Hi all, another new member to the forum as well as the eating raw lifestyle (*not* diet!). Had a question about some of the staples that I'm putting in each smoothie that I make. I did do a search beforehand on both "flaxseed oil" and "flax seeds" and nothing of relevance pulled up (this kind of surprised me).

I've read over the years that flaxseed oil is a good thing. If that's not the case I'll rely on the collective wisdom of this community to set me straight. Assuming that it is a positive ingredient to add, what is the best form to use: Flaxseed oil or Flax Seeds? I do know that if using the seeds they must be ground up first and I've been doing that. Have just wondered if the oil which is pricey, is a waste of hard earned money.

Per my studying The Blind Guru's web page, I've also been adding bee pollen to all smoothies. Hope that's recommended as well.

As a person perusing this site for a number of weeks, I'd just like to say how refreshing it is to see how friendly and knowledgeable people are here. It's wonderful to have such stellar support.

Thanks in advance for any direction you have,

David

You don't give your reasons for adding these foods to your diet but I would say that neither of them are particularly healthful. Oils of any kind are very taxing on the liver especially. They are highly processed foods, totally fractionated from their original form in the food they came from, and our bodies never had the chance throughout our long biological history to adapt the ability to use them. And anything our bodies can't use, they don't need.

You note correctly that flax seeds need to be "pre-chewed" otherwise they will not be broken down at all. The problem is, when you pre-chew something, you immediately increase its surface area exponentially and therefore decomposition happens very quickly. This is more of an issue with some foods than others, and certainly seeds aren't at the top of that list but it makes no sense to me to eat a food that needs to be processed when you can replace it with other nuts and seeds that are big enough to chew. Bypassing chewing also creates a problem for the stomach as digestion commences with chewing. It starts the flow of salivary digestive enzymes and warns the stomach to begin the process of breaking down the food. Without chewing, the food suddenly arrives in the stomach without warning. Mechanical devices really do not do a better job of chewing foods than our own bodies.

A bigger issue for me is that flax seeds have no appeal on their own as a food. I can't imagine picking some up off the ground (or wherever they would be found in nature) and eating them if I had other foods to choose from.

Of course these are rather fine points if you're just starting to eat raw. Staying raw is a difficult thing to do and the best way to transition (imo) is to just keep making steady improvements over what you used to eat. That way, you'll eventually get to a very good diet and it won't be too 'painful' along the way.

Best wishes,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

flax seeds have excellent insoluble and soluble fiber, if you grind them fresh,they don't spoil for a few days in the fridge. the oil has all the omegas. if you get too heady about where you would find food in nature, the options start slimming down too much. what about spirulina?if we were in the wild would we be scraping the side of a lake? no. but they still have amazing nutritional benefits.

Hello!

Flax seeds are very good for you. Just make sure to grinde them first.

rawnora has a point about oils too! They are still in reality not a whole food.

Love and light to all!

love

One doesn't need insoluble fiber in their diet, For people with challenged digestive systems, insoluble fiber can be a problem. The fiber we want is soluble fiber, which is found in abundance in fresh fruits and vegetables.

Interesting choice of words, greengrl, because using the head is actually what I advocate getting away from. Using our intellects over our senses to select foods is an exclusively human habit, which we practice to our detriment. All the other animals on earth select foods on the basis of what pleases them with NO other criteria, and they do just fine, thank you. The fact that we grow our foods rather than eating the ones that grow voluntarily in nature does not mean we can't trust our senses.

Spirulina is not a human food, dried or undried, and has nothing in it that isn't best acquired by eating truly healthful foods. The fact that people consume their spirulina by putting it in smoothies to fool the tastebuds or cramming it into little gelatin capsules to circumvent the tastebuds altogether is testament to the fact that it is not human food. Real foods don't have to be disguised, flavored or swished past the taste buds with a mouthful of water.

These comments are provided for informational purposes only. I'm not saying that anybody should give up eating flax or spirulina. People need to eat the foods that they like and that will keep them on track, and if these foods do that, there is justification for keeping them in the diet. But when someone wants to know if a food ultimately is healthy, s/he should be given the benefit of the truth so an informed decision can be made about whether to continue consuming it.

All the best,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

If you are eating enough raw f+v you don't need to supplement with flax because f+v tend to be higher in omega3 than omega6. But not always. It depends on the particular f+v. If you want to be sure you are getting enough you can use one of the nutrient calculators online.

hey nora, my little guy loved to eat spirulina. he would also munch up nori and chew primal defense. he won't now that he has a more sophisticated palette, well maybe he still would if i'd given it to him consistently all this time. anyhoo, just thought you'd like to know. personally i think our palettes are perverted from a lifetime of sugary, salty, fatty foods and we can't trust our mouths to tell us what's good sometimes. not that i advocate eating algae, i just thought this experience might refute some of your arguement (the disguising taste thing) for the purpose of refining it.

I think spirulina tastes wonderful undisguised dipped with a banana. Goooooooooo spirulina!!

thanks for the fiber facts bryan, i didn't know that.I was going on what victoria Botenko said in her green for life book.

"Insoluble fiber is found primarily in greens, peels, nuts, seeds, beans and skins of grains. Insoluble fiber under a microscope looks like a sponge, and indeed it serves us as a miraculous sponge, because every piece of it can absorb many times more toxins than its own volume. Have you ever wondered why we always like to have a sponge in our kitchen? Sponges are fibrous, they make the job of cleaning easier by absorbing dirt. So does insoluble fiber. It grabs the toxins and takes them out of the body and into the toilet. Insoluble fiber can hold several times more toxins than its own size. I call it a magic sponge.
Picture yourself being challenged to clean some large, dirty space like a garage, with nothing but plastic wrap. I would give up. The human body won’t give up, but if there is no fiber, the first thing that happens is our skin tries to take on the elimination “job” and as a result the skin becomes rough and bumpy. When our bowels are clogged, our body attempts to excrete more mucus, through our eyes, nose and throat. We also sweat a lot more—the body uses every possible channel to eliminate, but it’s like pushing the garbage out through the screen window instead of the door. By consuming enough insoluble fiber we unlock the door to eliminate toxins from the body the easy and normal way." any take on this one brian?

Hi Bryan You say we don't need insoluble fibre, I'm new to eating raw gradually building up on it, but I find I am so loose all the time & finding I have less urge to go in morning, i've been told going this way all the time is not cleaning the bowel properly, plus i've had flare ups of I.B.S last month too. I wish I knew what I was doing wrong, I so much want to persue eating raw. Plus hubby & I are thinking of planing to have children in near future & I really want to get my diet sorted before hand. I wold appericate any advice any one might have! X

Diamond dave I do acually have linseed oil & ground flax on my breakfast in morning, it does have good nurishional benifits, just reading what nora wrote I think I might be personally having too much a day, as I have been having alot of spots lately & skins been little greaser than usual, so maybe it could be putting too much onto my liver. So having said that it is probably wise to watch how much you consume of it. Los of dandilion tea for me today I think. Thanks all

hey bracken, i had ibs too before i went raw. i don't have it anymore and all i really did was eat 100% raw for two month with lots of sprouts and wheatgrass, mastercleanse fast, and last a colonic. the doctor said it was "incurable", ha!
good luck to you!
gabriel cousins has great advice in concsious eating about pregnancy, pre and post as well. he was the only raw resource i could find during my first pregnancy but there are more out there now. jinji and storm have good stuff on their site.
good luck and happy baby making!! ;D

coco,
You don't say how old your child is/was but a baby can develop a taste or an addiction for foods or harmful substances that the mother ate while pregnant. If you had those 'foods' around after your child was born, you were most likely consuming them too, and your baby learned from watching you. If your child was old enough to have eaten regular cooked foods before you introduced the spirulina, etc., this will have caused him/her to select foods that an exclusively breast-fed baby born of a raw mother would not. Additionally, it should be noted that babies put everything in their mouths as a way of gathering information but it doesn't necessarily mean they think it's food. In any event, none of this invalidates what I said about spirulina. People do typically mix it with smoothies and stuff it in capsules to get it past their tastebuds. I've never heard of anyone eating spirulina by itself.

That our tastebuds are perverted by decades of wrong eating does not provide a good reason to ignore the senses in food selection. Once we’ve limited our food choices exclusively to that which nature provides in the form of fruit, vegetables, nuts and seeds, we really and truly CAN trust our tastebuds to choose foods for us. Initially when dietary improvement is undertaken, we will prefer foods that remind us of the cooked foods we used to eat. This is a natural consequence of addiction and is why new raw fooders are so crazy about things like nama shoyu, cacao, fermented nut cheeses and the like. That’s entirely okay because these raw foods are still an enormous improvement over the cooked versions, almost without exception. As dietary improvement continues, tastebuds will heal from the irritating and numbing effects of salt, spices and hot foods and the internal organs will be healing from the absence of those substances too. Tastebuds become more sensitive to the full range of flavors in foods. People who continue to improve and simplify their diets often find that their tastes and preferences can change radically as healing proceeds. I can name many foods that I disliked as a cooked food eater that are my favorites now. The point of all this is to say that regardless of what phase of transition a person is in, the senses CAN be trusted.

greengrl,
Dipping a banana in spirulina makes my point that the former is food but the latter is not. A very important criterion for choosing foods is whether you can eat the food all by itself.

In addition, the information about insoluble fiber being a "sponge" for the body comes from the idea that we need to find artificial ways to remove the waste from our bodies rather than stop producing it in the first place. It's a permutation of the curing mentality that rejects removal of cause in favor of the false notion that certain substances "heal" the body. People eating foods that are appropriate for their biological adaptations and following other healthful lifestyle habits do not accumulate waste in their bodies. Foods like fruit and tender greens produce so little waste in the body that the primary organs of elimination can easily handle getting rid of it. No sponges needed. Many of the sources of insoluble fiber are not even human food, like beans and grains.

bracken,
Many sufferers of gastrointestinal diseases get too focused on their bowel movements. Yours are the completely normal (for you) combined result of what you're eating and the condition of your intestinal tract at this time. Eating proper foods will allow your system to heal but it may happen slowly. If food is always coming in, it's like having a sore near a waistband or someplace where it is always being irritated. That's why fasting heals digestive disorders the quickest. The next quickest way is to eat foods that are very easily digested, like fruits of all kinds and the tenderest, sweetest-tasting greens you can find. Eating foods like flax will only complicate the healing process.

If you’re interested in further guidance, I offer coaching to transitioning raw fooders.

Best wishes,
Nora

i do eat spirulina by its self and I think it's delicious.i was using an example with the banana, I love the emerald green goodness. But its not for everyone, I guess. the subject of the quote that I used was from "green for life" a book about eating an abundance of kale,spinach, lettuce and other greens. a perfectly natural food that contains a lot of insoluble fiber.

sometimes peoples "help" feels more like "hurt". oh well, different strokes for different folks.

i agree coco

greengrl,
My message is always to eat what you like. If you like eating spirulina by itself, and it keeps you from eating worse things (like cooked food), you are entirely justified in eating it. However, I daresay it takes a truly perverted palate to appreciate a "food" like dried spirulina by itself. The good news is that if you strive to make improvements in your diet, your body and senses will heal and ultimately you'll lose your taste for such things. Most long term raw fooders ate inappropriate stuff in their early days. I certainly did.

Additionally, much of what Victoria Boutenko espouses is not scientific, although it is cloaked to appear so. The book you reference is full of clues to the real mistakes she and her family are/were making regarding their diet. Unfortunately Victoria never lost her belief in the cure mentality and is still looking for magical substances (to her credit at least she's looking for them in real foods) rather than removing the cause of her health problems.

Best wishes,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

"Using our intellects over our senses to select foods is an exclusively human habit, which we practice to our detriment. All the other animals on earth select foods on the basis of what pleases them with NO other criteria, and they do just fine, thank you."

Doughnuts here I come

pass the chocolate.

bracken,

The looseness might have to do with your body getting used to the high fibers found in fruits and vegetables. Or it could be the fats that you are eating. Try going a few weeks without any overt fats - the oils, avocados, nuts, seeds, and see how your skin does and how your liver feels. This will also help your digestion.

Eat plenty of fresh fruits and greens instead of the fats. This should maximize your nutrient intake by eating all these high nutrient density foods.

greengrl,

Insoluble fiber is the kind of fiber found in hard stuff that doesn't digest: the shells & hard skins of nuts and seeds and grains, things like dry hard husks. These hard and dry fiber can become sharp and they can scratch and irritate the intestines. Insoluble (which mean it can't be dissolved) fiber is completely unecessary if you have soluble (which means it dissolves in water) fiber, which is soft and wet and does an excellent job of cleaning out your digestive system.

What do you think would do better to gently clean out your digestive system: the shells of a walnut or a head of romaine lettuce? A macadamia shell or a soft and juicy peach? I don't care if under a microscope these shells have a look like sponges. In my hands, they feel sharp and hard and I am pretty certain that they aren't going to feel good moving though my digestive system. By the way, dead dried coral looks like sponge to the naked eye. Do you want to put that through your digestive system?

CookedHam and coco -- sounds like you missed this part:

"Once we’ve limited our food choices exclusively to that which nature provides in the form of fruit, vegetables, nuts and seeds, we really and truly CAN trust our tastebuds to choose foods for us."



Nora
www.RawSchool.com

just to let ya'll know I just want to know the truth about this stuff,I'm not trying to argue or anything. So brian, from what I've heard a head of romaine lettuce along with other greens has a lot of insoluble fiber. Is that not true? and also i cut and paste that paragraph from another website,its not my opinion. I just wanna figure it all out.

Goodness, such great responses from everyone! As I mentioned on another thread, I'm still learning and will continue to do so the more I study this lifestyle.

I really appreciate the time everyone has taken to provide their thoughts.

Regards,

David

coco, don't feel bad for what you sayd. I have a grand baby and he eats some of my wierd stuff. I made a green soup with some dulse in it and I found I dont like dulse but he ate it like candy. He really seems to know what is good for him. He enjoys the green juices I make and I sometimes give him a little taste of wheat grass. He gets the giggles with that. Just a few drops though. Right now he seems to enjoy the healthy foods but I think as he eats more junk foods he will gravitate towards that. We will see though, He loves grandmas green food. ages ago the eskimos ate the contents of the moose stomach to get their greens. Personally I would have to aquire a taste for that predigested form of food but for them it was their only source of green food. I still have a hard time drinking my wheat grass because of the taste but I know it is good for me. Because a food is not tastey does not mean it is bad. I really don't follow what rawnora is trying to claim.

This thread seems to be a good place to post my thoughts on something that has been on my mind for a while.

One person eats cheeseburgers and someone says, "TOXIC! BAD!" and another eats flax seeds or spirulina and there is always going to be someone who says, "TOXIC! BAD!"

A friend of mine, one of the kindest people I know, eats all processed foods and meats and diet sodas. This friends is incredibly supportive of my finding my way in the raw food lifestyle, my ups and downs and mistakes and missteps and exploration... because I feel much better this way. Totally supportive.

Here, one person eats lots of something raw and vegan and will tell others how that way is the One True Way. Well, for them maybe.

I've read about people who thrive on all or primarily fruit. I've read about people who thrive on all or primarily greens. I've read about people who seem to need to supplement with maca and spirulina and other things.

Whatever works for YOU, you go ahead and eat. What works for YOU might change over time. I know it has for me. Only you can tell the difference between an unhealthy craving for something and your body saying it needs it. If you need something I don't need, go ahead and eat it. And don't be deterred by the legions of well meaning people who will criticize your eating habits. If you are here, I think you are on the right path...

Listen to your own body. Check out the nutrition calculators online but they are not the "be all" and "end all" to everything.

I've had people tell me that my nutritional needs are wrong in spite of how I feel and blood tests confirming how I feel has scientific basis. (Due to liver and gall bladder damage, my body does not process protein as easily as most people. There are people who will tell you to ignore everything science has to say about protein. That doesn't work for ME. For them maybe. But at one time, I was getting essentially NO protein due to my unique body's situation.)

Take in all the information. Some of it has no basis in scientific fact and some of it will contradict what your body tells you. Take it all in then do what is right for you. If that means your vegan/raw selections are completely different than mine, I am ok with that as long as you are doing what is right for you.

Lee

What you have you have just made lee makes total sence to me today, I have been trying to follow the sound advice on here, I am trying so hard i'm starting to beat my self up about it, as I was meant to try & cut down on my fats, just missing out today I felt my blood sugar out of balance & started to feel like crap, so I had a little carob, & a litle Kombucha when I got home, been crying all day. I want so much to be like everyone else here eating raw & healthy & happy. I'm not giving up I just need to find the right balance for me.

Take it easy
Ju

It took me a long time to figure out that there are a lot of very healthy people in the raw/vegan community who eat very differently from each other. If I eat like the healthiest person I know, I'm not necessarily going to be as healthy as that person. I need to eat what is best for me. And, as I said before, that may change over time.

There are a lot of people who will tell you, with almost religious fervor, what to eat. Many of these people have very good intentions and just want for you to feel as good as they do. I wish I could so easily follow what they say because that would really be easier than figuring out what is right for me.

If I follow someone else's path, (no matter how healthy and together that person is), I'm not following my own path. Each of us has a unique body and a unique physical and emotional and spiritual history.

It isn't like you decide to be raw/vegan and you get a map. There is no map. We are really on the cutting edge nutritionally. Heck, when I was a kid, we thought Kool-Aid and Twinkies were perfectly acceptable food. Now, there are countless peer-reviewed scientific studies showing that less processed food = less diseases of various kinds. But there are still educated, intelligent people who think Kool-Aid and Twinkies are just fine. (I know some of those people.)

It is difficult sometimes but it is worth it. I feel better than ever and know I am on the right path. Should I eat more or less fruits or more or less vegetables or hemp seeds or whatever? I try to do my best and not beat myself up. Surely, a little too many grapes or greens or whatever raw food I am eating is a lot better than what I used to do and what most people are doing. I'm doing the best I can, taking in a fair amount of information, listening, learning, discerning.

Thanks for reading and sharing.

Lee

lee, there are people who eat that "certain healthy diet" only, the one that doesn't agree with you, who will come up with all kinds of justification about why it should and will if you only do what they say and ignore your own instincts and feelings about it because they, apparently, know better than anyone else. it's tiring to hear it again and again from the same people (not singling anyone out here). it's like my religious aunt who thinks we are all going to hell because we don't do it EXACTLY her way, even though we are spiritually minded people. tragically closed minded.

different strokes for different folks. vive la difference!