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rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 03:26AM

[nutritionfacts.org]

"When you look at a bottle of oil in the grocery store there are “best-before” date, advising consumers how long they have to consume it before it starts going rancid and builds up oxidation products that can be particularly harmful to human health.

Here are the best-before dates for eight culinary oils: almond oil, avocado oil, hazelnut, macadamia, grape seed, rice bran, toasted sesame, and walnut oil. These are the best-before dates in number of months, counting from the day the oil is made. So if you make batch of walnut oil on January 1st 2012, the best-before date printed on the bottle from that batch would be 12 months later, January 1, 2013. Now this is making some pretty strict assumptions. This is based you are keeping the oil in the refridgerator in a airtight, dark containiner, so it’s not exposed to air, room temperature, or light, particularly after it’s opened.

This group of scientists were skeptical that the companies were printing accurate dates, and so they put all the oils to the test to find out that the true these expirations dates were. Would it match what the companies say? Would the companies put a longer duration trying to make the oil appear more stable than it really is? Or would they put a shorter duration on, to encourage people to buy their product more frequently?

For rice bran oil the company said 7 months. Actual estimated shelf-life found in their tests? 6.5 months. Not bad, pretty close. In some cases, though, the truth was stretched one way; in others it was stretched the other way. Look at almond oil. They said it would last over a year, and it really only stays good for 3 months, and remember that’s 3 months in the fridge, in the dark, and after production, not after when you buy it.

Macadamia oil and walnuts were the real outliers though. Mac oil lasted the longest —over a year, the company totally undersold it’s stability, but for walnut oil, they said a year and it only lasts about 2 and a half weeks, according to testing with the “Rancimat.”"


from a comment:

"Dr. Vogel conducted a study that compared different fats and oils (olive
oil, canola oil, and salmon) and how they impaired our endothelial
cells. Our endothelial cells are within our blood vessels lining their
walls. They keep clots from forming and keep our blood running smoothly.
It also helps our blood vessels dilate and contract when needed. The
participants of the study ate a meal containing 3.5 tablespoons of olive
oil and the examiners measured their arterial damage after 3 hours.
“Contrary to part of our hypothesis, our study found that omega-9 (oleic
acid)-rich olive oil impairs endothelial function postprandially.” They
also make note that “In terms of their postprandial effect on
endothelial function, the beneficial components of the Mediterranean and
Lyon Diet Heart Study diets appear to be antioxidant-rich foods,
including vegetables [and] fruits”"

[content.onlinejacc.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 03:29AM by Panchito.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: SueZ ()
Date: February 27, 2014 04:50AM

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> [nutritionfacts.org]
> e-of-cooking-oils/
>
> "When you look at a bottle of oil in the grocery
> store there are “best-before” date, advising
> consumers how long they have to consume it before
> it starts going rancid and builds up oxidation
> products that can be particularly harmful to human
> health.
>
> Here are the best-before dates for eight culinary
> oils: almond oil, avocado oil, hazelnut,
> macadamia, grape seed, rice bran, toasted sesame,
> and walnut oil. These are the best-before dates in
> number of months, counting from the day the oil is
> made. So if you make batch of walnut oil on
> January 1st 2012, the best-before date printed on
> the bottle from that batch would be 12 months
> later, January 1, 2013. Now this is making some
> pretty strict assumptions. This is based you are
> keeping the oil in the refridgerator in a
> airtight, dark containiner, so it’s not exposed
> to air, room temperature, or light, particularly
> after it’s opened.
>
> This group of scientists were skeptical that the
> companies were printing accurate dates, and so
> they put all the oils to the test to find out that
> the true these expirations dates were. Would it
> match what the companies say? Would the companies
> put a longer duration trying to make the oil
> appear more stable than it really is? Or would
> they put a shorter duration on, to encourage
> people to buy their product more frequently?
>
> For rice bran oil the company said 7 months.
> Actual estimated shelf-life found in their tests?
> 6.5 months. Not bad, pretty close. In some cases,
> though, the truth was stretched one way; in others
> it was stretched the other way. Look at almond
> oil. They said it would last over a year, and it
> really only stays good for 3 months, and remember
> that’s 3 months in the fridge, in the dark, and
> after production, not after when you buy it.
>
> Macadamia oil and walnuts were the real outliers
> though. Mac oil lasted the longest —over a year,
> the company totally undersold it’s stability,
> but for walnut oil, they said a year and it only
> lasts about 2 and a half weeks, according to
> testing with the “Rancimat.”"


Ok, for store bought non-raw oils, but so what anyway and what the heck is a "rancimat"?


And next we read on to the usual trademark panchito "let's see how far we can twist all this stuff around and shove extra bogus study stuff into it to make oil look really really bad with a gigantic shoehorn which no one will notice"...


> from a comment:
>
> "Dr. Vogel conducted a study that compared
> different fats and oils (olive
> oil, canola oil, and salmon) and how they impaired
> our endothelial
> cells. Our endothelial cells are within our blood
> vessels lining their
> walls. They keep clots from forming and keep our
> blood running smoothly.
> It also helps our blood vessels dilate and
> contract when needed. The
> participants of the study ate a meal containing
> 3.5 tablespoons of olive
> oil and the examiners measured their arterial
> damage after 3 hours.
> “Contrary to part of our hypothesis, our study
> found that omega-9 (oleic
> acid)-rich olive oil impairs endothelial function
> postprandially.” They
> also make note that “In terms of their
> postprandial effect on
> endothelial function, the beneficial components of
> the Mediterranean and
> Lyon Diet Heart Study diets appear to be
> antioxidant-rich foods,
> including vegetables fruits”"
>
> [content.onlinejacc.org]
> 5/1455


This is one of the most asinine studies I've seen yet. I'd say a more accurate conclusion than these M.D,'s pulled out of their butts would be not to eat oil with bread and crackers.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 03:59PM

you can always remain skeptic. Nobody is forcing you to beleive.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 27, 2014 04:59PM

Panchito only believes what he wants to believe. I've asked him for the slightest bit of evidence against high-fat raw plant-based diets, which he claims is "everywhere", but he can't come up with anything. This is not a disagreement, this is simply asking for real evidence as opposed to hearsay. Not a study done on high-fat animal and/or processed foods, a study done on high-fat raw plant-based diets, considering all lifestyle factors.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 05:04PM

lol. did you bother to read the post? there is a link with a study that says that olive oil damages the inner layer of the blood vessels (supposedly because high fats are loaded with AGEs and that is what they touch). I just don't want to be a victim of idiotic discussions. I'll leave that for other newer people



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 05:05PM by Panchito.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 27, 2014 05:14PM

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lol. did you bother to read the post? there is a
> link with a study that says that olive oil damages
> the inner layer of the blood vessels (supposedly
> because high fats are loaded with AGEs and that is
> what they touch). I just don't want to be a victim
> of idiotic discussions. I'll leave that for other
> newer people


That's one form of PURE fat... what about nuts, seeds, and coconut? Newer people? Do you really believe you are well-versed in nutrition and health because you go on a nutrition website daily?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 05:15PM by jtprindl.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 05:43PM

ja ja. you finally GOT the study. Now, don't try to spin things around or try change the subject.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 27, 2014 05:49PM

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ja ja. you finally GOT the study. Now, don't try
> to spin things around or try change the subject.


So because olive oil (which is ONE form of PURE fat) and something you wouldn't find anywhere in nature is unhealthy, that means all types of fats are unhealthy? You'd be better off not posting.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 05:55PM

Lets make clear that you have not refuted your original claim. You are changing it after I showed you the study. What happened to your logic?

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 27, 2014 06:02PM

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lets make clear that you have not refuted your
> original claim. You are changing it after I showed
> you the study. What happened to your logic?


I'm not changing any of my claims, what are you talking about? When did I say anything about olive oil? Still waiting on that study proving high-fat raw plant-based diets are unhealthy. You fail to make the distinction between different forms of fats (fats are not just pure oils). You also fail to understand that because one form of pure fat (removed from its natural source) is unhealthy, that doesn't mean all fats from all sources are unhealthy. Get it?

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Panchito ()
Date: February 27, 2014 06:05PM

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Panchito only believes what he wants to believe.
> I've asked him for the slightest bit of evidence
> against high-fat raw plant-based diets
, which he
> claims is "everywhere", but he can't come up with
> anything.

you do have a very short term memmory (convenience?)

bye bye!!! (I wasted enough of my time doing the fool)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 06:09PM by Panchito.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 27, 2014 06:10PM

Panchito Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jtprindl Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Panchito only believes what he wants to
> believe.
> > I've asked him for the slightest bit of
> evidence
> > against high-fat raw plant-based diets, which
> he
> > claims is "everywhere", but he can't come up
> with
> > anything.
>
> you do have a very short term memmory
> (covenience?)
>
> bye bye!!!


I honestly think you have some type of mental problem. I'm being serious and anyone reading your responses could come to the same conclusion. Olive oil being unhealthy doesn't even qualify as the "slightest bit of evidence" against high-fat raw plant-based diets. A diet can be high-fat, raw, and plant-based and completely exclude all oils, do you not understand this? Not to mention, the study you're referring to doesn't even mention the quality of olive oil used and how it was processed.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2014 06:11PM by jtprindl.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Diogenez ()
Date: February 28, 2014 10:06AM

Quote

Are We Oil And Fat Eaters By T.C. Fry

It is well known that most meat eaters trim the fat off meats because they have an aversion to it. This is not without a sound physiological basis.

However we witness millions eating foods fried in oils and fats. Millions eat foods smothered in oils, butter, margarine and other fats. Oils and fats constitute about 40% of the American caloric intake.

For this heavy indulgence Americans pay dearly. Indigestion is an American institution. Pathogenic effects are rife. It is said that 50% of all American meals result in indigestion. Antacids are a multi-billion dollar business. At the door of oils and fats can be placed much of the blame.

Humans are constitutionally frugivores. All the fats needed in the human system are self-created from the raw materials furnished by carbohydrate foods just as cattle elaborate their fats from a grass diet. It is not necessary that humans eat oils or fats of any kind to have the body oils and fats necessary for great well-being. One of the chief complaints of many who eat sugar and wheat products is that it turns into unwanted fat, thus indicating how efficiently our organisms convert carbohydrates to the oils and fats we need.

Fruits we digest with dispatch, efficiency and comfort. Most are discharged from the stomach in from 10 to 30 minutes, whereas oils and fats lay heavy on the stomach for hours before digestion really begins.

To be sure, our diet can profit from certain foods with an oil content. From nuts and seeds we can obtain the linoleic and linolenic acids that we need. But if nuts, seeds and avocadoes constitute a mere 1 1/2% to 2% of our diet, that is ample.

Professional Hygienists point out that the body’s needs for oil are very small. All condemn free oils, that is, oils out of context with the food in which nature developed them.

Most Americans eat oils and fats with foods that are of a differing digestive character than oils. In the combination of bread and butter or bread and margarine or bread and peanut butter—quite common combinations, the bread requires an alkaline medium for its digestion. Within two or three hours starches are usually ready to pass into the intestinal tract for appropriation. Fats and oils usually do not begin to digest until about the fourth hour.

Hence, when oils and fats are eaten with other foods such as starches they coat the food particles such that little or no digestion results, but indigestion does! By the time the oils or fats surrounding the other food particles are digested, the starches and sugars are food for bacteria instead of us. Bacteria convert carbohydrates into poisonous acids (especially acetic) and alcohol. Our stomachs become a fermenting mess. Caustic bicarbonates end the process by killing off the bacteria and neutralizing the acids.

But this is merely a first step in a chain of problems. Indigestion is bad enough, and employing antacids begets yet other problems. Fats degenerate into butyric and other acids. This begins a long train of pathology that can exhibit as inflammations, ulcers and eventually cancer. Rashes, pimples, biliousness, a “tired feeling” and other complaints are often a direct result of a heavy oil or fat meal.

Fats are often in association with cholesterol, another form of alcohol. We create this in our bodies for our own needs, but we cannot handle foreign cholesterols as true meat-eating animals do. To be sure, cholesterols are found only in animal fats such as cheeses, butter, eggs, meat and animal products such as milk, ice cream, etc. When the cells reject alien cholesterol, it combines with blood contents, especially wastes and inorganic minerals, and forms plaque in the circulatory system.

Free oils and fats are a disaster in the human digestive tract no matter how eaten. Oils on salads, popcorn, bread and other foods (most of them unwholesome in themselves) interfere with digestion as heretofore stated.

When we eat fried foods, we are invariably inviting disaster. Even before eating such foods, the heat of cooking has converted some of the fats or oils to acroleic acid (or it has become acrolein) which is deadly poisonous and carcinogenic in humans. Fats in animal foods are always bad for us. Oils in vegetable and fruit foods should be eaten rarely, say not more than once every two or three days. We handle nuts, seeds and avocadoes fairly well, but our need for them is small. Further, great caution must be employed in eating such foods. Always eat them with vegetables, never with foods that contain a carbohydrate complement. Tomatoes, cucumbers, celery, cabbage family members and green leafy foods such as lettuce combine best with these oil-bearing foods.

It is noteworthy that legumes are heavy in oil but, once beans and pulses are sprouted, their fat content is converted into easily digestible vegetable matter.

There is no truth to the widely circulated belief that oils are good for dry skin. In digesting oils and fats, the body converts them to sugars anyway. Then it reconstitutes them to its specific needs in the body’s own chemical factories. Thus dry skin is the result of impaired function of the sebaceous glands, not a lack of oil in the diet.

Oily foods should not be used as fuel foods. Carbohydrate foods serve us amply in this regard. Loading up on oily foods will not enhance the performance of athletes or manual workers. Their need for the oils and proteins of concentrated foods such as nuts, seeds and legumes are no greater than for sedentary people. It is well to repeat again that carbohydrate foods supply this best, and fruits are our most wholesome and efficient sources of carbohydrates.

Only one meal in any given day should contain a heavy oil-bearing food. And only one concentrated oil-bearing food should be eaten at a meal. Thus, if you eat an avocado with a salad, your oil license for the day has run out. If you eat two to four ounces of nuts or seeds with a salad, your oil license has expired, not only for the meal, but for the day.

Studies have shown that peanut oil is more “atherogenic” than even cream from cow’s milk in inducing arteriosclerosis in monkeys. It has been suggested that free oils actually promote the deposition of cholesterol and other lipids in the arterial walls.

Proceed with caution with oils. Never eat them outside of their natural context and then eat them in restriction as above noted.

life vs lifelessness

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: SueZ ()
Date: February 28, 2014 02:10PM

"Professional Hygienists point out that the body’s needs for oil are very small. All condemn free oils, that is, oils out of context with the food in which nature developed them."


"Professional Hygienists". Lol.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 28, 2014 04:41PM

T.C. Fry died of heart failure when he was 70.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Diogenez ()
Date: February 28, 2014 09:32PM

ad hom. look at the cause , cookery and a past life of enervation.

eat your food whole or risks the consequences. mal absorbtion, weight gain as the toxins fromt toxic plants.spices herbs get stores to protect your body or emaciated liek landis and cousens unable to uptake

life vs lifelessness

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 28, 2014 09:38PM

Diogenez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ad hom. look at the cause , cookery and a past
> life of enervation.
>
> eat your food whole or risks the consequences.
> mal absorbtion, weight gain as the toxins fromt
> toxic plants.spices herbs get stores to protect
> your body or emaciated liek landis and cousens
> unable to uptake


It's not an ad hominem argument, it's fact. I wouldn't be too interested in taking advice from someone who's an "expert" in health when they died of heart failure at a young age (70 is quite young) and many SAD eaters live much longer without disease.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 28, 2014 10:26PM

THeSt0rm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was looking into raw cacao butter.. it's
> interesting that it may actually be beneficial the
> same way people love coconut butter and palm oil,
> or olive oil. It doesn't go rancid. Is it
> underrated?


I've been starting to question this as well, many people in the raw food community demonize raw chocolate but it's a fantastic source of minerals and antioxidants. There's supposedly a "neurotoxin" in it, theobromine, which is similar to caffeine, but for all I know it could be in such miniscule amounts that it'd be comparable to avoiding sprouted nuts and seeds because there may be a tiny amount of phytic acid remaining. I've also heard from David Wolfe that you can combine it with certain foods like mucuna and it will negate the stimulatory effects.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Diogenez ()
Date: February 28, 2014 10:32PM

: jtprindl when you leave cognitive dissonance , i remain more than willing to connect

you seem new yes?

life vs lifelessness

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: February 28, 2014 10:34PM

Diogenez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> : jtprindl when you leave cognitive dissonance ,
> i remain more than willing to connect
>
> you seem new yes?


I don't have any cognitive dissonance, but nice, mature, evidenced-backed response. If you think sprouts are unhealthy, it's not even worth discussing diet-related things with you.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2014 10:35PM by jtprindl.

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: Diogenez ()
Date: March 02, 2014 03:54AM

worhtless waste of space . toxins as said. attain some real callories if you can from mature. it's like being a plant pendophile.. if that's your thing. w/e but its not optimum

life vs lifelessness

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: SueZ ()
Date: March 02, 2014 07:58PM

Diogenez Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> worhtless waste of space . toxins as said.
> attain some real callories if you can from mature.
> it's like being a plant pendophile.. if that's
> your thing. w/e but its not optimum


Another incoherent babble post which may have been sent by a lunatic fringer from a faraway galaxy. Well, let's hope it's far away and that the entity forgot it's towel and is on it's way back for it...

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Re: rancidity of oils
Posted by: jtprindl ()
Date: March 02, 2014 08:28PM

Diogenez is so far off-base that it's not even worth it.

"Never argue with a fool, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience"

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