Hi, this is my first post here on the forums. I'm new to the raw food world and recently read the 80/10/10 book by Doug Graham, which to me is very convincing on many levels. I still, however remain skeptical about the amount of fat he recommends because I hear conflicting views around the raw food community as to what is the optimal amount of fat you should be getting. So my question is, what is your experience with fat intake, do you feel better with more/less ect.?

That fat specific ratio makes you skinny long term if everything is in place. But it depends. For example, if you suffered from food absorption problems and you were super skinny, it could help you gain weight. If your hormones were missing something, it could make you gain weight. If there are sugar metabolism problems, it could make you gain weight. David Wolf recommends 33% fat but that seems high for him and he does not look good (long term). Your truth could be somewhere in between. It is easy to fix by eating avocados (omaga 6), walnuts (omega 3), etc. Some people need more protein. Many hormones are amino derived (from diet protein) or lipid derived (from fat). So lowering protein or fat to 10% could affect hormones. Just about all metabolic enzymes are proteins. So a low protein diet could affect those two. It has many advantages but also some weaknesses (my opinion).

For more hormone info look here:

[en.wikipedia.org]


"Peptide hormones consist of chains of amino acids. Examples of small peptide hormones are TRH and vasopressin. Peptides composed of scores or hundreds of amino acids are referred to as proteins. Examples of protein hormones include insulin and growth hormone. More complex protein hormones bear carbohydrate side-chains and are called glycoprotein hormones. Luteinizing hormone, follicle-stimulating hormone and thyroid-stimulating hormone are glycoprotein hormones. There is also another type of hydrophilic hormone called nonpeptide hormones. Although they don't have peptide connections, they are assimilated as peptide hormones.

Lipid and phospholipid-derived hormones derive from lipids such as linoleic acid and arachidonic acid and phospholipids. The main classes are the steroid hormones that derive from cholesterol and the eicosanoids. Examples of steroid hormones are testosterone and cortisol. Sterol hormones such as calcitriol are a homologous system. The adrenal cortex and the gonads are primary sources of steroid hormones. Examples of eicosanoids are the widely studied prostaglandins.

Monoamines derived from aromatic amino acids like phenylalanine, tyrosine, tryptophan by the action of aromatic amino acid decarboxylase enzymes.
"



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/2013 10:58AM by Panchito.

No. Long term it will lead to severe nutritional deficiencies and other health problems too.

More on this later.

I'll say what I always say, go to youtube and search Brian Clement and listen to what he has to say about sugar! He is the foremost authority on the subject IMO. and the most successful health educator in the world. You might even search Brian Clement on 80/10/10

Panchito, what about DW doesn't "look good?" Because he's not emaciated? I mean, it reminds me of anorexics who go online and see other skeletal peeps and long for that body.

DW is not a Skinny Minnie and I don't know if he aspires to that. I grew up skinny (and was underweight for a time) and being on the other side of the coin, I can see that carrying too much weight and too little both are problematic. Although I wish to shed pounds to feel lighter, I remember being 100 pounds or less and feeling insubstantial. I have never been anorexic but to others it made no difference due to the way I looked.

*Edit: I cannot remember who said this but I found it extremely helpful: 80/10/10 should be used as a framework rather than being militant about it. So either you can have days where you exceed 10% fat and then maybe lay off it on some days or raise it to 20%. DW is higher than that and perhaps if you go under you'll hit a sweet spot.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/2013 05:40PM by banana who.

that is quite a stretch of the imagination. He does not look fit to me. His fat ratio is based on the geometrical shape of a triangle or something like that.

banana who Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Panchito, what about DW doesn't "look good?"
> Because he's not emaciated? I mean, it reminds me
> of anorexics who go online and see other skeletal
> peeps and long for that body.

Panchito, did I misunderstand what you meant by "looking good?" I took it literally that you don't think his appearance reflects a healthy diet.

Thank you all so much for the replies. It's refreshing to find people who are not so strict/militant about this lifestyle.

I thought the 80/10/10 diet was about eating lots of carbs in the form of fruit? That is the bigger question here, I guess this diet is just being used as an example. I liked Panchito's first description, basically it depends on the state of health you are in. The question of 10% fat is fine if you can be healthy on that and not be hungry all the time. The less fat you can be healthy on the better.

Yes, I think 10% of calories from fat is sufficient fat intake. 5% is low for some but others thrive on it. I prefer 15% or so myself. And that's okay. I do think that getting most of your carbohydrate intake from sweet fruits is best. And I have yet to see the proposed or supposed evidence that 80/10/10 is unhealthy. lol! Just track your own intakes and do your own research and don't listen to vague misrepresentations. Eat enough green leafy vegetables. Put your food intake into fitday or cronometer and make sure you are doing okay at first. As time goes on, you figure things out. No one is perfect. An omnivorous diet, in general, doesn't daily supply 100% or more of the RDA of many vitamins. From what I've seen of my 80/10/10 or 75/15/10 days, my nutritional intake is superior, with many times the percentage of vitamins I need, extra protein, and plenty of fats because my omega ratios aren't messed up because I don't consume grains.

Personally? As much as you're hungry for, assuming you know how to listen to your body. For thousands of years, humanity managed to survive by listening to our bodies.

I find I do best when eating a lot of greens, regardless of the fat content of anything paired with them that day. Sometimes I'm hungry for fruit. Sometimes I want avocados. It really just depends.

If you're transitioning to a raw diet for the first time, the best thing you can do is take it slowly. Start replacing dishes with their raw equivalents, even if it's gradual. The people who most often have problems are the ones who force themselves into it too quickly and aren't able to stop and listen to what their bodies really need.

Best of luck with your raw journey!

[fresherthanlife.com]

I found that 10% wasn't sufficient for me. Maybe it worked for others. I agree with fresherthanlife in that greens are more important than fruit which is not the philosophy in 80/10/10 which places a high emphasis on fruit. Also, I found that monitoring my body and the reactions it was having based on the foods I was eating/not eating critical to my life. I could've died if I hadn't paid attention to my body vs. following what others had to say, including friends.

I found Dr. Joel Fuhrman's "Eat to Live" the most helpful/sound advice of all the nutritional/raw books out there regarding eating nutrient-dense foods.