We visited a favourite health food store today to buy a capsule maker for capsuling up herbs etc and were told the FDA had regulated that they can no longer be sold in stores. Can you believe that? So, if you want to make your own capsuled turmeric and black pepper for a dollar or two a bottle you're out of luck, you'll have to spend $12 on the premade version.

If you have the inclination to ever capsule anything for yourself in future I recommend purchasing one of these before the online sources are all done away with as well.

Sheesh.

[www.capmquick.com]

Coco, are you in the States right now or are you referring to some Canadian FDA? Having worked in a health store, empty vegan capsules were widely available. That is very odd. However, it underscores the need to keep on top of this things so we can figure out alternatives. It's not negative to be informed on such encroachment because then we can become proactive and deal with it effectively.

We're in the States right now, they had plenty of empty capsules but are no longer allowed to sell the capsule maker >.

What is the reason given for the restriction? It is because the capsule maker is a health product (if so why restrict it), or because it could be used for something else and they don't want it to be used for that other purpose?

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

I just started going on an ormus board. And there is a restriction on some item that I never thought of as being something for health. Pharmacy grade LYE. Apparently thats used in making ormus, but its difficult to get because other people are using it to process illecit drugs. Perhaps thats also the reason for the restrictions on caps. I can't stand it...what line has to be drawn for people to assume some responsiblity for themselves? Soda size?

Mislu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just started going on an ormus board. And there
> is a restriction on some item that I never thought
> of as being something for health. Pharmacy grade
> LYE. Apparently thats used in making ormus, but
> its difficult to get because other people are
> using it to process illecit drugs. Perhaps thats
> also the reason for the restrictions on caps. I
> can't stand it...what line has to be drawn for
> people to assume some responsiblity for
> themselves? Soda size?

Mislu, I doubt the FDA really cares about our health! It's all about preventing us from using alternative health items like herbs and the like. When people have posted various updates from Naturalnews.com, there are always those who shrug their shoulders and act like it's no big deal. You never think the day will come when you can't get what you always got...until it gets there

And remember, this applies to Internet access, too!

banana who Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mislu, I doubt the FDA really cares about our
> health! It's all about preventing us from using
> alternative health items like herbs and the like.

But surely if FDA wanted to prevent you from using alternative health supplements, they would have prohibited the supplements themselves. Otherwise what's the point prohibiting the making device, since people can still buy pre-made supplements and become healthy, and so the aim of FDA of preventing them from doing so is not satisfied?

I understand that buying pre-made version is more expensive, and so FDA is making it more difficult for people to take supplements if they want. The trouble is, the difference is so tiny, unless someone is super poor they are likely to be able to afford $12 for a bottle of supplements, in other words the gain for FDA appears to be tiny versus going to all the trouble prohibiting something from being sold (it's not an easy thing to do). That's why I wondered if there is another reason behind it.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2012 11:05PM by chat.

LOL Chat, that's exactly what's been happening bit by bit for years! Many natural pharmacies in US and Canada have been raided, product, computers, etc confiscated. Lots of bills passed handing over regulatory power for medicinals to big pharma. Technically it's illegal to grow quite a few herbs and flowers with medicinal properties in our gardens already. How that will be practically applied we'll have to see. Thank goodness for weeds. Though it's already illegal to harvest plants from many wild areas. Good luck catching me at it is all I have to say. They'll have to pump my stomach...

I see what you are saying, but in all those cases the gave a reason for the prohibition - I mean they didn't say simply "we are restricting this so that people have one less opportunity to become healthy" That's why I wondered what was the reason this time.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

Chat, did you ever think that it's being done GRADUALLY because they are banking on us being so asleep that we will accept it little by little? Another thing is that perhaps they want to control the sale of herbs themselves so they cannot ban them for being unsafe and then turn around and sell them, right?

I find it hilarious that the FDA has all these drugs with multiple complaints and yet they keep them on the shelves and take capsules off.

Maybe its an overall attempt to control the creation of anything? even making drugs is creative and takes some type of mind power to do so. Knowledge about herbs and preparing them takes knowledge, memory and creative power. If that all gets controlled by a few people....

banana who Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Chat, did you ever think that it's being done
> GRADUALLY because they are banking on us being so
> asleep that we will accept it little by little?
> Another thing is that perhaps they want to control
> the sale of herbs themselves so they cannot ban
> them for being unsafe and then turn around and
> sell them, right?

See, that's interesting - no, what you write didnt occur to me, because I have no idea what FDA are "banking on". And without this knowledge to assume anything would be just that, an assumption, and therefore I asked for a reason instead: a reason which FDA might have given for the restriction. This appears to be the very minimum one would want to learn about before coming to any reasonable conclusion.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

coco wrote…

<<<LOL Chat, that's exactly what's been happening bit by bit for years!>>>

BW wrote…

<<<Chat, did you ever think that it's being done GRADUALLY because they are banking on us being so asleep that we will accept it little by little?>>>

You two nailed it - those who actually want us to be Sick know they can’t move too fast and have been planning this for over 100 years. I addressed this point with Tam in this relatively recent post…

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]
Re: This Website is now Illegal in North Carolina…
Posted by: John Rose
Date: April 28, 2012 02:22PM

The REAL problem lies in the fact that we are Sick and Dis-Connected and then, the Sickest of the Sickest of us are Mis-Directing all of our so-called Experts so that none of them and none of us ever figure how to solve any of our problems. And then, these Sick, Dis-Connected Psychopaths are placing all of their Sick friends in every government (mainly in bureaucracies and appointed positions) so they can keep people like us from telling the Truth that it’s what we’re Eating that’s making us Sick and Dis-Connected.

Tam, I’ve asked you before whether or not you have studied the Fabian Society and since you have not answered me and since you keep missing the point, I’ll include a few paragraphs from my file…

• In the name of liberty, the Fabians seek to destroy individual rights. While they smugly wrap themselves in the Constitution, they plot to transfer power to bureaucracies staffed with their friends and paid for by those who’s freedoms they seek to usurp. They seek to entangle us in a jungle of laws, phrased in incomprehensible language, upon which we will not be able to extricate ourselves. Their central crusade is the eradication of GOD in public life.

• The Fabians sought to overthrow our system by changing the meaning of our stated legal concepts, and to codify those changes with cases brought by Fabian lawyers before Fabian Judges. The effect of this has been that while the technical wording of American law hasn’t changed much, the implementation has been transferred from the citizen and his elected representatives, to appointed bureaucrats. The Fabians have, diabolically, used our own laws to change the law. Freedom is the victim of these Socialist manipulations.

• "Today the path of total dictatorship in the United States can be laid by strictly legal means (just as they where in Nazi Germany), unseen and unheard by the Congress, the President, or the people. Outwardly we have a Constitutional government. We have operating within our government and political system, another body representing another form of government – a bureaucratic elite." - Senator William Jenner, 1954

Peace and Love..........John

Here are a few highlights from my file on FDA and Corruption…

• Currently, 150 top FDA officials hold significant amounts of stock in the pharmaceutical companies they were supposed to be regulating.
• 70% of Advisory Board members owning stock in vaccines, owning patents on vaccines, and accepting salaries and benefits as employees of the drug companies.
• 8 out of 11 board members of the FDA had financial ties (owned companies or stock) to the dairy or beef council.

Peace and Love..........John

Here is an article from my file on FDA Raids On Healers…

[www.newstarget.com]
Tyranny in the USA: The true history of FDA raids on healers, vitamin shops and supplement companies

Peace and Love..........John

*shudders*

Like I said, thank goodness for weeds. A neighbour and I are raiding the wildflower path for elderberries lately, going to make tincture and syrup to use over the winter. I think I'll dehydrate some berries too. Dandelion, dock, burdock, and chicory root will be ready in the fall. Our freedom here is in education and, even though there is a move to restrict the sharing of info on the internet and elsewhere, so far talking to each other is still free. So, share what you know. This site is great for that.

And Chat, so long as cigarettes, alcohol, refined sugar, coffee, unhealthy fats, preservative laden foods, untested GMOs, etc are abundantly available, I'm going to have a hard time believing that restriction of natural anything is a move made for our health.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/07/2012 01:17PM by coco.

coco Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And Chat, so long as cigarettes, alcohol, refined
> sugar, coffee, unhealthy fats, preservative laden
> foods, untested GMOs, etc are abundantly
> available, I'm going to have a hard time believing
> that restriction of natural anything is a move
> made for our health.

Well, I'm not arguing that it was - I merely wondered about the reason which was given for the restriction at issue! And here it is almost funny, there are so many passionate posts in this thread already, but nobody has said a single word about what is this reason. Is it really the case that none of you guys cares?

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

coco,

I assume that the capsule maker either has an expired patent, or has been flagged for being a means to encapsulate some new illicit street drug. These seem to me to be the most reasonable of possible explanations. There must be an alternative device available somewhere; which hfs did you go to?

Also, I am going on record as saying that I am relieved someone is regulating the sale of lye, which is not just for harmless ormus production, LOL.

Buddy in the store (Zerbo's) said it's being used to capsule illegal substances. How stupid is that though? People who are making/selling drugs can generally afford a lab set up for capsuling it up. It's blatant nonsense as far as I can tell.
And the ingredients for bathsalts and crystal meth are still available. How about going straight to the source, eh?

Capsules and capsule makers are still available online and TAX FREE even! Perfect opportunity to really stick it to the man with a double whammy... 1) get healthy against all THEIR best efforts, and 2) do it tax free. HA! Take that big brother!

Oh wait, but then THEY'd build an online profile of us as nutrition renegades who own weapons of mass nutrition.

Shipping wasn't free, they really dinged us there. Ouch.

Raw-Curious: I LOLd @ "weapons of mass nutriton." Good stuff.

coco Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Buddy in the store (Zerbo's) said it's being used
> to capsule illegal substances. How stupid is that
> though? People who are making/selling drugs can
> generally afford a lab set up for capsuling it up.
> It's blatant nonsense as far as I can tell.

I see, this is it then. What about people on the street who are making/selling drugs, who don't normally have labs because tgey are poor addicts themselves, and so they prepare drugs out of whatever they can find. Could this be directed at them?

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

They are so incredibly small fry as to be inconsequential to drug traffic enforcement. Little nickle and dime pushers on the street are only good for finding out who is selling larger quantity higher on up the line. I mean, how ridiculous is it to target a legitimate product that is mostly used for creating nutritional supplements for the purpose of lessening the drug trade? Drugs are still going to be sold, lol, capsule makers or not. How about what drug pushers are putting into the capsules, better to target that, no? I mean, you don't use scotch tape to stop the bleeding when someone has severed a limb. Sheesh.

I honestly think that the only people who will survive this are those who find a way to get out of 'civilized' areas and ... stay away.

The way this system works, they don't really care what MINORITY thinks. It is 51% of the voters that matter. They can make everone walk backwards if they want to. So, I don't think that the society has a chance. Only indivuduals, maybe, do.

Coco - yep, they really sting you on shipping. Amazon had those items eligible for FREE Super Saver Shipping, but I'm sure we'd all rather support a smaller online Mom & Pop shop.

BW - thanks! I think sometimes a good shot of LOL might be ALMOST as satisfying as a good shot of green juice.

Chat - I THINK maybe the reason they restricted selling the stuff in stores is for the same reason they don't let you buy large quantities of OTC cold/allergy medicine anymore. Because those items can be used to produce illegal drugs. It's okay to buy small quantities for personal use, but when you start to buy large quants it raises flags. Online purchases can be easily monitored and tracked, but gov't can't monitor some guy walking into a local health store and buying 5,000 empty capsules with cash. I'm just guessing here, but it seems logical that the rule is directed at small-time drug makers - not the big guys who have warehouse labs & buy their supplies thru more direct channels, not the poor addict trying to make his own drugs - but the in between producer whose got a lab in his basement in a small rural town. Unfortunately, health minded folks like Coco get punished and have to paying extra for shipping because of it.

Is there any actual proof that the FDA regulates capsule makers? I'm not trying to put anyone on the spot so much as I'm trying to avoid getting stressed over something based on the second-hand word of some dude in a health food store. Not healthy!

Interesting(?) that 4 of the regulars on this forum have ties to Michigan and the Detroit area. That state must be some kind of raw foods mecca.

Michigan has a few really good health stores. Not much in the Windsor area which is the nearest Canadian city to me. I'm from Toronto though, there's tons of raw happening there.
If that's what the manager of the store says I'd think it was for real. What other reason would they have for discontinuing a profitable product? That's a heck of a store too, carries tons of raw friendly stuff and some really obscure products. Pretty reliably conscious and knowledgeable. I like them a lot.

raw_curious Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Chat - I THINK maybe the reason they restricted
> selling the stuff in stores is for the same reason
> they don't let you buy large quantities of OTC
> cold/allergy medicine anymore. Because those items
> can be used to produce illegal drugs. It's okay to
> buy small quantities for personal use, but when
> you start to buy large quants it raises flags.
> Online purchases can be easily monitored and
> tracked, but gov't can't monitor some guy walking
> into a local health store and buying 5,000 empty
> capsules with cash. I'm just guessing here, but
> it seems logical that the rule is directed at
> small-time drug makers - not the big guys who have
> warehouse labs & buy their supplies thru more
> direct channels, not the poor addict trying to
> make his own drugs - but the in between producer
> whose got a lab in his basement in a small rural
> town. Unfortunately, health minded folks like
> Coco get punished and have to paying extra for
> shipping because of it.

Cheers raw curious this makes sense! I thought of something along the lines of a poor addict having accsess to the equipment which offers the possibility of profit (and so more drugs), and him trying to make it reality by baking dangerous cookies, having no knowledge and means to bake "good" ones. But your explanation makes better sense.

>Banana ice-cream rocks!<

I just thought that I would be able to find one source on the internet that backs up this claim. So when you're in Michigan, do you hang with Paul, Jodi, or Tamukha?

coco Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Michigan has a few really good health stores. Not
> much in the Windsor area which is the nearest
> Canadian city to me. I'm from Toronto though,
> there's tons of raw happening there.
> If that's what the manager of the store says I'd
> think it was for real. What other reason would
> they have for discontinuing a profitable product?
> That's a heck of a store too, carries tons of raw
> friendly stuff and some really obscure products.
> Pretty reliably conscious and knowledgeable. I
> like them a lot.