My boyfriend and I have been raw vegan for about 2 months now, almost three for me, and we are BOTH having a really hard time healing. I got a cut on my knee the other day and it has been getting worse and my whole knee hurts now! He has had cuts on his hands the whole time he has been raw and they have shown so signs of really healing, instead they are getting sore and red. I know that because we have a tight financial situation we aren't getting all of the nutrients we need. We are doing everything we can. We are going to buy some raw green powder to make sure we are getting a good variety of greens and algae..etc.. So I am wondering is it just part of the process of learning about your body... Have any of you had similar experiences? Or should I be worried? I am kind of worried. Its weird. I am hoping one of you can tell me something I have not thought of yet...If its Staph I really don't want to have to take any antibiotics...

Hi, Marika-

Hello - I can understand why you're worried - not that you need to be, any more than I needed to be when I got a dental abscess and took the risk of letting it take its course. It's hard and it's scary, but worth it. Yes, things get funky when you start on raw. I've been raw for over 4 years and i remember getting bizarre scratch-like lines on my back from NO WHERE in the first year. Knee pain, sores, pussy stuff, fevers, headaches, all kinds of things can be the wonder of detox, the benefits of which you will wexperience as time goes by. But it will take time and experience.

About nutrients....we grow many of our own sprouts which are packed with nutrients. Clover, alfalfa, broccoli, mustard, etc. etc. VERY cheap, just get a book from the library or go on line and learn about how to sprout. It will help heal you, truly. Eat as much of alive food diet as you can, lower on fat, probably, and go easy on fruit, and you will strengthen.

But, yes, we look bizarrely sick when we first becgin to heal. Have faith, eat well, and know that there are billions of wise cells in your body that know EXACTLY what to do without your even HAVING to know about it.

Staph...just another infection that your body will fight if you take good care. Research natural anitibotics ( I used garlic) but there are others.

Do take care. Feel the fear but do it anyway. You'll get strong.

Love,

GeneticPromise

Right on! Thanks so much! I have been eating garlic and putting comfrey on wounds, making sure that puss gets out before it heals. Yeah, I can tell my body doesn't want as much fruit, but I am still craving it a lot. I am going to try to keep eating a broad variety of fruit other than just chowing down on bananas, apples, and oranges all the time. And I definitely try to take it easy on fat and only eat the best fats/oils/nuts/seeds. Should look into hemp and flax seeds/oils more. It is really hard for me right now to get all the nutrients I need (as I said before). Do you think Healthforce Nutritionals Vitamineral 3.7 is a wise purchase to get us through the hard times? Sprouts are definitely going to happen in the future once I get a place to grow them. Been on the road for a while.
Love and thanks,
Marika

Marika,

When the body is in a challenged position when it comes to healing, say like in your examples where cuts don't heal, they get infected, etc, the best thing you can do is to provide the conditions of healing and health so that the body give all of its energy to healing.

This means cut out things that drain your energy, and do things that give your body more energy.

So what gives your body the most energy? Simple. Rest and sleep. What drains your body's energy? Almost everything that is a part of our modern industrial lifestyle. This means work, stress, bad relationships, worry, out of control emotions, eating heavy foods or overeating.

In a time of healing challenges, do what you can to eliminate these energy drains. As for eating, ideally you would fast on just water until your symptoms disappear. If this is not practical. eating raw fruits and greens in their whole state without spices and condiments will give you a pretty clean diet, assuming you practice food combining or mono-eating. The other thing that helps is to not eat any fat while you are trying to heal your symptoms.

Some people juice fast, but eating produce without spices and condiments is probably healthier, as fiber helps with the elimination system and manages the absorption of sugar by the body.

Here in Hawaii there's a lot of staph because of the tropical climate, so we have to take skin infections more seriously than on the mainland, regardless of our diets or lifestyle. I've lived here 22 years.

Your injuries may not be infected, and even if they are, the advice you have so far received may indeed be sufficient. But just in case you do have staph or some other serious infection, I felt I had to write. I can't help it. I'm a grandmother (and a long-time vegan and raw-fooder. It's been over 30 years since my first juice fast and introduction to the literature of Arnold Ehret).

So here's some grandmotherly advice:

First of all the most powerful alternative preventative and out-and-out cure for any infection, including staph, is TEA TREE OIL.

It is most effective however if you use it as soon as you get a cut. Don't wait, because once infection sets in, the cut will definitely take longer to heal and be harder to get rid of. You should also realize that there is no diet, fasting, colon cleanse, herbal remedy, etc. or combination thereof that has the total ability to heal everything. If you do have a really serious infection and you are not able to turn it around, you could die from it, or lose a limb.

Warning signs to look for are:

-pain that's so intense it becomes difficult to use the body part where the cut is located.

-swelling that causes extreme pain even some distance from the cut.

-pain emanating from a lymph node. Learn where the lymph nodes are located. If for instance you have a seriously infected cut on your leg or even your toe, you may feel pain inside your leg next to your crotch. An infection on your arm could give you pain inside your armpit.

-a red streak up the back of your leg or your arm.

If you have any of the above symptoms, you are in trouble and should see a doctor for antibiotics. NEXT TIME use the tea tree oil as soon as you get a cut, and you most likely will never need to go to a doctor again for a skin infection. But for now, especially considering that you are new to raw food (your body probably still has a lot of toxins), and you yourself say you have not been getting all the nutrients you would like, please exercise some caution and realize that ALL of us are vulnerable (some more, some less) to the ravages that nature chooses to inflict.

If you've never used tea tree oil before, you will notice that it's pretty oily when you first put it on, but within a few minutes, it will sink right into your skin. It might sting a little, but not too bad. The wild-crafted tea tree oil is the strongest, but the others work well too.

Sometimes even an infected cut will almost immediately drain and shrivel up. It's really quite amazing. In fact, it even kills ukus (lice). I have gotten rid of warts on my leg and precancerous skin lesions on my face by applying tea tree oil only twice a day.

Very rarely, some people are sensitive to it and can't use it. I'm very sensitive to food, but tea tree oil on my skin has never been a problem.

If your cut is staph, the scab should be scrubbed off daily with a good soap and water. Apply the tea tree oil liberally to your cuts several times a day, and hopefully you will heal.

Best wishes, Ally

Hi, Marika -

It sounds like you're getting strengthened by support and I'm happy for you on that. I've got but a minute right now, but want to say keep going for it! Yes, sprouts when you can. I don't know anything about healthforce - the only supplement I take is a bit of b12 for insurance, but I find that when I fast, my b12 level just naturally goes up....the brilliant body.

You'll get there, you're well on your way. Trust.

geneticPromise

i've had success healing staph with golden seal powder packed directly into the well washed sore and covering it with a bandage. i kept it on for 3 days before i changed the bandage and when i uncovered it it was closed over and well on it's way to healing.

peace

Woh, that's a lot of good stuff. Okay, well, my cut is on my knee and it has been pussing all over the place and there is a two inch swell around it and my whole leg has been feeling sore and itching like hell everywhere, but I have been cleaning it REALLY well and using different things on it (comfrey, alcohol, water, eating garlic, and caldendula) and it is looking and feeling better already. I haven't had red streaks but my boyfriend had one all the way up his arm...So the conclusion is I am pretty sure we both have Staph but I am going to try to scrub the cuts, use tea tree, golden seal, and garlic, keep them clean, give it a week, and then we may go to the doctor...maybe. we'll see. I'll be careful though. Do you take active b12? I bet you do...I have been avoiding using supplements. We have been getting b12 from dulse and various other foods. I am not too worried about b12 right now though. I think there is b12 in healthforce. If the symptoms seem to be subsiding are we safe or can it disappear and hurt you from the inside and not show signs?

In my opinion, you should both go to the doctor IMMEDIATELY. In fact just go right on to the nearest emergency room so they can fix you up.

Red streaks are a symptom of acute lymphangitis possibly caused by either staph or strep. It is serious enough that it could develop into septicemia, more commonly known as blood poisoning, and it can be fatal.

To answer another of your questions, a serious infection CAN cause internal damage, and you may or may not be aware of it.

The fact that you both are showing symptoms of infection (whether it be staph or something else) means that the infectious material is probably on your clothing or whatever. Wash as much stuff as you can.

One symptom I forgot to mention is fever. You may or may not have that, but your other symptoms are still serious enough that you should immediately go see a doctor.

There is no shame in that. In my opinion, you should just continue your raw food regimen, and continue to try to get the necessary balance of nutrients. Your raw food diet may have had absolutely nothing to do with your getting the infections. I think one of your posts mentioned that you have been on the road a lot. If that's so, you most likely picked it up somewhere.

Next time remember to put the tea tree oil on as soon as you get a cut. Golden seal powder works very well on cuts too (as purenkind kindly pointed out), but whether you use golden seal or tea tree oil, you must put it on as soon as possible. There does seem to be a point of no return for both remedies.

If you have staph, you should scrub off the scab every day until the cut is no longer swollen.

After you get back from the doctor, soak those cuts in hot water, as hot as you can stand it without burning yourself, for 20 - 30 minutes if you can. Do that every day until you are better.
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For some of the best info on B12, check the official website for the Vegan Society. They're the oldest Vegan group around - established in 1944.

Infection is not a symptom of B12 deficiency.
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Let us know you're OK.

Good luck. We'll be thinking of you. -Ally

PS: I rarely go to doctors myself, but in an emergency, they can save you.

How are you feeling? I hope much better.

I certainly want you to be okay, so doing what you need is good. But I don't like the idea of terrorizing each other into going for traditional medical treatment. The body is masterful at dealing with infection. My dental abscess ( discussed on this board lately) is healing, with support of time, all raw, some warm salty water rinse, massage, exercise. Spiking fevers has helped and has been welcomed. It's so hard to buck the trend of medical intervention. But things heal well naturally given time. I believe that. Things might get worse before getting better. They often do for me with intesne detox things, like wounds and infection.

I had a wicked dog bite several years ago, and my MD offered me to either get antibiotics or scrub it open every day (scrubbed raw - hurt like hell) and let it weep and seep. So I did that for a week, meditated through the pain. She supported my doing it that way because she knew I was committted to health and raw living. And she knew I'd be willing to subject myself to that pain. For my greater good.



I take a simple cynocobalomine b-12 500 mcg each day, and I take a breatk from it one week of every month.

Good luck and health, Marika, and let us know how things are.

GeneticPromise

To Marika,

After reading the opinion of geneticpromise, I think you should do exactly what geneticpromise did for his dog bite. You should go to a doctor and see what the doctor says, and THEN make your decision on how to proceed.

After all, neither geneticpromise nor I have even seen your cuts.

Not all things "heal well naturally over time". Or maybe we are the first generation to practice natural healing, since it seems that over the centuries, everyone has died of something.

Did you say you were in Arcata? It would seem likely that in a place like Arcata, with a relatively large alternative population, there are good doctors who will see you right away. (Maybe even as good as geneticpromise's doctor)

If not a traditional doctor, try a naturopath. (I should have thought of that before). I just called the nurse at the naturopath's office here; she said a naturopath should be able to treat you depending on how far along the infection is. She said there would most likely be a naturopath in Arcata.

The only drawback is naturopaths cost money (emergency room is free if you have no money). Maybe the naturopath there would take payments or give you a financial break.

I may be overly concerned, and after all I haven't even seen your cuts. They may be nothing at all to be concerned about, and you MAY be able to heal yourself. But red streaks up your friend's arm can be VERY serious.

NONE of us on this forum has seen your cuts or knows the current state of your immune system, but some of us seem to believe that EVERYONE can heal themselves of EVERY disease through natural diet.

The ones who believe that may yet be too young and/or inexperienced to have grasped the concept that mortality is every body's fate, no matter how clean. Many people, after having made the amazing discovery of a raw food vegan diet, mistakenly think they have it within their power to be invulnerable or even live forever (which is the same thing, if you think about it). Or they may simply have never have been around a very serious case of infection. A tooth abcess may or may not be serious. Same with a dog bite.

They don't realize that when they are advising you to heal yourself of a possibly serious infection, AND when they are telling you that you'd be better off not going to a doctor (though admitting they themselves went to a doctor with positive results), they are risking YOUR life for the sake of THEIR belief.

There's nothing wrong with idealism. It's best to keep it going your whole life. Never let it go. But as you get older, let nature be your teacher to show you how to temper idealism and faith with reality and compassion. That is what becomes wisdom.

Maybe your case is serious, or maybe it's not. We don't know. This is the internet. We haven't seen your cut. Your best option is to go to the doctor or naturopath of your choice.

Best wishes and aloha -Ally

When long red streaks start running from the wound you are in serious risk of life and limb and need to go to the doctor.

A woman injured while escaping the sinking sailboat Trashman died 2 days after red streaks formed.

Yarrow is extremely good in healing wounds. Keep a few plants in your garden or a pot. Grind up a few leaves in a mortar. Place the fresh living poultice on your wound. It is famous for curing Achilles' ankle. Hence the scientific name, Achillea millefolium. Its showy cultivars are sold in nurseries.

Hi, Marika -

Wanted to check in and see how you are.

By the way, about my visit to the doctor for the dog bite. I went in order to document the incident, not for medical advice, which I got anyway. But I went for the documentation.

I hope things are going well.

Keep the faith.

genetic promise

Hey. We just spent four days on a bus from Arcata to Massachusetts. Hell. Let's see. We are going to go to the doctor because one day into the trip I could barely walk my leg hurt so bad all around the cut and up and down the inside of my leg and my throat is so swollen I can barely talk. Jeremy's wounds seem to be healing and neither of us have had any red streaks since Jeremy had one a month back. My lymph nodes are really swore and I have a lot of pain inside my leg near my crotch. Umm...but all of my symptoms seem to have gotten better EXCEPT for this sore throat now. I am still impressed though with how much better I feel considering I just spent four days on a bus with no sleep, eating borderline healthy food, and sitting next to unhealthy, disease infested Americans. I do not feel ready to fight this off by myself yet and I am going to go to the doctor whenever I can and thanks so much for all of your advice. I will keep you informed with what is going on...yeah my throat is really swollen and sore...this sucks...damn staph.

Thanks so much for the update Marika. Hope you're 100% soon. Good to know you're still with us and your friend is feeling better!

Aloha, Ally

Hey, we decided not to go to the doctor. Jeremy's wounds have almost healed and mine are looking a lot better and my sore throat isn't nearly as sore or swollen... If we are healing are we really getting better or can there be internal damage going on?

Hi, Marika -

Thanks for the update. I'm SO glad you're on the mend and i know how hard it is to trust oneself. As for internal damage...I don't know, of course, but I truly believe that raw, low sugar, low fat, lower stress, living foods, no salt, etc. will help heal ANYTHING. You're obviously strong enough to fight so mighty big problems. Good luck and do keep us informed!

geneticpromise

I agree with geneticpromise. I don't know if there is internal damage, although you may be risking it.

But I think, if I were you, and I made it that far without going to a doctor, I probably wouldn't go at all. Just remember, we're not doctors. Doctors can do all kinds of tests to confirm there's no internal damage going on.

And if it starts getting bad again, you're probably asking for trouble.

Try taking some elderberry extract, it's good for the immune system and tastes kind of good too.

Best wishes, Marika

Love and aloha from Granny Ally

Marika (now I'm worried about you again),

Just wanted to add the thought that one thing you might be able to do is see if there is a doctor who could do some blood tests on you and find out that way if you might be having some internal damage.

I don't know for sure that blood tests would be able to show it, but maybe.

Anyway, if so, I think my own doctor would be willing to do something like that if it were me.

If you don't think you know a doctor like that, maybe try calling around and talk to the nurses at the doctors' offices. See if the nurse says the doctor might be willing to do that. The nurses may even put the doctor on the phone for you. Or the nurse may be able to give you some better advice.

That's a hassle, but might be worth it.

Anyway, good luck.

Love, Ally

Hey, this isn't about my staph which still seems to be getting better but I have a little on my foot now...I am having trouble being raw now. I have been completely raw vegan for a few months now. Now that I am back in Massachusetts I am staying with my dad temporarily and being around cooked food is way too hard. The only things I have eaten are some healthy breads but I feel like I am just going to give up- not give up but I am not too enthusiastic about it anymore. I love reading but the only things I like to read about now are healthy and nutrition and similar topics and if I keep reading the more frustrated I am going to get because I can't have it. It really sucks. I haven't yet (given up) but thats just because the only thing cooked that I have been around is the bread. I feel like @#$%& and I no longer feel as focused and excited as I was. Now I feel like I am just being too extreme about my diet and too dogmatic. That's what my dad has convinced me. I mean I am still really healthy and doing almost the best I can...almost...but I just don't like this depressed feeling and I feel really foggy headed and confused. My clarity is gone. I am afraid all of that clarity wasn't true- it was just based on my focus to be a raw foodist and now I feel like it really isn't all that important to be so PURIST about everything and since it is not my culture I am not going to convince people to change and instead they are going to change me back. My dad's girlfriend also won't invite me and my boyfriend over because she can't accomodate our food needs. Its really hard to be around cooked food. I hate it. Its one thing going into a store. its easy to just not buy it. But to have it in your house is another. I can't have it around and I can't be around people who eat cooked food but I feel like I am being so extreme and dogmatic. Food is so much a part of culture...Do I have to push everyone out of my life to accomplish this goal? Is it really worth it? Hopefully I will be able to do what I need to do when I get in a routine. I feel all alone and completely stupid for even caring about these sorts of things. I feel so Obsessive Compulsive. What can I do to just chill out?

It is important to let go of the control, the obsessiveness and the compulsion. This is easy to say but hard to practice as it requires a high level of consciousness and commitment and patience. Excessive control can lead to excessive backlashes. Its better to go slow and steady. The beginning of any kind of healing requires observation.

Here are some things you can do for now.

Eat a lot of fruit. Bananas are cheap. Eat a lot of salad. These are foods that are probably in most cooked foodists diet. Making the fancy raw gourmet foods might be freaking out your father and his girlfriend.

Don't say anything about your diet. If people offer you food you don't want, just say that you're not hungry. When they are not present, just eat your fruits and salads. Make sure your fruit is ripe. Bananas that have all yellow skins are unripe, they need to have freckles and soft thin skins.

If people ask you about your diet, don't say you are a raw foodist. Just say you like fruits and salads. This is not threatening to them. When people give you cooked foods, say your not hungry rather than talking about your dietary restrictions. If you are hungry, ask for a piece of fruit.

Hi Marika,
Many Raw fooders hit the phase you are in (from what I have read). When I hit that 'I may as well give up stage' an increase in green smoothies and a return to a very simple diet as Brian suggests worked.
Good luck, your father will probably come around in time as long as you show him the same respect for his diet, and he may be curious about your increased health.
Colleagues of mine who used to ridicule me now, ask for recipes, borrow raw literature and drink green smoothies, there is hope for everyone, just give them time to adjust.
You could invite you dads girlfriend for a meal when you rediscover your enthusiasm.
Remember, raw is not a sprint, you may often stop for a breather, but just get back on track when you are ready. One day you will not need a breather!
Best wishes and good luck
Anna

Dear Marika,

I'm sorry to hear you're going through all this. You sound pretty stressed.

Hate to harp on it, but I do still think you should go to a doctor if the infection is still showing up. That could very well be a symptom of blood poisoning. Would you consider just going to a doctor for a consultation? Just because you talk to a doctor doesn't mean you have to take the medicine. You could make that decision after you've talked to him/her.

Sometimes my husband or I will go to our doctor just to hear his opinion. Staph is rampant around here, and we both work outside a lot and get cut up. It's not uncommon for the doctor to check out the cut and say "it's doing fine, keep doing just whatever it is you're doing".

If you do have blood poisoning, that would definitely contribute to your feeling "foggy headed".

About the other stuff, it is very hard to do all raw if you don't have support for that around you. It can be hard even WITH the support, especially if you're kind of new at it.

You're very lucky that your boyfriend is supportive of you. It sounds like you're close to your father. Just keep remembering your father loves you even if he doesn't support your diet. And you don't have to convert him. People never do this kind of thing until they're ready.

I would suggest that you try to stick it out over there at least until your cuts are completely healed. Then try to get independent if you can and have your own house if that's possible. Don't ever let go of your family. They love you and will accept your diet as long as they think you're healthy. That's another reason for getting rid of the infection. People are more willing to accept any diet or lifestyle if the person pursuing it is healthy.

If you find you're not yet ready to go full-on raw food, then try staying vegan, for the good of the planet.

Not including your family, if your old friends have a hard time accepting your diet, you don't have to push them out of your life, but try to find some new friends who are more tolerant. Also, like Anna67 says, people will generally be more tolerant of you and your diet if you show that you are tolerant of them and theirs. And like Bryan says, try not to make raw food a topic of conversation, especially around meat eaters. Many will think you're judging them and be offended.

Sometimes you may just have to give up some of the stuff in the social realm, and that's much easier to do when you have the support of like-minded people.

Wishing you the best, and believe me, a lot of what you're saying is DEJA VOUS! -Ally

PS: Time to go see a doctor!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/12/2006 12:39AM by Ally.

Hey its been a while now and my cuts are healed and I am fine. I never went to the doctor. Umm, I almost did because it got a little worse before it got better but I started washing the cuts with nearly boiling water three times a day with eucalyptus and it went away in three days. My scars aren't gone yet but everything is scabbed over and its definitely gone. Could there still be stuff going on inside even though I have washed everything in the house and scrubbed the floors and I am really careful and wash my hands all the time? I'm safe right?

My dad is cool with the diet now (not sure about his girlfriend). He has been eating raw with us whenever he comes and visits us. Oh yeah, we have our own place in Vt for the summer! I even got my sister to eat raw vegan for a while until she had to leave but she loved it and wants to come live with us.

But I have a new problem now. (actually I am really happy, its not a problem- its just a problem of not know ing when i got pregnant) Its okay if you all don't want to respond to it. I am going to make a new forum for it.
I just found out I am pregnant but I don't think I have been pregnant the whole time I have been raw. Do you all know any way I can figure out before I get a sonagram how pregnant I am and how likely you all think it is that I JUST became pregnant and that my not getting my period before WAS just because of diet change. Let's say I am just a couple of weeks pregnant. Would I be feeling pregnant yet? And if I I have been pregant since the end of April how can I tell?
Thank you all for your help,
Marika

when I got pregnant with my first one, I was 17 and knew right away. I felt tired for a few hours, then spasticly energetic,then sad..... My mom took me to the doctor later that week and I found out I was about 15 days pregnant. I think it's womens intuition, but we know something is different right away. LOLOL! !

Glad to hear you're alright Marika! And congratulations on the almost new member of your family!

You might check the book, "Thank You Dr. Lamaze": it is THE classic on natural childbirth and explains the different phases of childbirth really well. When I had my baby, he came 3 months premature. With him coming so early, I only had time to read the book and never took the classes. That was enough to carry me easily through my labor, with no drugs.

Somewhat unrelated is the fact that my baby was one of the smallest surviving babies at that time (1 lb. 14 oz.)! 36 years later, he's doing fine.

Best Wishes, -Ally

Marika, Congratulations on your pregnancy. I must agree with Ally, staph, strep ,and any other bacteria can still fester in you even if your cuts heal. I am only commenting because of your pregnancy. If your body is harboring any blood bourne bacteria, you are directly passing this on to your fetus. I strongly urge you to visit a doctor. Not only are you risking your childs health, you may also be increasing your resistance for any future run in with staph or strep, making erradicating the infection even more difficult. Peace

I am 7 weeks as of yesterday so everything is awesome and I will talk to my midwife about the staph. The only thing now is I have been having horrible food aversions to most really healthy food. I can do fruit alright...but it is really expensive here in Vermont. I have been eating a lot of raw cow milk which I know is not very good at all but its the only thing that I can get into me and I figure its better to eat raw milk and yogurt with fruit in the morning than nothing at all. We have tons of blueberries and raspberries outside. I have totally noticed the difference with not being raw. My hair is really grossing me out and I have been getting acne and I have a lot more phlegm. But steamed veggies with rice I can get down. Salads- there is no way. I am hoping that in a month or so I will get over it and slowly get back to mostly raw and then I will still really have to watch my budget. I am really trying to just not get stressed about anything though. I think that has much more of a toll on me at the moment than eating cooked food. It is SO hard to find things I like to eat. Today we are going shopping and I will stock of on sunflower/sesame seeds and raisins. They are pretty easy to get down. But that's the news for now. Oh, I have also noticed my skin getting really dry. That's gross. What should I use for shampoo? Apple cider vinegar? What proportions should I use? Anyway, thanks a lot for giving me advice. It means a lot,
marika