The world is full of sad stories. For example, some people start a business for the first time but they think they know everything and they don't listen. The business sinks and they suffer. If they had listened, they would be afloat. But hey, they lived in their own little bubble world and the bubble popped. Once the bubble pops is too late.

Have you encountered similar stories but health related instead? Have you try to help but your advice was blocked or misinterpreted? What makes people listen?

leading by example

One thing I find truly incredible. At various points in my life when I've stopped to think what is the most evil thing in the world, that is impossible to understand, defeat or tolerate, I always came to the conclusion it is stupidity. Not war, not torture of little babies, or whatever other horrible thing one may think of. In my view, stupidity beats them all by a great measure.

Why this is so - probably because stupidity is always at the source.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2012 09:52AM by chat.

What would happen if you try to help, they block you. Then time goes by. Then they come back to you with huge bills from hospitals asking for money to pay the bill so that you can save the occasion?

Would you feel guilty if you say no, as if they did not have time to listen but they have time to ask for money? (to save them you would have to sell all you got)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2012 12:01PM by Panchito.

I would feel guilty if, but for my attempt to explain and them not listening, I would have been prepared to give money.

But that's just because saying "i told you so" is not really my style, others will be different.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

What are expectations? Are we expected to try save those who we do not connect to? We think we gain social status by saving other people, by making good to the 'tribe' we live in. But what happens when it is not recognize like that and the efforts go silent and unnoticed?

uhhh... sounds like this sort of dance is going on ... somewhere... somehow... i dunno... just a feeling...

[en.wikipedia.org]

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We think we gain
> social status by saving other people, by making
> good to the 'tribe' we live in. But what happens
> when it is not recognize like that and the efforts
> go silent and unnoticed?

One thing that definitely happens is we come to understand that our thought - of "gaining social status by saving other people, by making good to the tribe we live in" - was sadly but undeniably wrong

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

Quote

What are expectations? Are we expected to try save those who we do not connect to? We think we gain social status by saving other people, by making good to the 'tribe' we live in. But what happens when it is not recognize like that and the efforts go silent and unnoticed?

Uh, Panchito, wasn't it you who posted that Doug Lisle video?!


Agree with chat that it's stupidity, well, perhaps not stupidity but obduracy, that makes people fail to heed advice(or their gut instincts) and fail fundamentally as a result. If someone doesn't listen to me and continues to ask for my help, I try not to take it personally and feel frustrated. I consider myself a fair person and do not think of interactions with those asking my help as power struggles, where they can "block" me, as you say. I wish to help someone in a difficulty because it is in my nature. I could not say I act with integrity if I have an expectation that the one asking my help will take my advice or else I turn my back on them. But that's my personal code, I guess. I may be misunderstanding you, also; you seem to make a distinction according to whether you "connect" with the person. I am not sure what you mean--I assume total strangers aren't asking you for advice/money?

the social image is based on what the tribe values most. If there is a two headed moster threatening the tribe, the most value goes to the soldier. If the monster is poberty the most value goes to the rich. But when the moster is disease, there may or may not be most value depending on health because only terminally ill people see the monster. it is all relative. A hero in one place can be an idiot in another place.

Tamukha Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I may be misunderstanding you, also; you
> seem to make a distinction according to whether
> you "connect" with the person. I am not sure what
> you mean--I assume total strangers aren't asking
> you for advice/money?

hey Tamukha, I was talking about a hypothetical scenarios. In real life, there are many many variables at play. To connect means that there was mutual understanding. Both persons were talking from a similar plane of reference. The expectations were understood. But that is theory. In real life, people don't act by models or theories. A micky mouse thing may mean a lot for some people and throw away all models.

The scenarios don't make any sense unless people are just actors on a stage and just reading and acting the script of a classic codependent drama. The scenarios posed above is pure insanity.

The person who is requesting to be helped is not insane. The person who is feeling that they are obligated to help or feeling guilt is absolutley insane. This is the opposite of compassion. There is no compassion in guilt. There is no compassion in feeling obligated. There is no compassion in believing that only they themself could come in, the knight shining on a white horse to save the day. Where is the compassion in this? That is like saying " You are too stupid to know how to take care of yourself and do with your own life but I can and will." If someone destroyed their health, that was THEIR prerogative to do so. They have every right to eat junk food and lose their health. Its their life and its their body. They are not obligated to follow anyone's health advice. If they destroy their health and ask another person to pay their medical bills, why on earth should anyone feel "obligated"? or guilt, for that matter? Where is the sanity in this? Now, if a person WANTS to and truly WISHES to without feeling guilt, rage or resentment, this is a healthy thing to do because they are simply respecting their OWN desire to help but if they are going to be feeling a mass of negative emotions as a result of so called "helping" and "saving" this is no help at all. This is a farce to oneself and to the other.

a farce is a farce is a farce

unless that's the truth of one's life

then, the farce is the truth

just like this world is a farce

unless you like it

then its the truth

a farce is beautiful

if you can laugh about it

Billy Joel summed it pretty good in this 80's video:

[www.youtube.com]