Bryan-
I truly don't know what to say anymore. You have ignored facts, reason, and the policy of this website, and you still ignore those who have brought up legitimate complaints about the methods that you use in moderating this forum. I have asked for you to give an apology to Lois, who you ignored then attacked when she persisted in her complaints about deleting a thread, which was proven to be wrongfully deleted. Their have been several complaints about your methodology in dealing with this forum, yet you continue to make snide remarks, attacking our characters, and ignore these complaints. I am now asking you to please tell me how I may make a formal complaint about you, and maybe try to figure out some way to appropriately deal with the issue by talking to the owner. I am ready to end this, because I want to be able to express my opinion on this forum without fear of being deleted for unacceptable reasons. I am making this public, instead of sending a private message, because I am not just asking you to send information about contacting the owner, but everyone and anyone who knows and is willing to give that information.
How do I contact the owner?

Wow, you sure know how to ask for the manager, do you have to do that a lot?

Lillianswan-
I have actually never asked for the manager before, believe it or not. I think I did do rather well at it though. lol

cyclopsale i beleive the webmaster leaves the website moderation 100% up to Bryans discretion

honestly i have never in 6-7 years of posting/lurking/reading here have i ever seen the webmaster get involved in any disputes .. i dont think he has the time, energy or inclination too ...

anything between you and Bryan should be able to be settled between the two of you without involving a 3rd party .. you are both adults ..i am sure cyclopsale you can come up with something satisfactory to you

if you dont.. then you can choose to stay or choose to leave if you are not happy here

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

<<<anything between you and Bryan should be able to be settled between the two of you without involving a 3rd party .. you are both adults ..i am sure cyclopsale you can come up with something satisfactory to you >>>

That is kind of hard to do when Bryan ignores five different people's complaints. At first he attempted to use diversion tactics then he just alluded to, or outright accused, almost everyone involved of having personal problems. Maybe Bryan is worn out and needs a break. I know I would be if I had been doing this job this long.

No one has argued the fact that the policy should be upheld by everyone. Those rules are put in place for a reason. We all want a friendly place to post. When some are alowed to abuse others here, it can only lead to hurt feelings and an aggressive atmosphere. It should be nipped in the bud, or ASAP in this case.

I encourage everyone to fight for what is right!!

"Fight the good fight every moment, every minute, every day."

yes but cyclopsale has said above that he hasnt contacted Bryan via PM regarding getting the webmaster contacts ... so that is an avenue he hasnt explored

perhaps Bryan is not interested in all out open verbal combat on the public forums .. how would that be productive anyways?

i still think cyclopsale should try to resolve this issue to his own satisfaction between him and Bryan and if he cant then he can choose what he wants to do

and yer right .. its a long time to do a job .. and alone he is to do it .. it must be exhausting and for the most part very thankless at times



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/03/2008 06:01PM by Jgunn.

he doesn't volunteer for that though (to deal with personal complaints), only to moderate. he pretty much can ignore complaints at large that don't have to do with violations of the user agreement.

Jgunn-
You said that I did not explore all the options necessary. Well I don't think that a private message is necessary. When someone ignores legitimate complaints about abuse of the policy of the website, then a private message is unnecessary. And Bryan didn't just ignore the policy, he also violated the policy by making indirect threats and attacking other members' characters. This is unacceptable and no amount of private messages are going to change the fact that he is not listening to reason. I believe I made the best decision under the current circumstances.
And I have contacted the owner now, and I simply asked for him to either talk to
Bryan about the decisions he has made, or to add another moderator to make the process easier and more fair.
Coco-
Bryan did violate the user agreement and others did as well, but he did not deal with these issues and ignored them at large. He dealt with complaints about me and El Natural, but didn't even consider more legitimate ones? This does not constitute good moderating in my opinion, that is why I have made this formal complaint.

Jgunn and coco,

I want to take an opportunity to say I really admire your ways of disagreeing. You are both seem like considerate and caring people.

With love,
Kise'

Sorry, obviously that was me and not Cy. LOL!

darn it Kise we need to get you guys another computer lol !!

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

cyclopsale Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jgunn-
> You said that I did not explore all the options
> necessary.

-please re-read what i said i never said that at all ..what i said was you have chosen not to PM Bryan ... and i followed that at with a thought that perhaps Bryan has no interest in having a public all out fight with you or anyone else...never once did i say you have not explored all your options.. please please dont twist words around , thank you .. i never said the word neccesary not once .. you did

Well I don't think that a private
> message is necessary. When someone ignores
> legitimate complaints about abuse of the policy of
> the website, then a private message is
> unnecessary.


And Bryan didn't just ignore the
> policy, he also violated the policy by making
> indirect threats and attacking other members'
> characters.

- Bryan didnt make any threats he posed options .. the option being if people dont like it here they have a choice .. they can leave or stay .. what he said was he was not willing to participate in the drama .. and how is calling Lois paranoid attacking her character ? when Lois says herself that shes paranoid lol ..and in his defence he did say he could have answered her differenttly so ....


cyclopsale this is how i tend to see it .. .

imagine all of us are in a room together .. and we all start bickering .. and the owner (or in this case the guy looking after the owners house) decides that some people should leave in order to diffuse the situation...

ok ? that guy is gonna be the bad guy and the good guy to many different people in the room ...

now lets say those same people that are hooping an hollering an pounding on the door screaming for justice ..instead of backing off a bit .. and taking the opportunity to privately say to the guy looking after that owners house that they felt they had been treated badly

now heres this guy looking after the house and bunch of folks are saying ok ok lets all calm down .. and the other half is still pushing pushing pushing on the door ...

can you see by this analogy .. why .. Bryan or anyone would be unwilling to talk about it at this time?

its great you managed to get ahold of the owner .. i hope you get resolved what it is that your are trying to resolve


and thanks Kise

i know you all feel strongly about what went down and i totally agree thta you should come to some conclusion about it

cyclopsale i hope that the amount of energy you are expending on this comes to a conclusion for you too ... you are asking alot of Bryan to expend his energy just because you say so or demand it ... and really is that fair either?



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 10/04/2008 02:53AM by Jgunn.

DNFTT

Y I can't understand why you can't just drop the matter now and have you ever considered that constant aggressive demands for appologies and threats to Bryan about contacting the owner and putting it on the forum also constitutes to harrassment. It is just going on and on.

I wasn't involved in the topic, so I don't fully know why there is such upset, but I've read the topics since for constant appologies for the last several days or so. I haven't seen Bryan make threats on people's characters, he has behaved in a very dignified fashion considering the way he is being treated. He is just trying to help people move on but he has probably decided to not respond at all now as nothing he says is right. It is way worse on some other forums.

please let it go now and look at yourself and how it looks to others first, before accusing Bryan, just my take as some people seem unable to move on. moderators moderate threads that get out of hand. That is what they do and it is worse on some other forums. why don't you just start the topic again



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/04/2008 06:24AM by Ariel55.

What the heck is going on between Cyclopsale and Pakd4fun???

They post and then say " sorry it's not me, it's the next one".

Can't you get yourselves figured out?

<<<What the heck is going on between Cyclopsale and Pakd4fun???

They post and then say " sorry it's not me, it's the next one". >>

We are on the same computer. We are not perfect. What's it to ya?

<<<I wasn't involved in the topic, so I don't fully know why there is such upset, but I've read the topics since for constant appologies for the last several days or so. >>

You are reading the threads. You don't feel you understand it all. Yet you decide to post a criticism. You are perpetuating the subject. You aren't even involved and YOU will not let it drop. I dropped it days ago but have only been replying to posters like you. Go back and see!!! We are not the ones keeping the threads going. Look at all these posts addressed to us. I will say it AGAIN. If you want the topic to die than quit posting comments.

I can see why Cyclopsale is upset because he was slandered after being rudely attacked. Those are against the written rules we all agreed to. It was proven and Bryan refuses to acknowledge,not only his complaint of it, but others as well!!!

aww cut pakd4fun some slack .. not her fault .. theyere on the same computer and the way the login./loggoff works kinda buggy ...me an my hubby had same problem several times ...

lets not turn this into another fight

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

Jgunn-
I am sorry about my tangling of your words. What I said was merely what I thought I saw in your implications. I did not mean to put words in your mouth.
You made a great analogy, but you didn't get it quite right. Instead of the one taking care of the house just kicking out a few people who started the problem, he kicks out everyone, even those who had nothing to do with it. And we are not just defending ourselves being removed, but those who were wrongfully pushed out. Another thing. If you saw one guy knocking the living daylights out of another, would you harass the guy getting attacked? And would you defend the guy who started the attacking? See this is where Bryan went wrong. He defended the accusations of those who started the attacks, and were the only ones who made attacks, although some of my posts could have been misconstrued as attacks, then he deleted the ENTIRE thread, not just those posts that were negative.
And it doesn't matter if Lois says she is paranoid all the time, Bryan made a rude comment about her paranoia. And he told her that if she wants to persist in "playing these games," which I don't call making legitimate comlaints a game, then she would be "pushed out." This is a paraphrase of what he said, and it doesn't directly say this, but it is implied within his comment. This is an indirect threat. And that is not the correct job of the moderator.

thats the problem with forums ... people read into things that arent there .. implications ..assumptions .. whatever you wish to call it

anyhoo and btw bryan said to Lois to *ask* to be pushed out ...if you read it again you will see thats what it says .. there was no threat implied or otherwise he simply said if not happy then leave or ask to be removed and not play any games about it

its easy enough to twist and turn things around, we all do it lol especially when angry , and i realize you are angry but really .. if you dont get any satisfaction via the owner of this site ..then really what is your next course of action ? you will have the option to stay ..or leave .. which is right where you were several days ago ...

your views dont reflect mine or vice versa ...i think its best that this be my last thoughts on the subject because now im finding myself spending too much energy chasing a dead end

peace cyclopsale .. i hope you find what you are looking for

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

Jgunn-
Thanks for understanding that I am angry about the issue. But I don't let it get to me. The whole reason I want to do this is because I don't want to have to worry about what I say, even if I know that there is nothing wrong with it. I want some changes to the way the forum is run by the moderator. I know I have only been here for a short period of time, but I don't like the way this forum, which I really do love to be a part of, is run. I don't think that I will leave if no change happens, but if something like this happens again then I will leave. Because I don't want to spend time on something that can be just as easily erased by someone who doesn't like what I say. So I don't think it's anger that I am really coming from, but more of a frustration at things that are out of my control on this forum. And I am not looking to control this forum either. I just want to speak my opinion, and I want everyone to have the chance to speak their opinion as well, on this forum.