please ignore the moronic comments of the ignorant masses...
i happened upon this as a link somewhere and it made me very happy.
i nursed little for 3.5 years and littlest can nurse for as long as she likes. i probably won't make it as long as this mum, she's a generous soul.

[www.snarkygossip.com]

I agree... I don't see anything wrong with it. It's not socially acceptable, of course. But babies are SUPPOSED to nurse for at least two years, preferably longer. Women have learned to wean them off early to make it more convenient for their lunch dates.

Besides, isn't breastfeeding a natural contraceptive?

I'm not sure if it is a natural contraceptive or not, but I know that breastmilk has lots of benefits for providing immunity to an array of conditions/disorders.

i do not think it is a contraceptive. my mother got pregnant with my little brother when she was still breast feeding me.

Yea I actually remember learning in one of my classes that a woman is extremely fertile right after she has a child (breastfeeding or not)

I nursed for 3.5 years too.

ha ha, it's not a contraceptive at all!
it can delay the onset (or resumption i suppose) of menstruation after birth but that's it.
it's amazing to me that humans can build themselves efficiently out of just boob, it's so crazy. this girl gained 4lbs and a whole lotta pudge in just 4 weeks.
the world average is 5 years but some babies get cut off after only a few weeks if that! it's so sad. all the things parents do to make sure their kids have every advantage in life and so many of them drop the ball right at the beginning. silly people. cow boobies are for baby cows and people boobies are for babies, Not MTV! ha!

Coco, that's interesting you mention MTV......they say there's a strong correlation between the amount of breastfeeding a baby had and their fixtation on breasts later in life.

The generation watching MTV were largely raised with moms going to work when their babies were a few weeks or months old. and spent enormous amounts of time in daycare. I'm not surprised to see the fixation on breasts and it seems to be growing.

What I understood about breastfeeding being a contraceptive is this:

It's supposed to work as long as the baby is nursing exclusively, not eating any other food.


I know my midwives used this method and it worked for them.

skinnyhippie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... Women have learned to
> wean them off early to make it more convenient for
> their lunch dates.

Wow, what an uninformed, unkind assessment. The truth is there are many, many reasons why women stop breastfeeding too early, and selfishness is only one of them. Forget about societal pressure, which is an umbrella covering many topics from pressure to be sexually attractive/available to the West's squeamishness about breasts being used for their intended purpose, and consider this: a huge percentage of new moms in 'progressive' countries like the US get no post-partum care. They have no-one to help them through the process of breastfeeding. They are tremendously anxious that because it's so difficult they're doing it wrong, and they quit because they're terrified their babies aren't getting enough nutrition. Think about that the next time you try to pigeonhole all bottle-feeders as Connecticut Yuppies.

I think maybe skinnyhippie was doing one of those off-the-cuff summations which make posting much easier, more like a live conversation than an essay. And 'lunch dates' encompasses more than just selfishness, it implies social acceptablity.


I didn't read it as an absolute, more as hyperbole.


I'm confess to having similar judgements about breastfeeding. The values of the parents are reflected in their attitudes toward b.f. I do believe that the average person is shallow and not particularly intelligent - maybe there's a yearning to raise their awarenesses higher, but society doesn't provide the blueprint, it's an individual path.

When I judge people for not b.f. I'm judging the mindset and ignorance of society, (manifested in that person), but I do not feel that person is a hopeless Connecticut yuppie - just manifesting the behaviour. (I hate smoking and smoke, but I don't hate the smoker)

see that? she shares my name and my mindset. right on girl. way to keep the peace sister...

The bottom line is that generalisations hurt, no matter what they are or the reason for making them. Whether we're saying that women are irrational, men are pigs or non-breasfeeders are selfish.

We need to take responsibility for the way we characterise people we don't know, especially in a medium that lasts forever. When we label a young mother who works at Burger King, who has no health insurance, who was bottle fed by her own mother and who has other kids to take care of that she's selfish for giving up on breasfeeding, we're hurting women, we're hurting mothers, we're hurting ourselves.

We can advocate for better behaviour and better outcomes while being gentle, loving and empathetic; we don't have to make off-the-cuff generalisations that say more about us than the people we're discussing.

The word selfish was first brought up by you, I think, and I think you read a lot into the offhand comment skinnyhippie made.

Maybe this is a sore spot for you.......who doesn't have those?


People need to make generalizations, it's part of processing ideas......though I understand what you're saying and it's well-said.

aquadecoco Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The word selfish was first brought up by you, I
> think, and I think you read a lot into the offhand
> comment skinnyhippie made.

Point taken. It was an editorial choice, and I'd go back and change it for accuracy (to just quote skinnyhippie's words), but for some reason I can't... I thought we could edit our posts but I guess I was wrong. ;-)

>
> Maybe this is a sore spot for you.......who
> doesn't have those?
>
Yes, I definitely have a sore spot for generalisations, particularly those that gloss over the vast underclass of less priviledged folk in the West.

>
> People need to make generalizations, it's part of
> processing ideas......though I understand what
> you're saying and it's well-said.
Thank you! I disagree with your comment about generalisations, though. IMO critical thinking, thoughtfulness and carefully chosen words are always superior thereto.

Edited to add: Which is itself a generalisation, tee hee! But I COULD edit this post, I guess you just can't edit them after they've been replied to! But I still think educating oneself and choosing words with care are extremely important, otherwise where's the room for love?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/04/2007 08:20PM by Seabucktho.

Yeah, I like your ideas very much Seabucktho!


And we can always try to help people who haven't had exposure to healthier ideas by example or offering our labour or just by being patient.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/04/2007 08:28PM by aquadecoco.

i see this thread has turned into the milk of human kindness *groan*,
but seriously folks...

or not

you can only edit for a certain period of time. that's because someone, who shall remain nameless, went back and deleted every post they ever made as a way of saying goodbye to the forum. it messed up the topics, the archives, and the people who liked that poster. so, just like real life you can't take it back.

nice resolution here. time to nurse the baby.

Hey girl, I see you've popped up here, where will I find you next, hehe. But here is my question about it, I most definately will breast feed if I ever have children, but what about boobs? From what I remember, yours were fantastic after 3.5 years of feeding. How is that possible? Is it just our wrong thinking and SAD eating that gave rise to the saggy bobbies? What's the deal woman, enlighten me.

amazing

i think if my child ever needed breastmilk
or my husband
or anyone
i would probably offer it

as for contraception- my kid was solely breastfeeding for 8 months (he had 8 teeth then and was crazy to try food, so i broke down) and i started ovulating at four months, and again at six. six was the real thing. it depends on the woman. some women's bodies want to get preggers, and they do it! my friend had the same thing, she started at 3 months, was a single mother co-sleeping and breastfeeding only. it works until you start your period, or six months, if you don't start by then. i have another friend who just ovulated for the first time in three years.... i'm jealous.

breastmilk for all
and all for breastmilk

peace-

i didn't bleed again until little was 1.5 y/o but it took less than 10 weeks this time and i am certainly exclusively breast feeding her!
it isn't a Reliable form of b/c at all. no matter since i am celibate, ha!

Hello,
I nursed my little boy until he was two years old. In the time that he was breast-fed, he never developed any illness whatsoever. That was amazing because the two older children that I have would come home from school with all kinds of illnesses and get in his face. Nursing an older child is really a labor of love because it is inconvenient and uncomfortable most of the time for the mom. The older child is 'drinking' not nursing anymore and takes frequent sips and breaks. My little guy is still very healthy and extremely bright in school. He is also not overweight and doesn't have any kind of attention problems either. I know that there are reasons some people can't nurse at all or for a very long duration. I just don't think that people who do should be thought of as doing anything wrong.
Love, Melissa

My children are also way up in the intellectually 'gifted' range. I never thought about relating that to breastfeeding, but hmmmm....was probably a factor.

my daughter nursed until she was 3.5 ...

awesome! so great to read such tremendous nursing stories. very nice.

My older one nursed till almost three but he was still a very sensitive guy healthwise. I'm still sure it would have been worse if I formula fed him.
He's 8 now, so in the range of the child of that clip...trying real hard but can't imagine him breastfeeding
My younger one turns 2 in a month and he loves food, loves eating and stopped being interested in the boob recently. If he wants to nurse, it's usually after waking up but he already "forgot" his latching technique that it's not comfy and he stops after a few seconds and crawls off in search of some other excitement.

I nursed my last daughter for 3 years!
It was wonderful for both of us!

did all you mommies stay on mostly living & raw during pregnancy and nursing? or did you eat less living & raw? i think breastfeeding for as long as you and your baby can do it is so important. my hubby and children loved it. especially if their bodies are starting to get ill.

take 2 of these and call me in the morning!!

I had the same sort of pattern with both pregnancies: started out striving for 100% raw to really minimize the ickiness that I felt. I never vomited etc. but faitgue and brain fog were killing me. Then, after that phase was done with I felt better and drifted off to cooked...after a while, I got backaches and other minor ailments and that had me jump back on the wagon. After my children were delivered, somehow the relationship with the food I eat and milk produced becomes very obvious and that was motivation enough.

Thanks Seabucktho. Generalizations DO hurt. I was only able to nurse for about 6-8 weeks and it sucks (no pun intended) to hear moms "diss" the moms that don't nurse. I think the best thing to do is provide as much information, advice, tips, education, and most importantly, SUPPORT and let mothers make that personal decision. We tend to have a nuturing instinct, so we will most always make a decision that is in the best interest for our child, so the more info that's out there, the better decisions new moms can make.

In fact, I was very proud of myself for making as long as I did. It was very hard on both of us and I valued every drop of breast milk he got! We tried and he at least got something! Then, when it was time for foods, I ended up making all of his own food from organic fruits, veggies, and whole grains. He was one healthy baby!

In reflection, I can attribute the difficulty in nursing on my health. I wasn't raw then and my diet was HORRID! I had no energy and I was feeding my body crap. Add a first newborn to that and you have a recipe for disaster! I'm so glad I found the raw diet and this board. Making way for transition...

the ideal is to do the best you can, which you did, so congrats to you! it's hard to imagine not being able to nurse my babies, you have all my sympathy.

right now there is a HUGE debate on facebook because the admin booted a mama for her breastfeeding pics (nothing much showing either if you ask me) and are deleting all other breastfeeding pics as "obscene". the whole social, moral attitude around breastfeeding is ludicrous. i mean, hello, they AREN'T for selling cars, beer and lotto tickets.