenment pales in comparison

i must be crazy

crazier than sane wong

"Your soul never dies.

Our ego's have a tough time with this.

Once you understand this "no Fear"."

i think that statement is backwards. it's the concept that there is no individual soul and that our individual self DOES in fact die with our physical death that the Ego has a problem with. we think that we are so amazing and unique that there is just no way the "me" can't go on in another incarnation. lots of people find that thought so very scary that they make up stories about a "next life" to trick themselves into thinking that they don't have to really live this one.
in any case, this attachment to a story is a deterrant to being in the now, whether it is true or not. all it does is serve as something to keep our thoughts and actions out of the Right Now and that is not healthy in my mind. no more so than focusing on past lives would be, a vain attempt to glamourize oneself in this life ("i was cleopatra!" why doesn't anyone ever remember being someone plain i wonder?). that is all so ego based and futile. it makes me think of our other current discussion about aliens and space travel. what is the point of spending billions of dollars and the time of so many scientists to look as space rocks when there are a multitude of issues right here on earth to deal with? what is the point of focussing on other lives when we have This One to live right now?

my purpose is to live the best life possible, to have a good time and to create positivity right here, right now. when i die it will be with the satisfaction of a life well lives, of having been loved by friends and family, of having had adventures, told stories, made art, enjoyed my life. i will not be looking forward to a Next Life, i will be savouring this delicious experience and kissing my loved ones goodbye.

riverhousebill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
just `hope its not a ford.
>
LMBO!!
patty

riverhousebill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
just `hope its not a ford.
>

LMBO!!
patty

interesting wong so pure land is essentially the heaven many other religions speak of. do you have to believe in god to get to this pur land or is it mostly through karma of past lives? forgive me if you already stated this point
patty

I found this very interesting when I first read it some 18 years ago...

The Death Flash

"My hypothesis is that this stream of consciousness which is the link between physical and mental reality is a form of electromagnetism which endows each of us with a unique personality. Since Maxwell's time, more and more has been learned about electromagnetism, and one finding which could have major significance relates to the death flash. At the time of death, organisms send forth an electromagnetic flash that is up to 1000 times stronger than the normal level of radiation. This is the finding of a Polish scientist, Janusz Slawinski, who believes that death separates "electromagnetic consciousness" from the physical body. Further, he hypothesizes that this "death flash" may enter a dimension beyond space and time, carrying with it an individuals personality, emotions and subjective experience.

With the announcement of this discovery, the scientific basis for the immortality of the human spirit takes another step forward. Tied in with the research of Dr. Elisabeth Kubler-Ross ("On death and Dying" and Dr. Raymond A. Moody, Jr. ("Life After Life" and others, with the second law of thermodynamics which postulates the conservation of energy in a system, and with Einstein's theory that electromagnetism is more basic than space and time, there is an increasing body of evidence to give credence to the universal longing for eternal life--the idea that life continues on in some form after death.

The death flash is not an unexpected phenomenon since all living organisms emit low-intensity light which physicists have measured either as particles or as electromagnetic waves. In fact, each person's brain produces its own electromagnetic field which can be measured with magnetoencephalograms.

Consciousness as an electromagnetic force is the link between life and death. Further, if modern physicist are to be believed, consciousness is the vital link for understanding quantum reality. This being true, quantum physics is a subject which deserves our attention if we are to understand ourselves and the nature of human nature.

How this stream of consciousness becomes manifest and focused in you and me, as well as other personality types, is the focus of the following chapters. ..." -James R. Nolan, "Red, Yellow, Blue and Green"


This is the only other information that I could come up with other than from Nolan...

[www.springerlink.com]
Electromagnetic radiation and the afterlife
Journal of Near-Death Studies
Volume 6, Number 2 / December, 1987 - pages 79-94
ISSN 0891-4494 (Print) - 1573-3661 (Online)
Janusz Slawinski1
(1) Institute of Physics, Pedagogical University, ul. Podchorazych 2, 30084 Krakow, Poland
Abstract The question of survival of bodily death is often considered to be beyond contemporary scientific methods and conceptual categories. However, recent research into spontaneous radiations from living systems suggests a scientific foundation for the ancient association between light and life, and a biophysical hypothesis of the conscious self that could survive death of the body. All living organisms emit low-intensity light; at the time of death, that radiation is ten to 1,000 times stronger than that emitted under normal conditions. This deathflash is independent of the cause of death, and reflects in intensity and duration the rate of dying. The vision of intense light reported in near-death experiences may be related to this deathflash, which may hold an immense amount of information. The electromagnetic field produced by necrotic radiation, containing energy, internal structure, and information, may permit continuation of consciousness beyond the death of the body.
[www.springerlink.com]

Hi dewey,

I'm not sure whether Pure Land equals to heaven in other religions, but there is a difference I know between God and Buddha which is that Buddha never claim to have created the universe.

To know whether we can be reborn in Pure Land, it depends on our faith in Pure Land and our willingness to leave this world and go to Pure Land. No it doesn't really depends on our karma to go there because the reason we can go to Pure Land is due to Amitabha Buddha's strength and not our own strength and that's why it makes the job so much easier.

Hope it clears your doubt. :-)

All the Best,
Wong

thanks wong
patty

Pretty fascinating subject. I was with my dad when he died, and it was a profound experience. I really believe that he did not cease to exist, but that he went somewhere; he left. The moment he died was a moment of pure beauty and peace that words cannot describe. He was not a religious man at all. I do not know where he went, but I know he went willingly and it was beautiful. I sense it in my soul. Though I can speculate all I want, this is all I truly know about the subject.

1995.
My Grandmother died.
Her husband worked for the State police of Md for many years.He died in 1982.
I wasnt with her,but my mother was.
My mother told us when she died,the whole house was filled with flashing lights like from a police car,and the backyard there was a spotlight,and a whole line of police cars.My mother totally believes he came to get her.And when she passed,the lights and cars were gone.
I sure would like to witness something like this cause it would settle alot of anxiety that death is the total end of everything.
I just believe that this brief speck of time here cannot possibly be all there is.
Brian



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08/02/2008 05:33AM by Raw1228.

His spirit woke me up so I could be awake when he left. His spirit kissed my spirit goodbye. It was one of the most beautiful things I have ever experienced, and it made me not afraid of death.

that is so cool sundancer. i`m not afraid of death, i`m afraid of how i`m going to die...pain, no pain? ya know? instant? slow? that sort of thing. if there`s an after existence i`m not afraid of that.
patty

Yeah, my dad was in a lot of pain when he was dying, and he let me control the morphine drip they let him go home with. So it was helpful for me to be able to comfort him on some level. It was a lot like attending a birth. We also listened to a lot of great music and my sisters and I sang a lot. It made my dad feel better. I don't really know how I would like to go. Painless would be good, but to be able to say good-bye would be good too.

i totally believe that if souls are connected they can communicate to each other
not only in the present life time ( even if they are separated by distance)


but in all lifetimes ( even if they are separated by time)

i think that what happens when i die
is partly related to what i believe, what i did, what i want, whom i connected with

apart from that, i don't really know

Besides inheritance tax? and a new toxc waste site - formalderhide imbaled ``body.

``In the country of Korea it was a party when you died and were on your way to ```(Happy Mountain) The koreans would mourned at the birth knowing that this child `would die, and when that person died they partyed hard celebrating that persons `life. First time I ran into a korean funeral, I thought the circus just came to `town horns bells laughing falling down drunk most big smiles it a celebration, `not mourning.


`if we believe that life is precious and sacred, we must commit ourselves to live `life abundantly and drink in every monent. And then, after it becomes clear that `the ride is about to finish, we must have the courge to die.
`To deny death is to violate nature.
`Ben Landis

Sundancer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yeah, my dad was in a lot of pain when he was
>dying

my sister too. she wasn`t on iv morphine but pill wise she was popping them pretty heavily along with all the other crap they had her on. i saw her sunday and she died tuesday so i wasn`t with her but her pastor, hubby, 2 daughters and my mom were. she held on to her hubby`s neck hugging him for about 15 minutes and the whole time they were praying aloud and she quietly slipped away. i guess i`d like to say cya later too and not die suddenly....selfishly didn`t think of that part of it.
patty

We know what happens after we die, there are so many people who have near death experiences. Especially in the last decades when medical science has improved so much.

When we die we go back to reality, this world is only an illusion where we play and learn. You can think of this experience as an elaborate video game. When you go to the store and select a video game, you know in advance that there will be challenges in the video game. In fact if there were no challenges in the game and it were just a lot of graphics to look at, you wouldn't like it. In a similar way we select our lives before we are born, knowing that there will be challenges. And then we are born and "forget" that we chose to be here. However, before we come here we make arrangements with others for them to be our "spirit guides".

When we die, we leave out body and veiw it from the outside. When we do this we have little or no feelings of attachment to it, we may not even recognize it immediately. After a period of time, the length of which may vary, we go into a tunnel and are drawn towards a light at the end. When we emerge into the light we are greeted by a freindly being, our representation of God, an angel, our relatives ect. We often go through a "life review" while we are being bathed with love and have an angel by our side helping us. In the life review we relive our life, not from our veiwpoint, but from the veiwpoint of the people we interacted with. We feel all the pain and joy that we caused during our life. I think of this as returning our spirit to a neutral state with no karma attached at all. This is definitely perfect justice.


What happens after this, I'm rather vague on because at this point the near death experiencers usually, are told that they are not finished with their work, or choose on their own to come back to their bodies. Usually, this is done very reluctantly and with a longing to stay on the other side.

One thing I've never been clear on is if during the life review, we feel what the animals and insects that we interacted with on earth felt.

Then we stay on the other side for a varying length of time, while we learn and eventually choose to come back to earth again. We can choose different forms to play the game in, male or female, different races, different dissabilities and chalenges.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2008 03:58AM by Lillianswan.