Have any of you had experience with Kimchi? I know there are different variations with different ingredients. Is it typically kind of like sauerkraut where each separate ingredient is raw? Is it too heavy in something that makes it unhealthy? And, I know this is a vegan section, but there isn't a non-vegan raw food section here. Let's say a kimchi has shrimp in it, is it likely to be cooked shrimp, or would it be raw shrimp?

Also, have any of you eaten winter melon or boc choi? Does boc choi have a strong flavor that one might find unpleasant, or is it sort of like spinach? A lot of recipes I found for winter melon involve cooking it. Can it be eaten raw, and is it an acquired taste or something that is easy to enjoy?

Information on any of the above questions will be appreciated!

First of all, in asking questions regarding tastes, like boc choy, how can there be a universal agreement on whether's it's "unpleasant?" If you want to enjoy a more raw diet, then the first order of business is just diving in and trying things. What's the worst thing that could happen if you put it in your mouth and didn't like it?

Kimchi can be pasteurized just like sauerkraut. You have to read the labels. I don't know about any animal product with kimchi so I can't help you out there but I have made it myself. A LOT cheaper than the kind I bought at Whole Foods in the refrigerated section for over $4 a jar.

banana who Wrote:
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> First of all, in asking questions regarding
> tastes, like boc choy, how can there be a
> universal agreement on whether's it's
> "unpleasant?" If you want to enjoy a more raw
> diet, then the first order of business is just
> diving in and trying things. What's the worst
> thing that could happen if you put it in your
> mouth and didn't like it?

Not every green leaf has any strong or distinct taste. In my opinion, for instance, baby spinach is virtually flavorless. Most people would probably not give "bad taste" as a reason for disliking it. Boc Choy is sold in small bundles, typically. I haven't seen it anywhere where I can just buy exactly how little or how much I want. I have a thing about buying food and then throwing it away. If it has a flavor that I find extremely unpleasant, I might end up doing that. For all I know, boc choy is one of those things you should really cook. In which case, I'm not going to buy it. So I guess that's what I'm asking. Does it have a distinct, unique, or strong flavor, or is it pretty much like other common greens, such as spinache or iceburg/romaine lettuce?

I was at an asian store looking for a suitable replacement for romaine lettuce in my spring rolls. I ended up buying non-baby spinach, but I had my eye the boc choy as well. However, not knowing if it would be a total disaster, I thought I'd find a little more information about it first.

Same goes for the winter melon.

I understand the whole "just buy it and try it" thing. I've done a hell of a lot of that in the past. I even bought some lychee today for the first time, as well as a jicama root. But I've heard something about both of those. Boc Choy is a mystery to me, and given that there's a community of people that are likely to have their own opinion about it, it was easy enough for me to ask about it here.

Boc choy is in the cabbage family and tastes like cabbage leaves, albeit a softer texture. If you were in an Asian market, I am surprised they didn't sell it loose. Look for baby bok choy if possible because it would probably be even milder. Go to as many different Asian markets as possible (especially Thai/Korean) because they seem to carry the most produce. In Chicago's Chinatown I have never seen an extensive produce market compared to the Vietnamese and Korean 'hoods.

I have had winter melon, it was recommended to cook it,tasted like a very bland squash with a slight bitter flavor. It didn't have a flavor that made me want to regularly eat it. It was also for a recipe that was supposed to help someone who had difficulty urinating. It definately opens up the pipes for that.

banana who Wrote:
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> Go to as many different Asian markets as possible

I live in Tulsa, Oklahoma. XD ...as far as I'm concerned, there's only two asian stores here (the others are super tiny, overpriced, and without much to offer). And, one of the two sells a lot of vegetables that appear to be rotting. So that leaves only one, and it's relatively new also. I love Chicago, you guys have Mitsuwa! Lucky bastard.



Mislu Wrote:
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> I have had winter melon, it was recommended to
> cook it,tasted like a very bland squash with a
> slight bitter flavor. It didn't have a flavor that
> made me want to regularly eat it. It was also for
> a recipe that was supposed to help someone who had
> difficulty urinating. It definately opens up the
> pipes for that.

I read that it picks up whatever flavor you add to it. So, if you cook it with... whatever... it will have a flavor of... whatever. Otherwise I guess it supposed to be pretty bland.

Maybe if I mix it with a bunch of sweeter fruits it would be worth a try.

The store bought kimchi is going to have cooked shrimp in it.

If you want a raw vegan kimchi, its easy enough to make your own. You can use a device like the perfect pickler, or just a mason jar (and some care) to make your own raw vegan kimchi.

Remember, this is a vegan forum, so the posts need to be vegan in nature. Its ok for non vegan folk to participate as long as the posts are vegan.

I live in Tulsa, Oklahoma. XD ...as far as I'm concerned, there's only two asian stores here (the others are super tiny, overpriced, and without much to offer). And, one of the two sells a lot of vegetables that appear to be rotting. So that leaves only one, and it's relatively new also. I love Chicago, you guys have Mitsuwa! Lucky bastard.

OK? Where the winds go...Sorry, but I am surprised they have one Asian store. Diversity is a good thing. Make your own. So easy and cheap.

J - I've made raw, vegan Kimchi. It's hard to find the correct pepper flakes without additives. Many of the pepper flakes are from China rather than Korea. I used a covered bowl to make it. I haven't make it in a couple of years. There is some controversy whether or not fermented foods are good for the body.

I've never had Winter Melon. Bok Choi is, as stated above, cabbage. I only ate it cooked in Chinese food a few times. I don't eat as much cabbage anymore, though.

Good luck. Therese

Personally, I love Kimchi. I've never seen it with shrimp in it, though, but I can guarantee you, if it is there, it is cooked. No one wants to get sued over food poisoning cases.

Not all store bought kimchi has shrimp in it. Kings Kimchi is raw, vegan and very good. I talked to their customer service and they assured me it was vegan, raw, gluten free, etc. That is the only brand I've ever seen in the stores...

It is a rip off though. I think Wal Mart supercenters carry it for $4 a bottle, but we started making our own (we used the juices from the store one as a starter for our first jar and it worked well).

It's really simple, we soak a bowl of cabbage in super salty water for like a day, then rinse it, then we add in a bunch of sliced up carrots, ginger and garlic. We mix it all together in a bowl, add a bit more salt, some juices from the previous batch (to get that good bacteria started), a ton of cayenne (love it) and then we jar it up and leave it sitting for maybe half a week on the shelf...

It's so delicious, and we calculated that by making it ourselves, we get 4-5 times as much kimchi for the price of ONE of the storebougt...not to mention when we make it ourselves we can use local/organic ingredients and the storebought is conventional....

Oops I forgot, we also add a little raw apple cider vinegar as well.

I've experienced noticeable improvements in digestion since I've made kimchi a part of my life.

The kimchi I saw only had shrimp in it at one store. The one at the other asian store did not. But knowing that it will not be raw is good to know.

However, the raw-ness of some of the other ingredients were questionable as well. So, obviously I didn't buy any. Making it myself would be interesting, as would making some sauerkraut.

Thank you all for the input. I believe I got answers to all of my questions except the one about winter melon. Not sure how good it is raw, but I think it's cheap enough to try anyway.

I've eaten baby bok choys raw with an asian marinade. It's not too terrible if it's really well marinated where the salt/soy sauce or vinegar/lemon juice 'cooks" it down a bit. Putting it in the dehydrator may help a bit too. It's not as mellow as when cooked, but it isnt bad after an overnight, just a bit sharper flavor. I like to throw in some rehydrated shitake mushrooms with them, awesome. Those really taste just as good as if cooked.

and jargon 9if you're here), have you tried napa cabbage? if you shred it or dice it small, and sprinkle it with salt, let it sit half an hour, then squeeze it out it's pretty good raw.

rawalice Wrote:
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> and jargon (if you're here), have you tried napa
> cabbage? if you shred it or dice it small, and
> sprinkle it with salt, let it sit half an hour,
> then squeeze it out it's pretty good raw.

I haven't actually eaten any non-fermented raw cabbage before, that I can remember. (only cooked, and mixed with things like in egg rolls. I do not like large portions of cooked cabbage)

Why do you say squeeze it out? Does it actually create juices in the 30min of sitting?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 04:09PM by jargon.

It's a Chinese food cooking trick. That's what you have to do to the cabbage before making egg rolls or else there's too much water. Major amounts of liquids are released as well as almost all or any bitter flavors.
I've tried it on kale too to get rid of some of the bitterness and it works great. (Though that was for a cooked version.) The napa cabbage gets softer and way juicy compared to it before the "salt bath." probably about 1/2 tablespoon salt for a big head of finely chopped cabbage. Most of the salt generally leaches out with the water, just give it a toss or two in a big bowl once it starts to wilt to make sure everything gets its fair turn. well, good luck if you try it. now you're making me want to come up with some raw egg rolls.

has anyone actually tried those dehydrated raw coconut wrappers?
can you cut a coconut with a regular kitchen knife?

aren't you loosing a bunch of good vitamins and minerals and stuff by taking all that water out of the cabbage? or is the value in the fermented result? i'm just wondering, because i've just started making kimchi, and i skipped that step to preserve the nutrients. mine's not really that watery, but there is definitely some juice there. i used the napa cabbage. also, can kimchi be made with the regular round heads of cabbage?

I went to the Asian store today and looked again at the ingredients for the Kimchi they sold. It contains Monosodium glutamate. Gotta love pre-made foods!

i don't know. it's possible i suppose. i've never had kimchi, though the stuff i've seen was definitely made with regular cabbage.

i wish my mom would go raw foods and cook for me.

I usually make juice of winter melon with carrots and apple and little ginger. it's not bad like that. I use that juice as substitute for coffee or tea.

jargon Wrote:
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> I went to the Asian store today and looked again
> at the ingredients for the Kimchi they sold. It
> contains Monosodium glutamate. Gotta love pre-made
> foods!


That's because Asian stores are surprisingly bad for prepared foods, I have found. A bunch of additives, in other words. Whole Foods sells kimchi that is raw, no garbage. The only downside is that it's over $4 a jar Make yer own!!!

How to make your own *authentic* kimchi VERY EASILY:

Make a paste:

Dissolve 1 tbsp. sea salt in 1/2c spring water
Dissolve 1 tbsp. sweetener of your choice in mixture
add 10 cloves of garlic, put through garlic press
4'' ginger, diced finely as possible
1 cup dried red Korean chili powder--the flavor comes from nailing this spice, you will have to shop around and make sure you find one that has no garbage added to it, but it's worth the hunt

Mix all this up, store in a mason jar for up to a month.

In an enormous bowl, dissolve 3tbsp. sea salt into 1c spring water.

Add one giant napa cabbage, sliced into 1'' thick pieces, or however you want
Spiralize 1 medium daikon on broad setting, or chop/mandolin/whatever
Chop 1 bunch green onions

Mix around in bowl, massage/let soak for a few hours, until soft. Strain. For that many veggies, I would use 1/3-1/2 the paste in aforementioned recipe (WEAR GLVOES TO MIX IT!). Pack into mason jars with 1/2 inch space from the lid (the kimchi will expand).

Finally, let the kimchi sit somewhere warm, like on top of the fridge, for 2-3 days (I put a plate underneath the jars in case they leak).

Personal experience says period ingestion of probiotics is very beneficial.

hey phantom

awesome kim chi recipe
yep

that's how u do it

tasty too

luvs me some good kim chi!

hope u are the experimental type, jargon

its super easy
takes just a few minutes

do it once
and you'll not be intimidated by it a second time

easy peesy

and hot too

Thanks for the recipe, phantom! Will give it a go soon

I don't use any sweetener in my kimchi recipe, though the rest of it is similar.

There are so many chois. I like boc choi, baby boc choi, tat soi, yukina, mibuna, and other small brassicas. I grow them indoors in the winter in a window in pots. Other types include radish greens (Hong Vit), komatsuna, te you, mustard greens, arugula, ...

I also like to grow other greens (beets, chard, spinach - when young are not high in oxalates, cress, chrysanthemum, orach, purslane), lettuces, and herbs (chervil, parsley, basils, cilantro, fennel, ...

I get my seeds from High Mowing Organic Seeds:
www.highmowingseeds.com

vermontnl, WICKED LINK! Thank you!

jargon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Have any of you had experience with Kimchi? I know
> there are different variations with different
> ingredients. Is it typically kind of like
> sauerkraut where each separate ingredient is raw?
> Is it too heavy in something that makes it
> unhealthy? And, I know this is a vegan section,
> but there isn't a non-vegan raw food section here.
> Let's say a kimchi has shrimp in it, is it likely
> to be cooked shrimp, or would it be raw shrimp?
>
> Also, have any of you eaten winter melon or boc
> choi? Does boc choi have a strong flavor that one
> might find unpleasant, or is it sort of like
> spinach? A lot of recipes I found for winter melon
> involve cooking it. Can it be eaten raw, and is it
> an acquired taste or something that is easy to
> enjoy?
>
> Information on any of the above questions will be
> appreciated!


I don't care for kimchi. I like my cabbage boiled and plain with a bit of butter and salt and pepper, or cole slaw. Bok choy is okay, but after reading the goitrogen list, I like it cooked, 'cept sometimes I can't deal with the little black spots. (They're bugs!) Sometimes I'll eat it anyway. Winter melon is kind of ewwww. But some people like it and it's food I guess. It kind of tastes like cooked cucumbers if you like that sort of thing.

phantom, et al.,
you're welcome.