Here on this board as well as other places, I've read where people say that erratic eating behavior stopped after they stopped kicking themselves for it, or once they started to really accept themselves for the way they are.

Can anyone out there can give me some idea where I can get help finding my way towards this sort of acceptance?

I live in South Korea, so, I'm certainly not expecting one on one contact with anyone! Any kind of help would be much appreciated. Stories .... Advice .... Websites.... Yeah ... anything.

Thanks very much.

Troy.



This way is not compatible with Zen practice. This way IS Zen practice. - Dr. Doug Graham

Nothing whatsoever should be attached to. - Buddha

[www.byronkatie.com]

to be honest, i don't think everyone that posts here accept themselves too often

I agree,and its a daily task to accept yourself just the way you are.But it can be done,and yes,the bad eating habits,whatever form they take,do lessen and alot of times stop,when you really like who you are.

Troy,I dont know how religious you are,but I think contacting your higher power,in whatever your belief system is, is a great place to start.

Brian

Troy,

When I eat something at night that I regret the next morning and start to kick myself I remind myself I'm still eating WAY better than anyone I know - and I mustn't let myself get too absorbed over something so relatively trivial i.e compared to the millions who are very grateful for a small bowl of rice in their day to stave off starvation.

Above all, recognition that my attitiudes/thoughts are just a fleeting thing, mingled with a good dose of compassion for myself in my daily struggle to live with an open heart.

"i love you troy and i accept you for all you are" Its a self affirmation mantra that i do when i am actively beating myself up for something i did simply because i am human... when i remember to do it... and i can hear all the negative things going on in my head i start frantically saying this mantra and i turn the volume up as loud as i can... whether you say it out loud or just in your head... keep it going until the negative thoughts have subsided... it really works wonders... what you are doing with this is rewriting the old negative beliefs into new and wonderful positive ones... it is a daily task... sometimes minutely...or even secondly...

pray for guidance and you'll have it...

love laugh and dream

I hear you. A board like this is MEANT for venting! Ha! ha! And those who are transitioning and struggling....so it's all good. Of COURSE....you will probably NOT hear much from those who are 100% OK with who they are. They have much in that vein to vent about! Heh..heh.


-Why don't you start with something small and work your way up to 'you'? Heh..heh. Can you accept a stone fully for what it is? How about a tree? Can you accept an animal fully for what it is....and love it? Using these 'gateways' into the now can be very helpful. Eckhart Tolle's book Power of Now can is a good read in this regard. I wish you (and any who do not have it) peace and love for themselves....whatever 'flaws' they may possess.

-David Z. Mason

WWW.RawFoodFarm.com

Does not accepting yourself make you change for the better anyway?

If not, try to give it up. Realize it doesn't work.

Keep in mind though it will be difficult. The culture doesn't look kindly on people who love themselves no matter what they do. Contriteness in certain situations gains favor (even the difference between life & death in the court system).

Sorry to hear you're going through this TroySantos. Sorry about ANYBODY going through this.

We're with you TroySantos! If change is what you're looking for, then a good place to start is with changing your mind. Practice to consciously replace thoughts of regret with more productive thoughts of inquiry: "What are the subtle (and not so subtle) lesson(s) from this that are given to me to learn so that I can do better next time, and grow as a person?" "What thoughts do I need to modify?"

Stay focused on the lesson - not the regret. If you focus on the regret, you'll lose the lesson, and you'll INcorrectly define yourself as a stagnant being; and then that's what you'll be.

BUT, if you focus on the lesson, you'll lose the regret! And you'll correctly define yourself as a person who is moving forward; and then that's what you'll be.

The lesson deserves your undivided attention!

Ask your higher being to help you find the lesson, ask again and again, be receptive, be watchful, and I'm sure you'll find what you're looking for.

We're all just babies! Would you blame a baby when it falls down before it's learned to walk?

Make sure you're getting adequate nutrition regularly, so that you're struggling WITH nature and not AGAINST her. Nature's lessons are her secrets until we learn them, and none of us know her secrets as well as we think. We're here to learn. If we knew all her secrets already, we wouldn't be here.

And get plenty of exercise so you can keep those endorphins up!

(Sorry to be preachy like this. It's one of my character flaws.)



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 12/16/2008 10:20PM by suncloud.

I like your signature questions, Troy. The spirit of inquiry in science,
math and cosmology is pure.. just as is faith in things hoped for,
and the paths we individually take.

peace,
loeve

I think loving yourself unconditionally is a good thing but I'm not so sure accepting yourself is a good thing ? If you accept yourself as is then how do you get leverage to change ? Sometimes change can be a good thing.

INCENTIVE-MOTIVATION-SUCCESS

Sometimes an appeal to my intelligence works. However, the best incentive for eating raw food will be the relief it gives from toxic accumulation. Setting short-term goals, like eating one raw food meal at a time, can be the most effective means of insuring success. Each immediate goal can be fully realized. The sequential attainment of each goal leads us on to the path of success. Just as a distant journey begins with one small step, short term goals ultimately lead to, long range VICTORY !_!

Prepare to cope with occasional setbacks. They arrive in cycles. Setbacks seem to be a necessary part of the healing process, because they help clarify the edges of our limitations. When setbacks happen, the inner dialogue goes something like this: “Well now, have I forgotten how awful the reaction was the last time I tried eating this stuff? Hmm, I must have. Am I insane !_! I knew it wouldn't be good for me, but I wanted it anyway and besides, how could anything that tastes this good, be that bad for me ?_?”

Selective amnesia, unresolved childhood conditioning, resistance to authority, posthypnotic trance state, irrational behavior, denial, and the endless chain of carnal cravings set in again, and I wonder, “How much suffering must I endure before I’ll remember the difference between enlivening, live food and devitalized, dead food? How sick do I need to be, before I let simple science and common sense, dictate the decisions necessary to guarantee my future good health and mental well being?” “Yeah sure, I’m going to change my diet. I really need to do it soon too. Maybe tomorrow!” Well, as sincere as it sounds, in reality, “I couLd, wouLd and shouLd be doing that,” have a hidden "L" that stands for the Lie they contain because, I am still—not doing it. Similarly, TRYING to eat healthy cannot do anything, but provide a convenient alibi for Not taking responsibility for - Today.

Of course, without the senses and youthful folly to tempt and teach us, we wouldn’t learn to take responsibility for the truth or consequences of exercising our own self will. “Too much, too soon” or “too little, too late,” becomes more apparent when we finally get sick and tired of waking up sick and tired—particularly when we discover how much of our failing health has been—self induced. Then doing what actually works best becomes more obvious and getting serious about staying healthy and physically fit, makes perfect sense. Especially since the more I do, the better I feel. When I’m in doubt about making critical decisions regarding my daily diet, the first impulse I get relates to my carnal craving, (my desire for pleasure) the second comes from my genuine hunger for fitness, good health, and a Future, Happy Well Being.

When left to nature, even a well-kept garden soon returns to weeds. As the organic gardener’s efforts can enrich soil, so our internal “cell garden” will be enriched by everything we do to improve our future good health. “Yes we must do the required work to make significant changes, otherwise we only get light, superficial results. Weed out all foods with little nutritional value. That's right, there’s nothing to it—just do it.” With a little voluntary effort, a briar patch can be converted into a cornucopia. Persistent practice produces successful results. Just as a plentiful garden was created, one shovel full at a time, successful living becomes a process of figuring out which way actually works best; then doing it for one minute, one hour and one day at a time. Remember: if we don’t include self-help-health with our personal recovery—temporary relief will be the best we can hope for.

Only exercise the muscles you want to be strong. Brush only the teeth you want to save. Stretch only the muscles you want flexible. For excellent health, only eat food that enlivens your body. Take time, to pause assess and evaluate need, before eating each bite. The benefits of self-discipline will soon become a preference. For the best day of your life, practice self-help-health just for, TODAY!_!

Alkaline AL

Mr. Santos, I sent you a heartfelt PM and your inbox was full. >.<

In any case, an (assisted?) Freudian regression can be very helpful--books, meditation, psychotherapy, spirit guides, there are a million ways to go about it. A lot of negative behaviors can form very early in life, and finding a way to dive into the psyche and back into those early moments, to offer that hand of compassion as an adult to your own inner child, can make amazing amends. To get back into those deepest wounds, listen to, forgive and comfort yourself, can be a very liberating experience. Integrate...

For me, a self-sabotage followed by self-abuse was the pattern I needed to understand, identify and break. Disordered eating was just a symptom of a basic internal struggle, thought patterns that shaped years of my life.

Again I've asked a question, and again I've been given a world of answers. Thanks so much everyone.

I do indeed have a spiritual practice. Zen Buddhist practice. In some ways it's quite strong. But when I feel like I want to eat, then I oftentimes let the practice wilt.

And, yep, I also have a copy of Tolle's book, "The Power of Now". Great.

Of course the erratic eating is just a symptom of internal disorder. I don't have clear ideas about what's all going on internally but for sure this sort of eating is a branch. The tree is deeply rooted. Honestly, I believe it's not necessary to know what is at the root of all this. I don't have an opinion however about whether it's more effective to know. I haven't tried to get to the bottom of it. Here on an island in South Korea, I wouldn't even try to find some sort of professional to help me see where it all comes from. I feel more motivated by the idea to simply accept myself as I am. This also seems to be consistent with Zen practice.

EZ Rider: "I think loving yourself unconditionally is a good thing but I'm not so sure accepting yourself is a good thing ? If you accept yourself as is then how do you get leverage to change ? Sometimes change can be a good thing."
I don't suppose that accepting oneself means to NOT change. We're all changing all the time. Like everything. Though we don't notice the changes, they happen.

I feel that to love is to accept. If I don't accept, then do I love? If I push and push for change, then I'm not accepting, and, it seems to me, this is not a loving way to be.

Phantom: Your heartfelt PM came through just the same. Got it :-). Here's some for you too ... and for everyone.

I wish acceptance / love to you all.

Thanks so much to all of you. Time for meditation.

Troy.



This way is not compatible with Zen practice. This way IS Zen practice. - Dr. Doug Graham

Nothing whatsoever should be attached to. - Buddha

troy,

i wonder what you mean by erratic eating

and

i don't know what this means

"But when I feel like I want to eat, then I oftentimes let the practice wilt. "

Troy,
I have been learning about Zen recently and I find comfort in its ways.
Its the mindfulness of the moment,and the idea that the Universe is wanting only whats good for us, that has lead me to being free of alcohol,and has allowed alot of old ways of thinking to shed away.

Peace to you.

Brian

Hi Troy,
I recently made some real progress with erratic eating at night, and it came in the form of having a breakthrough with emotional issues I had about (!not!) using my talent and creativity. I had been stuffing down my feelings of dissatisfaction and inertia with myself with food. Now that I find myself filled with enthusiasm and motivation again, and I'm doing the things I love, my need to overreat has pretty much evaporated. Your experience may be totally different-- I know each of us comes with our own set of issues and characteristics to sort out-- so all I can say is examine whether there's anything you're distressed about that's causing you to eat inappropriately, believe that you have the power to make positive changes, and... love yourself no matter what!

Hi Troy,

Hmmm... you made me think of something... "Love yourself even if you are not physically attractive", I think more than 99% of human population know this but less than 1% of people can do it. Having said that, I must say I'm one of the 99% human population. :-)

All the Best,
Wong

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> troy,
>
> i wonder what you mean by erratic eating
I mean inconsistency. Not regular times or amounts. Erratic.

> and i don't know what this means

> "But when I feel like I want to eat, then I
> oftentimes let the practice wilt. "
I practice "Buddhism". So, when cravings arise, and I'm aware of the cravings, then, I can either put the practice into gear and ask just stare the cravings down, or ... with my practice, deeply ask the question "What is?". Meaning, what is the ultimate truth, or, well, I guess this is about as good a way to say it as any.

So, by saying, "to let the practice wilt" I mean to ignore all that and just eat. Cravings come and cravings go, so to follow them, well, is to eat erratically. I practice sometimes, but I've been doing this for years and years, so .... Gotta end somewhere. With death of this person, or with the death of those cravings.

Raw1228: "I have been learning about Zen recently and I find comfort in its ways. Its the mindfulness of the moment,and the idea that the Universe is wanting only whats good for us, that has lead me to being free of alcohol,and has allowed alot of old ways of thinking to shed away."
- Honestly, this sort of teaching doesn't appear to me to be very "Zenish" but I don't want to criticize either. If it's comforting to you, and it's doing you some good in life, then I say HOORAY!

Kwan: I appreiate what you're saying. I've thought about this and today will see about learning a martial art. I recently met an organic farmer who practices Zen and a martial art. For a long long time I've been keenly interested in learning a martial art. I know some people call these things aggressive and violent. I see them very differently. This guy glows and he says that both the meditation and the martial art have made enormous changes in his life.

Wong: Yeah, for sure, humans are so so attached to physical appearances. I'm in the 99% too. Same boat. Thanks.

Thanks everyone. Much appreciated, really.

Troy.



This way is not compatible with Zen practice. This way IS Zen practice. - Dr. Doug Graham

Nothing whatsoever should be attached to. - Buddha

Troy, my oldest son would totally concur. He is very non-violent, but just earned a black belt in Kung Fu. He also meditates with his monk friends and is working toward teaching yoga. All these practices have combined to ground him and do other wonderful things for his life. He is also vegan.

troy wrote>
I mean inconsistency. Not regular times or amounts. Erratic.


ok. i wonder why you think that eating not at regular times or amounts is a bad thing then?

Right on Sundancer. Sounds like your son is doing something good for himself and for others. You are - in part - to blame!! Right on!

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> troy wrote>
> I mean inconsistency. Not regular times or
> amounts. Erratic.
>
>
> ok. i wonder why you think that eating not at
> regular times or amounts is a bad thing then?
Okay. Forget that word. I'll just say that I often eat in ways that I believe amount to slow suicide.

On a happier note. I will take a path similar to Kwan in that I'll start doing something I'm passionate about. On Tuesday I will start a martial art practice similar to Tai Chi. Not a gentle kind, but one of the vigorous kinds. Maybe some hitting. I don't know. I finish teaching English classes at about 7:30 or 8:00 in the evening then the martial art practice starts at 8:30. I have so so often eaten after work. But I really see myself not eating between my last class and the start of practice which goes until 10:30. Then the group meditates for 30 minutes once a week, but I hope to do it more often.

I do expect this to take place of the nighttime eating. I might eat between classes but I have rarely done much damage between classes so I expect the eating behavior to become more moderate right away.

I do believe that "erratic" (!) eating is just a symptom of something I don't see, so there's still the potential to continue the slow suicidal eating. I do believe though that this will help with that too.

Why o why do humans get addicted to things? alcohol . gambling . sex . shopping . TV . work . you name it there are people who are addicted to it. I've read that there are Twelve Step groups for 106 different addictions. 106!
I suppose there are at least that many reasons why we get addicted, as well as at least that many theories. How many solutions are there? Don't they all boil down to one solution: when the addict is ready to let go, then it'll happen. So how do you get ready to let go? Really feeling the pain of the addiction. My guess.

I'll now do the marital art practice in place of the meditation here at the temple where I live. I just didn't believe that it would be right, or, that I would be permitted to live here yet not do the meditation practice that the others do. So I had decided to find an apartment somewhere close to the martial art place. And I had started to look forward to the external freedom from not having any responsibilities other than to myself. I figured I'd live in an apartment and wouldn't have to clean any temple grounds or sort through the garbage and recyclables here at the temple. So I told these things to the head monk. He told me to stay if I want to stay, or go if I want to go.

There are two old ladies here living here. One is busy pretty much all the time. The other is about 90 years old and sometimes is weak. She has been sweeping for years and years! But now I have been told that I don't have to help with any of the work. I can live here, for free even, and not work at all. So, there's the EXTERNAL freedom to do whatever in hell I want. But, can I handle it mentally? Will my conscience allow me to live and eat some of the cooked food here and benefit from others work yet not work (much - I'll do a little)? If not, then I won't have INTERNAL freedom.

A friend here advised me to not worry about it. I'll do my best to be calm and peaceful. I've been given the right to stay and not work. I've been giving pretty generously and will continue to. I make good money as an English teacher.

That's enough.

Thanks everyone for all your comments, questions, and suggestions.

Troy.



This way is not compatible with Zen practice. This way IS Zen practice. - Dr. Doug Graham

Nothing whatsoever should be attached to. - Buddha

Thanks, Troy, but he developed these patterns and habits for himself long after he moved out of the house (he's 28), so I can't take much of the "blame"!

I'm dealing with this in some capacity myself. I know that I feel and look optimal when I eat 100% raw, and the bigger percentage of cooked foods I eat, the more negative symptoms I have, but sometimes that doesn't stop me. Right now I'm at 50-75% at best, and have been at this rate for a few months. the other 25-50% is what is hurting. I think your plan sounds good and I hope it works for you. I'm glad another new year is coming up, because I am a fan of resolutions and actually have a pretty good track record with them because I never make them last more than a year. Each year is a clean slate for me. Good luck to us both!!!

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]

Bryan did an inspired post about "Freeing oneself of one's self control" a few months ago.