...Especially in today's polluted environment, is there a danger of raw foodists - especially those who are high / 100% raw - being TOO clean or pure?

I've been pondering this for a long time, now, and wanted to see what you guys think about it...food for thought, yes?

For me, I've become wayyyyyyyy more sensitive to smells and scents, and to someone who already has mild to moderate Multiple Chemical Sensitivity / Environmental Illness, that may not necessarily be the best thing to have happen to you! And it's not only to chemicals that I have more strong reactions to - more and more it's to 'natural' things as well. I've also added a few more foods to my long list of allergies/intolerances since becoming raw, and had to make updates and clarifications to my Medical bracelet and Emergency Info. wallet card...

What about you?

By too pure, you mean too sensitive.

For me, my increased sensitivity is a gift, not a burden. And when I pay attention to those sensitivities, my health is enhanced rather than diminished.

Increased sensitivity is increased consciousness. Whether a rise in consciousness benefits you or diminished you is up to you.

Right. I totally agree with Bryan. Increased sensitivity is only a problem when it is brand new. Consciousness and free-will is all about the ability to CHOOSE.

My opinion is that the REALLY healthy folks can handle pollution or chemicals as needed. During transitional phases, it makes perfect sense to avoid triggers (food or emotionally) that you find yourself overly sensitive to.

-More power to you!

-David Z. Mason

WWW.RawFoodFarm.com

I have found on a juice-fast and when becoming 99% raw that I do smell more nasty odors, but that's not a "too" anything; it's your body returning to its more natural state.

I regretted mentioning my issue from the time I wrote about it; damn the short edit window!!! Should have just made this the general question that I'd wanted to at first and left myself out of it...but here's my say and I'll leave it alone: when you're already twice or more as sensitive as everyone else to begin with all of your life and then you find that extra has been added on on top of that...it can get pretty overwhelming at times and rather difficult to perceive as a blessing...

I'm all for increased conciousness; I'm loving that aspect of this life. What's hard is the other part. I've had a thoroughly wicked hard time with this same thing at work today, and you have no clue how blasted frustrated I have been all day... Maybe it was a mistake to post this topic in the first place when I'm feeling so incredibly frustrated and tired by it all...

Nuff said. I'm out.

Soraya-
totally understand.

i hate sitting next to someone with a scented soap on their skin, covered by a scented lotion, and then some perfume, shampoo, hair product, and then detergent on their clothes. and underneath it all, i can still smell their body.

and that was before i was raw. raw and pregnant? man- i slept alone b/c testosterone, garlic and whiskey really turned me grumpy and upset.

i can smell when people are sick. i try not to offend them, but often i tell people they're about to get sick just by standing near them and talking with them.

i totally understand.

peace-

I can relate on a different level. While not raw, I am extremely sensitive. I am the "delicate flower" of my clan. I am sensitive to foods, energies, lights, temperatures, fabrics, chemicals, noise. I cannot imagine this being heightened. Inded being sensitive is a gift. But in this overstimulating culture, unless major lifestyle accomodations are made, I mean major, it can be exhausting.

No one has ever accused me of being too pure.

:\


Lee

[www.dhamma.org]

"May all beings be happy."

Soraya Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I regretted mentioning my issue from the time I
> wrote about it; damn the short edit window!!!
> Should have just made this the general question
> that I'd wanted to at first and left myself out of
> it...but here's my say and I'll leave it alone:
> when you're already twice or more as sensitive as
> everyone else to begin with all of your life and
> then you find that extra has been added on on top
> of that...it can get pretty overwhelming at times
> and rather difficult to perceive as a blessing...
>
> I'm all for increased conciousness; I'm loving
> that aspect of this life. What's hard is the other
> part. I've had a thoroughly wicked hard time with
> this same thing at work today, and you have no
> clue how blasted frustrated I have been all day...
> Maybe it was a mistake to post this topic in the
> first place when I'm feeling so incredibly
> frustrated and tired by it all...
>
> Nuff said. I'm out.


Awwe, don't be frustrated!!!! Just do 90% raw or something if that helps you with your sensitivity. Peace....

No.

certainly, becoming overly sensitive was often nearly unbearable to me. i sold everything i owned and moved away from the big city i was living in looking looking looking for a place that wasn't overrun with people, traffic, noise, pollution, smells and sounds that i could no longer block out and were overwhelming me. i can take being that sensitized when i am in peaceful nature but feeling like that while battling the daily grind in a noisy, dirty place? no thank you.
unfortunately so far i haven't found that lovely paradise anywhere that i can make a living. until i can live exclusively in a natural setting like that i will not pursue raw to the degree i did in the past. it was destructive for me.
i think this experience, like all experience, is different for everyone. there is no one right answer, only the right answer for you.

Mama Cass - I could hug you right now; you actually made me smile, too. You so get it! Thanks for your support.

Dancerinthenight - I have exactly the same issues that you do - and everything has been heightened on raw, believe me - so I know that you truly do understand where I am coming from! Sensitivity is a gift that I am grateful for - don't get me wrong - but that doesn't mean that it isn't a handful to deal with at times. My sensitivities have steadily increased over the years since my tweens, and the vast majority of my reactions to chemicals, some natural stuff and many of my food allergins are analphylatic ones, so I'm not dealing with just "normal" sensitivity issues...

Utopian Life - I have been consistantly over 90% raw for many months, now, and am usually all raw; makes me more sensitive, not less...

Plus I recently began exercising consistantly again, and while I feel much stronger physically, it seems that I've become unblocked in not just physical aspects, but all the others as well - and UP goes the sensitivity meter again! I'm just having sooo much fun here...;}

I love being raw. Shoot, my body brought me to this point a bit before my mind was totally ready for it, true, but I'm here to stay.

I meant do lower raw if that makes things better, so assuming you were 99-100%, that's why I said do 90. Sorry I wasn't clear!

i have not noticed more sensitivities... over the last few years my eyes have become more sensitive to light (gotta have sunglasses now)...

but i think its more of an "awareness"... of the body, mind, spirit...i know exactly what affects me when i have certain things b.c i'm starting with a "clean base" so to speak (in reference to myself.) ... not clogged by stimulants, additives, etc. etc.... this is a category many raw-ists fall into ... so the word sensitivity can carry a negative implication....

i think awareness to how one really feels is a gift as others noted.... yet if its causing you much distress...how about making changes? get rid of the tv. turn off the computer, read some. avoid processed items. stay out of highly populated spots (like whole foods in nyc at 5 pm. ah!) ... keep your peace, and know what you're ok with. if that means eating more cooked so be it. if it means changing the other aspects of your life to maintain your balance? then let that be.

best
c

I'm thinking this has something with me having a hard time staying as raw as I'd like to these days (50-75% instead of 100%) -- my work environment is very stressful these days, as is my husband's, my mom is in and out of the hospital and my dear grandma is dying. Right now I'm eating what I feel like and not paying attention to what it is, and unfortunately, my yeast problem is back as is my lethargy, achiness and some depression. I'm looking forward to losing these symptoms as I get back into the higher raw habit. I'd rather be more sensitive and less depressed, achy, itchy and lethargic. Soraya -- Big Hugs!!!

Bryan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> By too pure, you mean too sensitive.
>
> For me, my increased sensitivity is a gift, not a
> burden. And when I pay attention to those
> sensitivities, my health is enhanced rather than
> diminished.

That's what I would think would happen.

I also have "chemical sensitivity" (actually a hypothyroid symptom for me too..although I didn't get this until I started messing around with detoxing and fasting)
A lot of people can breath in gas fumes like it's clean air.(Like the full serve gas stations where the guys are used to it)..What's so great about that? Glad I'm sensitive to it..I don't want to know what that does to your insides.

Although I can see it as a burden in work or social situations if you can't focus on anything but the other person's smell and want to back away from them. I'm sensitive to strong perfumes, hairspray, etc..and bad breath is the worst..so I already tend to keep distanced away from people. Recently, I went to the doctor's and The nurse reeked of perfume and I was forced to inhale it and hold my breath while she took my blood pressure. Then I breathed through my shirt until I finally stood in the hall to get some more ventilation but damn she left a freakin trail throughout the place.

((((sundancer)))

more ((((((sundancer))))))


sending peaceful vibes your way (in a winged prayer)

i clean my house with vinegar and lemon verbena
and baking soda

my skin itches when i put lotion on it

perfume gives me a headache (though i mix my own essential oils, b/c i love fragrance)

soap just gave me a nasty problem- b/c it was scented

i'm buying beeswax from a local guy to make cold cream for my skin,
b/c everything else is too harsh.

i'll make anyone a batch who can come by and pick it up

i can't wear unnatural fiber clothing anymore.

i like my smell,
and my skin
and my hair
and my children's smell (so visceral and honest)
and real food
and real herbs
and dirt
and grass
and salt water beaches
and the sun doesn't bother me at all
and i went into a drug store today (that soap thing caused problems) and i looked at aisles and aisles of things i was TERRIFIED of- and obviously there is a strong market for it all. but not me.

after a while on raw, i've learned i just don't like somethings, and that's okay. cilantro and onion can be served to others. i've also learned that 85% raw is my personal best maintenance level. someday maybe 100%, but not now. at least not intentionally, many days i am, but it's not a personal goal.

you have to be in balance with your environment- and it takes time and awareness. David always has amazing insight.

peace-

Bryan - I do agree with what you so beautifully said, and I do consider my (increased) sensitivity / conciousness a tremendous blessing...but there are some times where it could definitely be a little more difficult to stay in that frame of mind than others!!!

Coco - I definitely feel you. I'm in a suburban setting for now that's like living in a park - am definitely much happier surrounded by a lot of green!

Utopian Life, Ohitsclaire - I can't do lower raw, my body wouldn't let me. Even before I began to learn about the raw lifestyle I was becoming more and more sensitive to cooked food - and I was eating very simply at that point: light steaming of veggies and squashes, quick soups and stir fries that didn't cook the veggies all the way through, no red meat or dairy, no processed foods... what I could eat cooked dwindled and my raw strted increasing. Then I really started to look into raw in earnest, and as I increased my raw percentage, and ate completely raw one day a week, and so on, I felt tons better. Low raw completely sinks my energy in every way, and I feel completely horrible.

I do read a lot. I'm not one to be around a lot of people, anyway, and live a pretty isolated life. I've made huge strides in a lot of the emotional / mental arenas of my life and am becoming more and more balanced. I've made more changes this past almost year (next month = raw year, yea!) than I have in the previous few. Yet I believe it's okay to admit when you're being challenged every once in a while; we all are, aren't we? I sure don't live there - I am much more myself today. I just wanted to have an easy discourse about the topic which acknowledges the different ways in which we all can be impacted by this - I thought it something we could all learn from and perhaps see from a new perspective...

Sundancer - massive hugs and love to you as well!

LikeItOrNot - I can relate to that story! That's one of the many reasons I have a mask and carbon fiter spare in every bag that I travel with...especially if I have to catch the bus or train - phew!

being sensitive can be like an onslaught when you are in living in the city

1) EMF frequencies , this i can feel blindfolded no matter WHAT! i can feel it in my head, my nerves, etc.
2) smells of people, foods, gas leaks
3) shampoo, perfume, deodorants
4) gas fumes
5) formaldehyde on carpet

the list is endless

the BEAUTY of being sensitive

is that when i am out in nature

i can smell each and every plant
and a lot of times, i can tell when a plant is nearby even in the dark
cuz i can smell them

and identify them by smell

i can smell flowers so well

it is such a gift

i can hear the slight rustle of the wind going through the leaves
the whistling sounds of the air
made through branches

i can feel the warmth of the sun on top of my head, my arms, my skin
soaking it up

and feeling calm

i can smell the scent of pine
i can inhale bowlfuls of pristine air

and feel like i just had a banquet

when you intentionally purify your vessel to the best of your ability
you are also sensitive

to all the beauty that the universe has to offer

and u are able to contain it

and return it to those around you

i am sensitive to when people are feeling sad
and when they feel afraid

i am also sensitive to people who feel deeply peaceful and happy
and i can resonate with them

if u are sensitive
u are also able to pick up cues and details
that others may not be able to notice at all

sights,smells,sounds, etc.

this is just the tip of the surface

it goes deep

yes, it is a double edged sword

no doubt

a sword however doesn't just draw blood

metaphorically speaking, any sharp tool ( mental, emotional, spiritual or otherwise)
conquers things that could not otherwise be triumphed over had not the blade been sharp

Mama Cass - np lotion for me either - almond oil, coconut and shea butter instead - and I can't even wear essential oils anymore! Thankfully, I don't need them ;}

Beeswax is a def. no-no! And it's cotton clothing all the way, baby!

I learned really fast that I have to be mentally and emotionally "loose" when it comes to food and control; I cannot be obsessive about raw percentages, etc, or I get seriously unbalanced. I just eat what feels good to me, and that happens to be like almost - totally raw. It's not my goal to eat this way, it just happened organically on it's own.

La_Veronique - I had such a problem with EMFs that I couldn't use the computer for more than 10 minutes maximum without having to lie down for 2 hours, or watch TV or listen to my I-pod for too long, but in the past year or so I've been able to build up my resistance quite a bit. I still try to limit whatever exposures I can, however...

You can add to your list offgasing from newspaper and book print - nasty stuff!!!

What you and Mama Cass have said applies to me as well...I do love being so aware, sensitive and open, and I am the most alive that I have ever been in my entire life - but acknowledging the times where you may feel the double edge doesn't mean that you're not balanced, either ;} It is a process and a journey that we all travel day by day...

Yesterday and today I've been going through the most amazing and beautiful state of acceptance and "being"... I'm not at the place where I briefly had to question or vent anymore.. thank you all for your replies, suggestions and support. It is helpful to see that there are others who have to deal with similar things, and I'm sure it will be a tremendous aid to many others as well.

Much love to all you beautiful, radiant souls

There seems to be a missing ingredient here.

If you are healthier, you should have an increased ability to withstand insults from whatever. Many people seem to be weakened not strengthened by their raw food eating. This isn't the same as not noticing harmful things or not connecting them to the source.

Not using perfumes, shampoos, household chemicals, etc because you recognize that they are harmful shouldn't cause you to be terrified if you come in contact with them. Don't let your imagination poison you. Someone once said, "If you think your food will hurt you, it will"(could be anything, not just food). The reverse gets a lot more people in trouble: "If you don't think your food will hurt you it won't" definitely isn't true. What a lot of you forget, though, is that it will hurt you a lot less.

The vast majority of products aren't particularly harmful. Your body can handle a lot and hardly notice. Or it can go into alarms over nothing. Are you going to die over half a peanut? Many people's bodies are educated to self destruct on less than that. If you are healthy, and raw foods should make you healthy, you should be able to handle a lot more without missing a beat.

When I decided to go raw, I decided to not allow myself to get into such a state where I got sick over a little bit of cooked food. As a result I haven't been 100% (95%) even though I don't crave cooked food and don't enjoy it. If I eat too much cooked food, I get a headache. I try to stay within my limitations. I take the attitude that my body can assimilate what little good remains in it and break down what is damaged. I don't ever intend to go back to normal mostly cooked food, yet I recognize that situations may arise where a certain amount of cooked food must be tolerated. Famine conditions for example. Being a survivor means doing the best you can.

Of course, living somewhere besides NY may make sense!


Does your sensitivity mean you are more aware? Are you also more aware of the effect of your imagination on your body?

TruthHunter

Soraya Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> ...I do love being so aware, sensitive and
> open, and I am the most alive that I have ever
> been in my entire life - but acknowledging the
> times where you may feel the double edge doesn't
> mean that you're not balanced, either ;} It is a
> process and a journey that we all travel day by
> day...
>
> Yesterday and today I've been going through the
> most amazing and beautiful state of acceptance and
> "being"... I'm not at the place where I briefly
> had to question or vent anymore.. thank you all
> for your replies, suggestions and support. It is
> helpful to see that there are others who have to
> deal with similar things, and I'm sure it will be
> a tremendous aid to many others as well.
>
> Much love to all you beautiful, radiant souls

At maybe 50% raw I can't quite relate to being in a pure or clean state of health, but am learning from your experiences and inspired to keep going.

thanks,
loeve

I just found this forum and a post that touched on so many levels and issues I have experienced.

The concept of too pure makes so much sense. The 100% raw lifestyle brings humans back to their original intended design within nature and not part of the human made pseudo-existence created in fear of nature.

I have been dealing with this as of late. I wish there was more of a community to be part of opposed to living within the confines of others chosen way of life.

I spent a few days up in Sedona AZ. It was refreshing to spend time eating at D'Lish, vegan and raw foods, restaurant and stopping by markets to each fresh produce. I spent time in a cottage near the Oak Creek wandering through nature, doing yoga, and just enjoying everything. It was pure bliss and part of my idea of heaven. Coming back to the Valley(Phoenix) the overcrowded cities, the horrid stench in the air and just about everything else was an affront to my senses. I have been depressed since then.

Eating raw foods is the way we were designed to survive. Being part of the original design and then becoming part of the fabricated man-made lifestyle is difficult to cope with.

I haven't become 100% raw as of yet. I would like to someday. The eating part is easy, the social part is my personal and greatest challenge.

Have those of you that have been 100% raw for a long time found a way to cope with the differences that exist between natures way vs mans?

I feel that someday we will reach a human/nature co-existence lifestyle. One where a level of harmony and technology can exist. That is what I want to work towards each day.

soraya, sounds like you know what you need to do for yourself. 'truth' always speaks first

Sure. They way to deal with people is always to support THEM - and not have any issues with them personally. Everyone has their own free will....and is on their own path....and needs and example....not a drill sergeant. Non-natural people need love too! It's important to have strong boundaries and to be ready to walk away from nosy or abusive people that aren't interested in my help, but rather in making themselves feel better about their own unhealthy decisions. Heh..heh.

-David Z. Mason

WWW.RawFoodFarm.com

TruthHunter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There seems to be a missing ingredient here.
>
> If you are healthier, you should have an increased
> ability to withstand insults from whatever...
> Not using perfumes, shampoos, household
> chemicals, etc because you recognize that they are
> harmful shouldn't cause you to be terrified if you
> come in contact with them. Don't let your
> imagination poison you...
> The vast majority of products aren't particularly
> harmful. Your body can handle a lot and hardly
> notice. Or it can go into alarms over nothing. Are
> you going to die over half a peanut? Many people's
> bodies are educated to self destruct on less than
> that. If you are healthy, and raw foods should
> make you healthy, you should be able to handle a
> lot more without missing a beat.

TruthHunter, thank you for taking the time to comment; I do agree with much of what you have said...

However, the above may not be true for everyone; it ceratinly is not for me. Not all physical sensitivities are as a result of diet - many other factors may play a part as well. I am not terrified to come in contact with chemicals and the like because I know they are harmful, but I am very aware of the analphalatic reactions I have in most cases when I do - which do have the potential to be life threatening in my case. This is in no way, shape or form a creation of my imagination! LOL. And, I must say, unfortunately there ARE those so sensitive / allergic that they WOULD die over half a peanut...

> When I decided to go raw, I decided to not allow
> myself to get into such a state where I got sick
> over a little bit of cooked food. As a result I
> haven't been 100% (95%) even though I don't crave
> cooked food and don't enjoy it. If I eat too much
> cooked food, I get a headache. I try to stay
> within my limitations. I take the attitude that
> my body can assimilate what little good remains in
> it and break down what is damaged. I don't ever
> intend to go back to normal mostly cooked food,
> yet I recognize that situations may arise where a
> certain amount of cooked food must be tolerated.
> Famine conditions for example. Being a survivor
> means doing the best you can.

That's exactly part of what I've been trying to get at! Doing the best you can at any time. Not being obsessive about anything, and maintaining the best balance for you! Everybody - and every BODY - is different and reacts to things in varying ways, and we must all be mindful of that. My truth is mine, and may not be anyone else's - and so on...

> Of course, living somewhere besides NY may make
> sense!

This has been happening since my childhood, when, incidentally, I was living in the tropics, and did so for most of my life...

> Does your sensitivity mean you are more aware? Are
> you also more aware of the effect of your
> imagination on your body?


Yes, and yes, I am aware of the power of correct thought. However, what I speak of and deal with from day to day is not an imaginary game.

However, enough of that! ;} Moving on...

Loeve - Continue to take things at your own pace and take the necessary actions that work for you and speak to your truth!

Yogi33 - Thank you very much for your kind words, and, yes, I have made peace with where I am at and what I need to do and be for myself.

davidzanemason - well put, as usual!!!


Peace!

I get burning rashes (Tilex) or piercing headaches (bleach) whenever I'm around harsh chemicals since I've been raw, but I take that as a BIG RED FLAG to either get away or use something else! It's built-in advice for survival, a blessing, indeed.

I did move out of my bacon grease, bass-pounding-until-4-AM apartment because it WAS too much stimulation for me. I feel *SO* *MUCH* *BETTER* now, too, in a peaceful, quiet, raw vegan home. <3 My vibration isn't strong enough to transform all the energies that confront me, I guess. Yet.

Although, someone spilled 1/2 gallon of bleach in the basement at work last night, and I had no choice but to stay for the full shift. =\ Can't stress too much about what's out of our control. I was by the windows and dizzy on the ground floor... I don't know how the guy who was mopping stayed in the basement with the chemicals for the hour or so he spent down there. O.O But if that happened every day, I would probably have to work somewhere else. =S