Great little documentary (5 1/2 minutes) on how materialism negatively affects our well-being.

[www.youtube.com]

Happy Dopamine!

This video sounds good - yes, there's too much materialism, and we'd all be better off focusing on other activities that make us happy, but when I heard these phrases -

"we also need to Advocate for POLICIES (governmental laws) that promote (force upon us) intrinsic values." (And who decides what those 'intrinsic values' are?)

"to develop POLICIES which 'encourage'(force?) these 'intrinsic values'."

"Advocate for Policy" = government control and taking away our rights, freedom and liberty.

- red flags went up. So I looked up who produced this video. They are The Center for a New American Dream -

They're the Agenda 21/central planners who want us all to live squashed up in cities/suburbs and drive tin cans -

[www.canadafreepress.com]

"The environmental and progressive Center for a New American Dream founded in 1997 promotes “a more socially and ecologically balanced society.” “We seek to change social norms around consumption and consumerism” and replace it with community action and collaborative communities. Collaborative communities, right out of UN Agenda 21, create local initiatives, ecological sustainability, livability, and engage (read force) local governments to embrace sustainability."

“We seek to cultivate a new American dream—one that emphasizes community, ecological sustainability, and a celebration of non-material values.” It sounds so kumbaya. What non-profit firms are financing their non-material lifestyle, salaries, and agenda?"

"The Center for a New American Dream is an organization that pushes at the local and national level the UN’s Agenda 21. It is headquartered in Virginia, and offers summer internships to our naïve youth who will become tomorrow’s UN’s Agenda 21 slaves."

***************
They are the same group who gave us that other big hit video - "The Story of Stuff" which was shown to indoctrinate most school children, but again was pushing an agenda.

Here's someone I follow - Lee Doren.

[www.youtube.com]

He hasn't critiqued "The High Price of Materialism" yet, but has given the other side of "The Story of Stuff".

***************

[www.mtdemocrat.com]

Anyone who is against Agenda 21 is part of a Hate Group, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, SPLC --

Antigovernment Conspiracy Theorists Rail Against UN’s Agenda 21 Program

[www.splcenter.org]

I don't know man. Materialism and selfishness just seems kinda soulless and inane to me. I don't care about all this paranoia and policy wanking. No one's forcing anything on anyone. Just ignore it. Be your own woman/man. View the world as you want it to be. I never would have even been the slightest bit aware of all that stuff without you.

it is about points of view. From the point of view of getting the gathering money and values, materialism decisions maske sense. It all comes from the birth of the bourgeoisie point of view and its social strugle.

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> it is about points of view. From the point of view
> of getting the gathering money and values,
> materialism decisions maske sense. It all comes
> from the birth of the bourgeoisie point of view
> and its social strugle.

That sounds very...academic. Can you break it down into meat-and-potatoes concepts? What is the social struggle taking place? Of course we buy things out of need. Even buying something not totally necessary is fine on occasion but too many people are attached to acquistion. They are always consuming something. And these "things" never really satisfy but simply distract. The worst part is foisting it upon young children. I grew up without being spoiled. Not that it would have been a possibility, but I never felt deprived. Now I am grateful that I was not bombarded with stuff but still was able to have meaningful experiences like trips, plays, etc.

the social strugle is about what to become. They were born blank and they (the bourgeoisie) needs to become something. They value the accumulation of goods, short of like having the most toys. A different point of view would be a soldier, whose values come from a different angle. Or the cleregy, whose values come from following a different set of rules. The bourgeoisie is the response to the social strugle of being born economically poor and having the top life mission of reversing this condition. Thus, being succesful is being with enough goods. This adds up to a whole mentality where other values are lesser. Ususally, they cannot see it as a problem because they are it.

It's an illusion that it's ever "enough." Just watching this whole Apple nonsense is proof in the pudding. Every year they tweak their phones and other gizmos and the iSheeple line up like clockwork (not just Apple products but all types of electronics). They are marketed like objects to make our lives run more smoothly but could anything be further from the truth? I find their constant presence not only an disruption but also a sign of devolvement.

"iSheeple" - that's a good one!





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2012 12:37AM by veganjuice.

HH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't know man. Materialism and selfishness just
> seems kinda soulless and inane to me. I don't care
> about all this paranoia and policy wanking. No
> one's forcing anything on anyone. Just ignore it.
> Be your own woman/man. View the world as you want
> it to be. I never would have even been the
> slightest bit aware of all that stuff without you.


Soulless and also no spirit of fairness in our materalist
way of doing Mcbussness.

All this paranoia and policy wanking. No ones forcing anything on anyone.
Just Ignor it and it will go away I go with that HH, Im realy mind blown that people think the govt is trying to contrail us, Interment camps, mind control, ect.
When its nothing more than a game of good ole monopoly. Heck they dont want to kill you, they want you to consume, be silent then go die
If we were a threat to big money than mabey they would want to cull off some,
But right now we would be flatering ourselfs I think.
I had top security acess when I serverd in the U.S. Army and never anywhere did I see any sign of this kind of threat against the U.S. population.
Why in the hell people spend time on such far flung ideas I dont know, When there are so many real threat such as toxic GM food All the nukes leaking and we talk about nonsense threats????????????????????????????????
Like what you had to say HH, I like common sense.
BY THE WAY USSR BANS MONSANTOS GMO after new data from test on rats tumor city! This is real



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2012 02:36AM by riverhousebill.

thigs can be good and bad at the same time. Maybe materialism is one of those.

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> thigs can be good and bad at the same time. Maybe
> materialism is one of those.


Well, even producers of war ammo can rationalize that it has a good side--making them lots of money.

If we just leave things like that, then they are not thoroughly examined. In what ways is materialism a good thing? First you have to separate materialism from simply buying things. We may buy things we don't really need and I don't think that it being materialistic.

For me, materialism is a basic consciousness of acquisition. It may be due to a desirous nature, which always finds something it just HAS to have. It could also be due to wanting to impress other people or not feel inferior to other people.

The test of whether someone is basically materialistic is how often conversations are centered around an object. I hear this all the time when I am out and about. People are discussing with their friends the renovations on their home, their new cars, a new tech gizmo they bought, a cruise they are going on (versus an educational tour, for example) or other "thing."

The problem is that we are not our bodies or anything of this world. So any objects we acquire here should be put in their proper perspective. You can't take it with you!

I see what you mean but "materialism" does not really exists. It only exists on the ideological world next to politics. And because it has a thought reality, it depends on the people what they make of it. People argue that death is bad. But what is it to be something?

Panchito, I like to be very concrete when I discuss things, even philosophical issues. With "death," it's the perceived loss of identity, not to mention a loss of a way of life and separation from others. The unknown is always scary, too. Whatever word-labels or phrases we attach to it, we still have to acknowledge that these things affect us.

Whatever you want to call materialism, I think that it is ultimately has a negative impact on society and the individual. It causes environmental damage and we condition children to have a desirious nature. Do you ever notice that children spoiled with material objects seem less happy than other "deprived" children? Children want time with their parents over things but too many parents are caught up in their own worlds and quest for objects. They even treat other people like objects! I am not talking about upper versus lower classes because some wealthy people are very thrifty and do not waste money like some "new money" or even just middle class people.

You RAWK KidRaw as you pointed out what most people miss and that this is just part of the Brainwashing by UN’s Agenda 21, which has taken over the Environmental Movement. I just added another article on Chemtrails and here is small snippet…

[www.naturalnews.com]
[www.naturalnews.com]
Swedish official admits toxic 'chemtrails' are real, not a wild conspiracy theory
Saturday, October 06, 2012 by: Jonathan Benson, staff writer

…

Spraying the skies to save the planet?

Interestingly, the United Nations (UN) and various Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation-backed groups have recently been forced to admit that such sprayings are taking place, and that the emitted particles are not normal contrails. But their excuse for why chemtrail sprayings are being done is that they will somehow save the planet from the devastating effects of so-called "global warming," that ever-present, pseudoscientific environmental theory that is often used as justification for all sorts of outlandish policy proposals. ( [www.globalresearch.ca] )

Materialism and materialism oriented emotions like jealousy are how they keep people docile, stupid, unhealthy, divided, and enslaved. Take away the shopping malls and the revolt will begin.

I believe that we're actually evolving away from the materialist mindset and that it's happening quicker than we can see. Less and less people are buying into that scam. Only the smallest of the small still linger in the ego-driven hive-mind dreams of Lamborghinis, diamonds, and McMansions. The world simply can't afford their indulgences anymore. Combine that with the spread of information and spiritual/health wisdom that has been kept from us in the West, and it's soon to be game over for the materialists.

“Humanity is now faced with a stark choice: Evolve or die. … If the structures of the human mind remain unchanged, we will always end up re-creating the same world, the same evils, the same dysfunction.”

Eckhart Tolle

I can only imagine you guys' desdain for Celebrities and Musicians and those in the Entertainment Field, who are the poster children for Materialism!






And then if you add in all their overindulgences of alcohol and drugs - wow!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/08/2012 01:25PM by KidRaw.

From my experience, drug and alcohol abuse is often the result of trying to fill the void of the failed expectations of materialism. The only friends I have who are materialists are people that I grew up with. They're all unhealthy and addicted to something. It's heartbreaking. A lot of things can bring that about, but I know them well enough to know that they have no clue how to find peace outside of the strip-mall, and since that never, ever works, they inevitably lean on the pipe or the bottle or the cig or the HFCS.

LOL. I love how you use capitals in this phrase: "Celebrities and Musicians and those in the Entertainment Field."

<<<From my experience, drug and alcohol abuse is often the result of trying to fill the void of the failed expectations of materialism.>>>

I love what Jacquelyn Small said in "An Interview With Jacquelyn Small by Penny Tupes Jennings" in the December 1992 issue of "Science Of Mind"…

"Science Of Mind: There are many theories regarding the origin of addiction in an individual -- biological, environment, medical disorder, moral weakness, etc. In your opinion what is the main cause of addiction and compulsive behavior?

Small: Addiction is the search outside ourselves for something that is in actuality very deep within our own psyche. For whatever reason, we’re afraid to turn within, so we try to find our wholeness in our outer life -- in a substance, in activity, or another person. I’ve known hundreds of people in recovery who’ve told me that, as addicts, they were searching for a transcendent experience they believed could not have sober. In their debilitating search for a spiritual high, they were shown the gap between where they are and where they really want to be. And unfortunately, many people get caught in this vicious cycle.

Addiction is very similar to the process of "attachment" in Eastern philosophy. And frankly, the process addictions such as codependence, sex and romance, work, gambling, eating, spending, the need to always be right and perfect, are just as dangerous as chemical addictions and, in fact, are harder to heal. With chemical addictions you can remove the chemical and assist people in turning inward to find the parts of themselves which are lost and confused, whereas some of the process addictions are very hard to get hold of. It’s difficult to determine what is healthy behavior and what isn’t in some of these areas. And each of us must do this for ourselves. There truly are no outside "experts."

I no longer see compulsions as "bad," though they are certainly addictive behavior. They are more like signposts pointing to an area of our lives where we are "tape looping." That is, our obsessions are a way that our Higher Power has of focusing us on our unfinished business, which is keeping us from experiencing our wholeness. Addictions and compulsions are the shadow-side of our passionate nature. We’re expressing our spiritual fire in erroneous or irrelevant pursuits. They show us those areas that we have not fully brought to Light. It’s no accident that alcohol has been called "spirits." There is a deep, primordial connection between the spiritual quest and addiction. Love always moves into the place that is lacking and wants to fill it up. Our addictions point out that something we feel is lacking is hidden in the shadows, crying out for love and acceptance to fulfill us, and make us whole. So, often, I’ve had to honor an addiction as my Teacher. pp. 27-28

Great stuff John. I totally agree. As sad as it can be to watch my friends, I always remember that those who appear to be the farthest from THE truth are often the closest. Small's take rings true.

In trying to figure out what Materialism is, and put it into perspective....

We already mentioned Celebrities, Sports Figures, Musicians, Entertainers, etc. as being Materialistic.

So would those Elite who rail against "The Rich", "Millionaires and Billionaires", "The 1%" and demonize them and vilify them and want to take away their stuff and give it to somebody else, yet are "The Rich" "Millionaires" and "The 1%" themselves, and live like it - would they be considered "Materialistic" or just plain "Hypocrites"?

For example --

[www.theblaze.com]

Kid, why are you using such extreme examples? A middleclass person or even a workingclass/lowerclass person can be totally consumed with materialism. I live in an area known as having "old money." A silly expression but a bit accurate, from what I have observed. The people who have possess generational wealth tend to be less insecure about having to show it off. For instance, I rarely see a sports car (Porsche or Jaguar). Most people have toned-down clothing and SUVs and other "boring" cars. However, I have even seen fur coats in lower-class environs. Those who may not really be able to afford such things feel like they have to prove themselves.

you know, people are able to change. They are not necessarily always the same or always a label.

HH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Considering
> America's current way of doing things, I do not
> believe that people should embrace poverty

I mostly agree with everything you said, and I agree with the above statement that if a family has 'money', they should not have to live as meagerly as possible and vilified if they don't live in a dinky apartment in the city. If they choose to live in a big house in the country with some land and lake/creek/river for all their kids and grandkids to have a happy life, good for them.

As an aside, I believe that if someone has 'money', land, a farm, property, etc., when they die, they should be able to leave it to their family, rather than having it confiscated by the government.

banana who Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kid, why are you using such extreme examples? A
> middleclass person or even a
> workingclass/lowerclass person can be totally
> consumed with materialism.

Well, previously I had written out a whole long reply about 'what is materialism' and different aspects of it, but decided not to post it because I couldn't be bothered to get into it, so my above post was kind of a follow-on -- talking about hypocrisy as to who gets a pass on being Materialistic. Like - it's OK for Celebrities to live large, but not CEO's of a company. And with a certain faction of the Elite - The Pot calling the Kettle Black.

So from the reply I didn't post -

What exactly is "Materialism"? I think there are nuances instead of being cut and dried.

And one of them is what you said above - Anyone can be Materialistic, regardless of class or income level.

So -- Is it OK to be Materialistic if you have plenty of money so you can afford to be?

I think -- if you can't afford to be Materialistic, and you have to go into debt to live that way or rely on the government to take it from someone else to give it to you, then being Materialistic is a no-no.

LOL, Kid...I know for you this is a personal thing because I think you have said on here that you are financially successful. Again, it's not about how much money you have in the bank. What I was getting at is what dominates your life? When you converse with others, is it primarily about your things? Are you always talking about your various possessions? If so, then your life is centered around material objects. Whether you can afford them or not is not the issue at all--it's the vacuous nature of the materialistic existence. For one thing, it's never enough. Also, it's temporary.

I was never motivated by the lure of making lots of money. I am not passing myself off as some elavated being but I do think that I always intrinsically knew that none of that stuff ultimately mattered. I have never had even had a driver's license. If I lived in a rural area, I'd probably be riding a horse!

I was thinking about this today and even having a family can be a form of materialism. The individual is mainly centered on raising a family and when their kids grow up, then they are focused on being grandparents. I am not saying it's wrong to become a parent, but the focus is always on mundane existence. I don't know if I am making myself clear...

KidRaw Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Like - it's OK for Celebrities to
> live large, but not CEO's of a company. And with a
> certain faction of the Elite - The Pot calling the
> Kettle Black.
>

my promlem with CEO's living large is when they are living large off government bailouts and government assisted loans to run their corps..

ive said it a hundred times .. i dont mind paying taxes ..what i resent is what they do with the money

when my government pays a CEO (ie: the CEO of BC Ferries or BC hydro) upwards of half a million dollars a year .. then goes onto to further fund their heavily padded expense accounts such as year long car rental (im sorry ..you make a half million dollars a year an cant afford to buy yer own goddamn car?!) this is when CEO's living large .. pisses me off

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

My point about CEO's was - some people think it's fine for Celebrities, Musicians, Athletes, etc., to make a lot of money, but it's not OK for CEO's to make a lot of money. The double standard.

I think I joked once about how I became independently wealthy by following a certain financial website in response to Tamukha's saying how that particular website was not a credible source. Me and my husband aren't materialistic, because he's cheap and I like a good bargain or sale. In fact, I wish we or he would let us spend some money sometimes for things like air conditioning in the summer, hooking up the clothes dryer to use just in case something has to get dry fast, getting a cell phone for the car in case of an emergency, or buying decor that's new instead of Craigslist.

What is the definition of Materialism?

"Materialism is the position that matter is the only thing that exists and that all things can be reduced to matter.
Materialism in philosophy is the view that everything that exists is either composed of matter or depends on matter for its existence."

I guess we're referring to Materialism as preferring 'stuff' and 'things' to ....to what? People?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/2012 10:12PM by KidRaw.

Kid, your husband is not detached from material things. Maybe he is simply attached to having money in the bank and afraid to spend but if you want air conditioning in the summer and are well-off, that seems pretty extreme that he won't do it. I am curious if he would get mad if you paid for the air condtioning and got a cell phone for the car! I don't have a cell phone but I don't feel I need one. However, if you have the money for one and cannot spend it because of your husband, then it's another thing altogether.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2012 12:46AM by banana who.

*let us* kidraw really?

i think you need to talk to your hubby about mutual respect .. if you have worked for something and want something there is no reason you shouldn't have said something ..if said something is something you really want

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

Actually, you have a point about Materialism or something. The person who doesn't spend money on buying stuff because they're frugal or cheap, so lives minimally - are they in a lesser place character-wise than the person who spends money on stuff if they can afford it and feels like it.

banana who, you should have been a psychologist because I think you like to analyze relationships

It's just there's two sides to every story. Nothing's black or white. Where does minimalism end and frugality begin or materialism may just be generosity to one's self.