rawenzymes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Edited 8 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2015 01:10PM by rawenzymes.

Looks like a possible PowerLifer signature. New account and knowing everybody and editing the posts 8 times.

yeap. Thats PowerLifer wearing a cloak, a hidden agenda, and promoting sardines.

He got a custom wax figure of Dr Graham in his kitchen. He also creates fake accounts on his own forum that somehow asking about Dr Graham

John Rose wrote:
PLEASE tell me what you do NOT understand as this is the main reason why I come to this website. I need y’alls feedback! Please help me explain this in a way that you understand.

Tai:
I think I understand you. Talking to TSM and reading from many people on this site has made me more and more appreciate where I live and how easy it is for me to be close to all raw and do easy heavy juicing. I think I focused more on my time constraints more as a reason to skip it and postpone it, but when I see what kind of major obstacles TSM and others face, I can simply hire someone to help me. No one likes to shell out extra money, especially when I am still repaying my student loans, but it is easier to sell something valuable to pay for hired help than it is to move locations (in comparison to where some of the diehard rawists live). I used to hire someone in the past, and was able to eat more raw food and do more juicing that way. My location is prime for raw veganism. I could go to a juice bar, but they don't have a nice angel juicer like I do. The juice bar that has a norwalk makes their juices a few times a day, so they are usually at least an hour old, if not a few hours old. SO, it's not that easy to just go buy top raw food, and if I did, it would be more expensive than just hiring my own help.

So, John, I just conceded a lot of points to you.

How about considering some of mine:

I wrote quite a bit on this thread, because it is a heavy statement you made about the fall of mankind being due to cooked food. I wrote about a couple of rawists that hurt themselves with the mentality that cooked food is a sin.

Consider:
1) infected produce with pathogens, common in third world countries. Cooking can be a life saver.
2) when stored legumes, grains and seeds are no longer viable (meaning they can no longer sprout), they are still a valuable source of food for hungry people and should not be thrown away. They should be used. It is a sin to throw away good food, even if it's not the best.
3) Is it a sin to eat cooked food or is it a sin to throw away good food? I read how one rawist here threw away her dehydrated crackers because the temperature got bumped up to 145. There are a number of homeless shelters that accept food and donations. But if you believe that cooking is a sin, then you don't feel remorse in throwing away perfectly good food for hungry people.
4) some places don't have enough raw produce to eat, like those who rely on cassava that must be cooked, otherwise it is toxic raw.
5) some very valuable food and herbs are toxic raw, such as black beans, which have medicinal uses. I like to use horsetail as another example, because it is a wonderful herb for silica. It can deplete thiamin in the body if used raw.
6) cooked legumes and grains are very dense and if someone is too busy to eat 5 plates of food for a variety of reason or doesn't have space in their stomach for too much stretching, then it has value under certain circumstances. I give my older friend as an example, who is hunched over and has little space in his stomach and he developed an aversion to fruit over the years, due to it hurting his teeth when he went raw vegan.
7) some herbs can't be extracted without boiling, like very dense roots, like knotted dang gui. SOmetimes a person needs herbal medicine. Maybe some rawists don't need medicine ever and they may never need such roots.

Well, I don't expect you to agree with these points John, if you truly believe cooking is a sin, but I wrote it for anyone that struggles with orthorexic thinking and is not doing well on their current 100% all raw diet. Consider that the Gerson program cured/s cancer and other diseases while offering some cooked food along with raw food and 13 juices daily.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2015 07:21PM by Tai.

rawenzymes Wrote:
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> You will never convince hardcore natural
> hygienists that even fresh culinary herbs are
> healthy, they are stubborn, out-dated,
> under-researched, rigid and dogmatic in their
> belief systems.
>

why do you need to convince them?

they merely have a different opinion from you.

> They don't understand herbology or even the
> chemical make up of foods they do promote such as
> fruits.
>

or maybe they do

> So to expect them to understand something as
> complicated as herbology is beyond them, so they
> simply denounce that these foods are all toxic and
> unhealthy without any context or rationale.
>

perhaps not toxic but not as good as other choices,
and not "beneficial"


> Now you will see my troubles on the forum for the
> past 5+ years. Any time you merely mention a
> herb, expect to get insulted and ganged upon every
> time you do by the fruit mafia, you will also be
> constantly told herbs are not real foods or some
> other form of pseudo-scientific unproven dogma.
>

your TROUBLES are nothing of the sort.

your TROUBLES consist of concerning yourself with what others think,
instead of merely sharing your view with those who may be interested.



> Finally you'll be run off the forum unless you
> change your beliefs to suit their dogmatic natural
> hygiene high fruit ideals.

you were not Run off the forum.
you have trouble understanding how to interact with others,
as well as some other personal issues that are causing you distress.

<<<I think I understand you.>>>

Hey Tai,

I really don’t think that you do understand me based on everything you wrote about the Fall of Mankind.

Before the Fall, Life was simple, but after the Fall, Life is more Complicated because we have another Group of Needs we must Satisfy. If you truly understand what I mean by that, then you would understand that the Raw Food Diet is the Ideal Diet in an Ideal World and we NO longer live in an Ideal World.

Once again, we have 2 Groups of Needs we must Satisfy - 12 Essential Needs and 2 Additional Temporary Needs and 1 of our Essential Needs is an Environment that can sustain us and too many people are NO longer living where we are meant to live, not to mention that we have also DAMAGED our Environment. Raw Plant Foods, which is our Species Specific Diet, would also be 1 of our 12 Essential Needs and then, Herbs and Acupuncture are just 2 of the many Protocols that can be used for 1 of our and 2 Additional Temporary Needs.

There are other points I want to address in some of your previous posts but I have not got around to them yet but I plan on it.

In the meantime, please try to understand the difference between the Law of Cause & Effect and the Ripple Effect and once you do, I think you will have a better understanding of what I’ve been trying to say. It’s really not that complicated, but it does require a little thought and it requires the Wisdom of a Buddhist - you have to be able to hold 2 possibilities in your brain at the same time, which is very difficult for most people to do. Most people do NOT want to entertain the idea that we should not cook our food.

Do some people have difficulty with this concept?

Of course, and that has to do with the Ripple Effect!

"perhaps not toxic but not as good as other choices,
and not "beneficial""

Yep you're right, there's not one herb that is beneficial or a better choice of food to eat than the types of foods you consume (dates and lettuce).

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "perhaps not toxic but not as good as other
> choices,
> and not "beneficial""
>
> Yep you're right, there's not one herb that is
> beneficial or a better choice of food to eat than
> the types of foods you consume (dates and
> lettuce).

I presume that is sarcasm.
ooh, misrepresenting my diet !
not very productive, prindl.

rawenzymes Wrote:
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> Ohh come on fresh to be told from you of all
> people i have trouble interacting with others with
> the sheer amount of insults ive put up from you
> alone over the years and witnessed from you is
> beyond laughable.
>

what you call an insult i call an observation

> Also who says fresh herbs or even medicinal herbs
> aren't beneficial, you ? There is a wealth of
> quality studies that would disagree, yes i know
> you only believe in science when its in agreement
> with your beliefs.
>

Right on chris! I DO agree with studies when they make sense and are in alignment with my paradigm. just like anyone else. we are all biased to some degree.

and what is the point of this continual arguing with everyone that you do here after all these years? do you feel that it is productive?

> You have clearly proven to me like the other
> natural hygienists that you don't understand the
> chemical makeup of the foods you eat, or you'd
> realize that many of these "toxic" and "medicinal"
> alkaloids and phyto-nutrients that you disagree
> with in herbs are also contained in the fruits and
> greens you consume.
>

your words above, while seemingly trying to make a point, are not doing so.

I am quite aware of the pros and cons of foods and endeavor to maximize nutrition and minimize negative aspects of foods. My evaluation of a food that I personally want to eat takes a whole host of factors that you may not be concerned with . and that's ok.


> Natural hygiene villanizes garlic for its
> anti-biotic properties because its "medicinal",
> but the anti-microbial effect that ellagic acid
> provides from raspberries is not "medicinal" of
> course.


Your statement above, once again, attempts to make a point in an argumentative way to try to Get one over on me, or people like me who you think are reading this. as I said above , I take a WIDE VARIETY of factors into consideration when choosing foods.

enjoy the day

"ooh, misrepresenting my diet !"

Sorry, did I miss some tangelos?

I'm having a difficult time understanding the point of your post prindl.

IS this what you wish to offer to the discussion?

Ignorant posts regarding what you think I am eating?

What did you do for fun today, prindl?

Did you offer your friendship to anyone today?

Help anyone in need?

Clean up the planet?

stop global warming?

Did you have a question? are you fascinated by what I am eating?

Are you concerned about my health?

you're right, it's a wonder I can even type on a keyboard what with my diet that is lacking in powerful factors, according to you.

We all are waiting for your next mindless acerbic comment.

Please don't disappoint us.

John Rose wrote:

Before the Fall, Life was simple, but after the Fall, Life is more Complicated because we have another Group of Needs we must Satisfy. If you truly understand what I mean by that, then you would understand that the Raw Food Diet is the Ideal Diet in an Ideal World and we NO longer live in an Ideal World.

you have to be able to hold 2 possibilities in your brain at the same time,

There are other points I want to address in some of your previous posts but I have not got around to them yet but I plan on it.

Tai:
Yes, I hold multiple possibilities in my mind at a time. No problem there.

I look forward to your other replies.

"I'm having a difficult time understanding the point of your post prindl."

Saving others from falsely believing foods such as herbs and super foods are not beneficial or far more valuable than common foods and/or thinking anyone who believes so is just gullible and being taken advantage of by companies trying to sell a product.

Rawenzymes wrote:
When someone mentioned that Mango(the fruitarian) lost 4 of his teeth which he solemly believes was because he ate some unripe mangoes.

Come on, people eat unripe fruit all over the world daily, i do it all the time, especially mangoes which are rarely quality here in the UK, yet im not losing my teeth all over the shop.

Tai:
Didn't he say that he lost 7-8 teeth from the unripe mangoes? I think he said he was a strict fruitarian for 3 months before living at the mango grove, so you may have a point. I think the issue here is quantity. People eat unripe fruit all the time, but not to the degree that he ate them. I totally believe him. He is the expert at losing teeth from unripe fruit. It's amazing he is still happy go lucky on a fruit diet.

from vedicheritageinc.com:
Unripe mangoes have oxalic, citric, malic, tartaric and succinnic acids which results in its sour taste. As such, it is acidic, astringent and antiscorbutic. The ripe fruit is full of sugar.

[vimeo.com]

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "I'm having a difficult time understanding the
> point of your post prindl."
>
> Saving others from falsely believing foods such as
> herbs and super foods are not beneficial or far
> more valuable than common foods and/or thinking
> anyone who believes so is just gullible and being
> taken advantage of by companies trying to sell a
> product.

I think you've quite clearly made that point dozens of times.

It's interesting what people feel must be said here in the name of "saving" people, or commenting on the smallest mentions of something that is disagreed with.

JR,

"ever since I did my 90 Day Juice Fast in 1994, I have weighed every BM since then"


A bit obsessive, don't you think?

maybe give that particular exercise a rest, JR, haven't you learned enough about your digestive system?

takes the joy out of it, methinks.

chris and I agreeing on something is a bit unsettling.

fresh Wrote:

> It's interesting what people feel must be said
> here in the name of "saving" people, or commenting
> on the smallest mentions of something that is
> disagreed with.

True, but it's also necessary to remember that we are pioneers--we are pushing the envelope of what is known, and there is something to be gained with the endless bickering of what might seem now to be minutiae but turn out to be something important. If it gets people to think, it is a good thing.

We can learn from each other.

I'm sure we can all discuss our differing views on diet without insulting other peoples' diets, can't we? There are lots of ways to mention perceived shortcomings in a diet without being offensive, and likewise plenty of ways to respond to offensive posts in a pleasant manner. 

Great health is nice, but what is it really worth if we don't treat others with kindness and compassion? I'd rather be physically sick than spiritually sick, and treating others with disrespect is indeed a spiritual sickness. 

Remember...what you put out is what you get back. Do you want more kindness, compassion, peace, and love in your life, or do you want more hatred, anger, pain and strife?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2015 03:38AM by Living Food.

Quote

True, but it's also necessary to remember that we are pioneers--we are pushing the envelope of what is known, and there is something to be gained with the endless bickering of what might seem now to be minutiae but turn out to be something important. If it gets people to think, it is a good thing.

We can learn from each other.

We can learn from each other, and it's a good thing that we point out potential weaknesses in each other's diets. The problem is that some of us are letting ego enter the equation. When ego is involved, people will not accept other's constructive criticism and/or will criticize other's diets in a non-constructive way. When personal attacks become involved that should become a wake-up call and tell the perpetrator that they can do so much better.

Ego can be an awfully hard thing to rid yourself of, and some people are not at the stage where they are ready to begin that journey. Therefore, we should all strive to make our criticism as constructive and pleasant as possible so as to maintain harmony on this board. And on the flip side, those of us who find ourselves on the other end of non-constructive criticism should swallow their pride and resolve to either respond in a pleasant manner or not at all.

This is an online forum, and with that comes certain advantages. In a face-to-face argument things can become heated quickly and people may blurt out things they regret later, but you are under no compulsion to respond immediately here. If you read something and your knee-jerk reaction is to respond nastily, why don't you leave the forum and come back to post a few hours later after you've calmed down? Doing so will improve both your image (and thus the perceived validity of your message) and this forum which is unique among the entire Internet.

fresh wrote:

<<<A bit obsessive, don't you think?>>>

No, I have several good reasons why I continue to document by BMs.

By the way, do you squat when you defecate?

If you don't squat, why not?

If you do squat, how do you do it?

Do you use any of the devices on the market or have you come up with your own method to duplicate what you would do in nature?

Do you think that you are anal retentive?

Do you think that I am anal retentive?

Are you uncomfortable talking about BMs?

Have you read “Scatalogic Rites of All Nations” by Captain John G. Bourke?

Have you read "The Portable Scatalog" edited by Louis Kaplan?

Here is a small snippet from “Scatalogic Rites of All Nations” for those who are NOT anal retentive...

Introduction: Seeking the German Toilet and Finding the French

Slovenian philosopher Slavoj Zizek begins his book, The Plague of Fantasies, with a comparison of three cultures -- French, German, and Anglo-American -- in terms of their toilets. In the German toilet the hole is in the front with a platform in the back, "so that the sh-it is first laid out for us to sniff at and inspect for traces of some illness."2 The hole and the platform of the French toilet are reversed, in order for the sh-it to "disappear as soon as possible." In between these two cultural metaphors -- those of the German need to confront one's own waste and the French unwillingness to acknowledge its presence -- stands the Anglo-American toilet: "the basin is full of water, so that the sh-it floats in it -- visible, but not to be inspected." For more than a century American culture has been vacillating back and forth within this dichotomy, never so neatly as to be decidedly on either side ["French" or "German"], but it has always been interested in sh-it...at a safe distance.

>By the way, do you squat when you defecate?

both. works either way.

>No, I have several good reasons why I continue to document by BMs.

perhaps you do, or perhaps you wish to say that you did something for X years. quite stunning to me that you think it necessary for that long.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2015 04:33AM by fresh.

[squattypotty.com]

[www.youtube.com]

John Rose Wrote:
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> [squattypotty.com]
>
> [www.youtube.com]

This thread is getting pretty good, I must say. I loved the youtube animation, John Rose (even the music)! So here's one advantage for a small woman: We can just squat on the seat. ....Eat your hearts out, big guys!

Also, I liked the conversation between arugula ("we are pioneers - we are pushing the envelope of what is known" ) and Living Food ("we can learn from each other" ).

Yes, I agree.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2015 07:10AM by suncloud.

[Slovenian philosopher Slavoj Zizek]

Have you seen what he has to say about vegetarians?

<<<Have you seen what he has to say about vegetarians?>>>

Oh arugula,

Thanks for starting my day off with a smile!

[www.youtube.com]
[...simple solution to eliminate those in Power...]

[www.critical-theory.com]

Living Food & suncloud,

Thanks for your positive contributions!!!

Quote

well... I had cooked beets yesterday. Wasn't so bad. I think perhaps cooking some food if you dont have the ferments in order might be useful

I may catch some flak for this, but if you aren't fermenting or juicing them, most vegetables *should* be eaten cooked. Nobody should be eating raw beets or broccoli as they are, because they have lots of harsh indigestible fiber. Some people may do well on them for awhile, but in the long term they are harming themselves imo.

Lots of the vegetables around these days are unnatural hybrids and completely unsuitable for eating without being processed first. Fermenting and juicing can negate a lot of their drawbacks, but not all of them and both have their own weak points - as does cooking, which I'm sure everyone on this board is aware of.

Quote

Thanks for the tip Living Food, on how to make ferments with vinegar

Glad to help. Warmth and acidity both enhance fermentation.

Quote

Living Food & suncloud,

Thanks for your positive contributions!!!

Thank you John. This is the kind of thing the forum could use a lot more of. Instead of insulting the things about others we don't like, why don't we praise the things we do like? What you focus on is what you get, and if you are constantly focusing on the negative in people you will just bring out more of it. If you focus on the positive, you will bring out more of that. It is well documented that praising people when they do something good produces far better results than criticizing them when they do something bad.

It also happens to produce a far more positive and enjoyable environment

John Rose Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> [www.youtube.com]
> [...simple solution to eliminate those in
> Power...]
>
> [www.critical-theory.com]
> -song-waiting/

heh heh!

It's an uncanny impersonation, if you ask me.

When later question, he professed to have some sympathies with vegetarians. But as per usual, not enough to start eating like them.

Quote

IMO physical health is a requirement to spiritual health, and vice versa.

To a very large degree it is, but there are some exceptions. Some people are very spiritual although physically ill, and many people are physically healthy (according to societies' standards) but very spiritually ill. But true health always corresponds with increased spirituality, because in most cases they are inextricably tied. By true health I mean the amazing levels of well-being that almost no one on this planet experiences. When life becomes like a dream, when you have inexhaustible energy and good spirits 24/7 and your 6th sense starts working and life seems too good to be true. That is when your light really starts to shine.

Quote

But then again.. the words we are using can also convolute things if we don't get what the writer is trying to convey.

You're right...it's so simple a concept to me, but not very easy to explain. I could go very deep with all of this and write many long posts on it, but I wouldn't be able to explain it any better than I've tried to do here.



----------
Increased spirituality can improve your health, and increased health can improve your spirituality. Once you reach a certain level of health than spirituality definitely becomes involved, and I would think it's usually the same with increases in spirituality leading to better health. But I also think there are cases of very spiritual individuals who nonetheless go through ill health as a form of test. It is through trial and adversity that we are given the option of bettering ourselves, and if life was perfect there would be no spiritual advancement because we wouldn't have any trials or temptations to test our mettle and overcome them. Because of that we will always have trials and temptations until we have perfected ourselves, but we should rejoice in these opportunities for advancement instead of raging against them.

Quote

I was referring more to the sprouts like bean sprouts. i just don't have the willpower to eat them sometimes.

It does require discipline at first, but it will become easier with time.

Note: from here on my post becomes way waaayyyy too long

Quote

So then I start to think... that life must be all an illusion, and that nobody is "real" but I'll still be judged in the end... so Ill usually fall back to something... I'm really starting to think I'm really the only one here and everyone else is just probably living in their own alternate versions of reality if not in parallel universes and so what I get of these other 'personalities' are a result of their relation to my own existence... kind of hard to explain right now. But it seems as if everyone is like.... in a higher dimension than me and they are just like, mediums I guess.

We all live in different worlds

We may all live on one planet, but each of us lives in our own separate world. My neighbor may live 50 feet from my front door, yet his world may be a Hell of darkness and despair whereas mine is a Heaven of light and joy. Geographically, we live in the same area. But spiritually we dwell on completely different planes of existence. You can alter your world by altering your thoughts. You can elevate yourself to a higher plane of existence by thinking kind, compassionate and selfless thoughts, or sink to lower and baser planes of existence by thinking envious, angry or selfish thoughts. Joy and serenity will take you upward towards the light, whereas despair, sadness and fear will blanket you with ever-deeper darkness. We all see the world differently depending on the veils of karma that cover our eyes, and most people will remain blindly at the whim of their personal karma because they are blinded to it...they know not that spiritual laws govern the Universe, and that the maxim "for every action there is an opposite reaction" applies to the subtle as well as the gross physical realms. The blessing given to those on the spiritual path is that, through diligent effort, we may work to remove the veils of karma, stripping away layer by layer, until finally the glorious light of the Creator is revealed to us once more.

Storm: You live in darkness right now, but you can change that by changing your perspective. Right now you are focusing on the dark and the negative, so of course that is what is being drawn into your life. If you would only begin to focus on the good and the pure, you would be astounded at the difference in your life. If you truly believe that the world is a dark place, why make it darker yet by contributing to that darkness with your own negative thoughts and emotions? Why not elevate your thoughts and thus enact a real and concrete change upon your world, a change for the better? Just for 30 seconds a day, find a quite place to sit down and resolve to only think positive thoughts - you could think of how blessed you are to have the health knowledge that you do, or feel grateful that you have all four limbs intact, or even just think "it sure is a nice day today." I'm sure you can come up with negative rebuttals to all of the things I listed above, but actively practice NOT doing that for just those 30 seconds. That's it, just 30 second without a negative thought. Does that sound doable?

After you've made it 30 seconds thinking only good, pure, clean, and positive thoughts, increase the time to 35 seconds the next day. The day after that, 40 seconds. Each day that you can make it the full time without a single negative thought, do the exercise for 5 seconds longer the next day. If you find yourself unable to make it the full time without letting negativity creep in, stay at that amount of time until it becomes easy for you and then continue to increase by 5 second intervals.


The above is just an example. If you can go faster, than increase by 10 or 15 second intervals etc. if you have to go slower, increase by 4 or 3 or 2 second intervals. It doesn't matter; the important thing is that you are actively doing something to improve your mental attitude, which will improve your entire world.

Now, you might be thinking that I'm crazy, and that there's no way that just thinking good thoughts for 30 seconds a day can change your life. Well, I'm telling you exactly that. If you started tomorrow with 30 seconds a day and did an extra 5 seconds a day, by the end of this year you would be spending 30 minutes every day thinking nothing but elevating thoughts which would increase your vibration and saturate your environment with positive energy. And that is more than enough to change your entire day into a great one, which would indeed make your entire life great. A life is made up of days, and days are made up of hours, and hours are made up of minutes. Every single minute counts. Every single minute you are either elevating or debasing yourself based on the thoughts you think, the words you say and the deeds you do. 30 minutes a day leads to over 10,000 minutes a year of happiness and gratitude, which will start to spill over into every other waking moment and bring joy and tranquility into your life.

Focus on good thoughts, focus on good diet, and leave the negativity and Illuminati garbage at the front door. None of that is doing you any good, so throw it away!!!