thanks for bryan and F1 and Nora for their insights
that caused me to think about some things.

A. many people seem to be tracking calories and often fighting Against
their hunger cues, which seems wrong to me.

B. although eating only whole foods has helped quite a bit,
it still seemed as though i was overeating.

i'm sure many of you are cruising and doing great, and i am too,
but i think i was still overeating, not based on calories, but on
attending to real appetite.

i did an experiment for a week.

i'll report my results and then pose some questions - feel free to add
comments or thoughts if you have any.

what i did was to really pay attention and only eat when truly hungry.
i'm not going to call it true hunger because at this point i could probably
go days comfortably until true hunger, but nevertheless ...

my results were the following:

i ate only fresh raw whole fruit and a very small amount of greens.
turned out to be less greens than i would otherwise eat.
energy levels good. moderate activity level.

daily caloric intake
520,924,980,780,720,1560,1345

average 975
according to most calcs i should require about double the above.


i could have easily eaten even less and been fine appetite-wise...
i lost a bit of weight.

i know a longer experiment would be better, and i will continue, so this is preliminary

1. who eats only when truly hungry (true physiological hunger or not)
2. is calorie theory invalid (or just for raw fooders)
3. do you eat under, over or at the recommended calories for you
4. who uses hunger exclusively
5. can hunger be trusted when advanced raw and eating clean
6. are deficiencies possible or more likely when "undereating"
7. i have read that certain deficiencies can cause appetite loss. is this a concern.

what do you consider moderate activity level ?.. like are you at a desk job and dont exercise more then 1 or 2 times a week? whats moderate for a week for you ?

...Jodi, the banana eating buddhist

jgunn,

regardless of activity level, my calories ingested are still way below the recommended. moderate for that week was exercise every day, swimming, running, weight lifting, biking, etc, but nothing for a long period of time.

by the way, part of this is that I did not take seriously how damaging overeating of any kind raw or cooked can be (until nora brought it up), and i think it may be overlooked by many people. many seem to think that the body comfortably ejects excess. I think it highly likely that any overeating will create waste throughout the body that causes many problems, in addition to Eating itself being a stimulating activity that feeds on itself.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2007 06:19PM by fresh.

Great post.

I would think it depends on how "clean" you are and how efficient your digestive tract is. I find it really hard to eat to 2000 cals a day but usually get at least 1200 - 1500 cals. I'm at 103 lbs now and 5'7" tall.

I usually try to let myself experience some hunger once a day but mostly eat when I feel like it and stop when I'm full.

I've been transitioning for about a year and am nervous about cutting back a little on calories yet because of my weight. Would love to hear that it wouldn't make a difference at some point in transitioning but I doubt it. I'm fairly certain that stress is a factor in my low weight. Eating only when real hungry would be challenging for me.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2007 06:33PM by Dulset.

I too have concerns with calori intake. I find it very hard to eat a lot of calories a day. There are days I dont want to eat so much food and then there are days I just want to eat a lot of food. I did start counting some calories just to figure out what I am eating. I barely eat 1200 cals a day. I think I am going to keep a closer eye on the amount of foods I am eating. I still have a lot of weight to lose. I have been loseing an average of 2 pounds a week but this last week I lost about 5 pounds. I try to eat only when I am hungry and I try not to eat after it gets dark. I feel best if I have not eaten before going to sleap. I usually eat only when I feel a hunger or desire to eat and I dont over eat.

I have heard that if we just did one thing with out diet (raw or cooked) and that was to eat only when hungry - we would experience improvements in our health.

I try to eat only when I am hungry, I am usually successful but not always. I haven't counted my calories and am too lazy to do so. ;-)

I am 5'4" and weigh 102 pounds and I don't look overly skinny.

Can you post what you normally eat in one day? I'm curious...Thanks!
Love, Tammy

I usually don't eat until noon or later.

Then I have fruit like a couple of bananas and some peaches, or grapes, or apples...

When I get home from work I might have a handful of nuts, or a raw flaxseed cracker with raw pecan butter on it, or a raw bar.

Then for supper it's a salad (sometimes huge, depends on my hunger), a green smoothie, or a nori wrap with veggies.

If I have a salad at lunch then I might have a fruit smoothie for supper (sometimes huge).

. I'm very impressed and supportive of your study!

. I've had days recently where I've just had a few cantaloupes and some grapes and feel fine. It's only when my mind kicks in that I choose/feel compelled to eat more, often its MUCH more.

. but overall for someone who exercises very intensely with weights/bands, does daily yoga, bikes often 16+ miles at least 6 days a week. I certainly under-eat according to what the fit-websites or whatever would say.

. I'm going to be living on a farm soon for a bit...In a cleaner environment..with less responsibility then I do now, I'll perhaps join you in some experimentation

. just a guess, but I think 'deficiencies' possibly could 'appear' in periods of or "undereating", just from excessive cleansing or over-stress.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/11/2007 03:48AM by anaken.

My two cents, when I was eating 100% raw foods I went through a very busy and stressful time when I just ate when I was hungry, and even though I was eating a lot more than you seem to be I still lost a long of weight really quickly. But, it wasn't the good feeling healthy weight loss loss, I felt weak and tired and sad. Sort of like when you lose weight when you are sick.

I am just thinking that maybe are bodies have lost the ability to really communicate with us through years of abuse, and we need to sometimes look at the situation and say that no, actually this dear body needs some nourishment if it can ask for it or not! One more thing, avoid eating disorders! This sounds a little scary...but you know best. Best wishes!

Real interesting thread !

I think ksm's post above illustrates the importance of mental wellbeing in our health well.
I wonder if considering the quantities or timing of our eating is of as much significance ?
Like maybe our dieting trends will just naturaly fall inline with our peace of mind... or our bodies will utilise the nutrients in accordance with this regardless of the quantities ?

I believe davidzmason advocates this approach. Just a thought.

. sure, theres a differnce between an experiment to figure out what you really require

...and forcing yourself into some kind of routine of deprivation...which would of course result in problems, physical, emotional etc...

seems clear - to me - where this falls.