KFCA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NuNat:I think you're overstating Norman LaLanne's
> obituary. Let's not go overboard. If you search
> Norman LaLanne SF Gate Obituary, his San Francisco
> Chronicle Obit will come up. From his photo,
> probably late 1940ties-early 50ties---notice the
> hat---he looked a lot like Jack.

KFCA, I don't know about out there but in my neck of the woods most obits use very old pictures. Around here they print whatever photos the family submits.

Here's Jack's brother's...

[www.sfgate.com]

Maybe they were both in that raw food love cult that Braggs was in. Brotherhood of the source and their rock and roll band and utopian vision. Good source family and you see Braggs was in it





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/22/2015 10:00PM by coconutcream.

SueZ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Well one thing is for sure - all that soy did not
> turn him into a woman. So many, these days, fear
> soy hormones will do that to men. Always did seem
> like pretty silly notion to me.

Various sprouted foods are loaded with hormones (phytoestrogens) and they do have a very positive effect and are not dangerous like many say they are. A man will develop a deeper and stronger voice, develop a better muscle tone and will never have problems of a sexual nature. I have never developed breasts or feminine traits at all.

I recently prescibed certain sprouts to cure my friend's erection problem. He has been very run down and in a very low mood and his hormones were all off. The second question l asked was "how's your erection"?...it's a very telling symptom of when things are really bad. He is getting better, but he is still not doing what he really needs to build him up properly, so he needs to be careful. It's no wonder so mmany men get problems when they are over 40, they eat lousy diets devoid of the nutrients and phytochemicals needed.

www.thesproutarian.com

Erectile dysfunction is a disease that is so common among SAD eaters but so easy to solve with sprouts and raw food.

RawPracticalist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Erectile dysfunction is a disease that is so
> common among SAD eaters but so easy to solve with
> sprouts and raw food.

Yes, and l hear men are suffering this problem at younger ages now. Why? Imo it is depression, medications, stress,chemicals, radiation and SAD diet. + men are now devoping man boobs. Men are becoming less like men and women are becoming less like women...men and women are confused these days on many levels and are homogenising, and it looks like this homogenising goes far deeper than most dare think (mind control by entities), but l better not dare talk about it here because the conversation would be very dark and disturbing.

I will just say that mankind is in a lot of trouble, and raw veganism is not near enough to put people on the path to dealing with this physical and spiritual mess they are in.

www.thesproutarian.com

"Probably he would not do so if he knew the newer negative research on animal proteins"

Do you have evidence of this?

elevated igf-1 and methionine allegedly. for starters.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> elevated igf-1 and methionine allegedly. for
> starters.


I mean actual scientific evidence linking animal proteins to harmful health effects?

if true, as greger reports, that is evidence.
X increases Y, elevated Y - harmful effects
x = protein
y = igf-1, methionine

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> if true, as greger reports, that is evidence.
> X increases Y, elevated Y - harmful effects
> x = protein
> y = igf-1, methionine


So is that protein in general or specifically animal protein? Not everyone who eats animal products eats excess protein.

you would need to look at some of his reports - easy to find.

interestingly i just found out based on a study he referenced (you may know this already) that when higher protein is ingested, yes calcium excretion raises, but they tagged it and determined it was not coming from the body/bones, it was coming from the food. i had never heard that before.

KFCA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No, SuzE, I can't say that I've ever run across a
> Health & Wellness Guru that I've felt had a
> legitimate backstory to tell. Maybe some day.


If we're considering Jack LaLanne to be a "Health & Wellness Guru" (neither raw nor vegan), and if "guru" means "teacher", what about some of the more well-known VEGAN teachers, like Dr. Barnard, Dr. Greger, Dr. Esselstyn, Dr. Campbell, Dr. Goldhamer, Drs. Rick and Karen Dina, Brenda Davis RD, and Vesanto Melina RD?

As far as I'm aware, their backgrounds are impeccable; and for a few, their work has led to advances in science that are influencing even conventional medicine. All are vegan. Some are raw vegan or raw vegan-friendly/slowly transitioning to raw.

All have backgrounds based on "science", which is not a dirty word when it incorporates real evidence.

Maybe they're not putting their bodies on display (which may be useful to a certain extent, and for a certain audience) or claiming they have the cure for cancer. And of course we may not agree with everything they might say. Nevertheless, these good people are all health and wellness teachers who are having a significant positive impact.

They are the real deal, IMO.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 03:18AM by suncloud.

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fresh Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > elevated igf-1 and methionine allegedly. for
> > starters.
>
>
> I mean actual scientific evidence linking animal
> proteins to harmful health effects?

Look at the biggest study ever on nutrition, the China Study. All foods we eat have a gene expression effect. For example, google olive oil. The cause is found not in the constituents of food, but in the response of the body (gene expression) that makes a negative effect from eating animal products. The negative effects are cancer promotions among the worst of them. Promotion is different than original cause. Everybody has cancerous cells. There are also other effects like Fresh mentioned.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 03:19AM by Panchito.

"Look at the biggest study ever on nutrition, the China Study."

That is not a reliable study and it has lots of flaws.

"The cause is found not in the constituents of food, but in the response of the body (gene expression) that makes a negative effect from eating animal products."

Show a scientific study that directly proves any negative effects from animal protein, including from the body's response.

"All foods we eat have a gene expression effect."
"Promotion is different than original cause. Everybody has cancerous cells."

Common sense.

I already gave you a study. I won't become another victim of yours. If you don't like it, tough. Maybe other people will read it.

Panchito wrote:
"The cause is found not in the constituents of food, but in the response of the body (gene expression) that makes a negative effect from eating animal products. The negative effects are cancer promotions among the worst of them."

The funny thing is, this type of eating has been going on for awhile. Read the book "Children of the Sun" Children of the Sun, and note that this lifestyle still hasn't produced centenarians from all the people who have lived the Life.

Paul Bragg noticed the same phenomenon is his time after witnessing all the different "health" regimens going on.In his book "Healthful Eating Without Confusion" he noted that fruitarians and rawfoodists did not live long and that those who incorporated some animal foods in their diet had superior lifespan.

Is there something in animal foods we are missing in pure vegan diets? It's a nice theory for sure, but the reality doesn't pan out. As I said many times, I study longevity as the results speak for themselves. According to the above, the following would be immposible...

125 eating Wild fox and skunk meat

Daily Bacon

All Kinds of Animal Foods for Longevity

Ikaria, Goat Milk Products as well as Goat Meat

Wrinkle Meat, 137! My favorite, Wild foods lots of Wild meat

NuNativs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Paul Bragg noticed the same phenomenon is his time
> after witnessing all the different "health"
> regimens going on.In his book "Healthful Eating
> Without Confusion" he noted that fruitarians and
> rawfoodists did not live long and that those who
> incorporated some animal foods in their diet had
> superior lifespan.
>
> Is there something in animal foods we are missing
> in pure vegan diets? It's a nice theory for sure,
> but the reality doesn't pan out. As I said many
> times, I study longevity as the results speak for
> themselves. According to the above, the following
> would be immposible...



l don't think there is anything that a raw vegan diet that is lacking, l just think it is the way in which most people go about it which is potentially dangerous and certainly illogical nonsense imo. When l see people eating raw vegan diets l just cringe when l hear what their diets are. I am not surprised most will fail given what we have been taught in books and on websites. To me most people are probably stripping their bodies with these questionable vegan diets (99% of them), and now we see that most people do fail on them which leads me to believe my intuition on this is possibly correct that most vegan diets will smash people into the ground.

Also, l feel people get into veganism when they aren't ready (most).

www.thesproutarian.com

[www.rawfoodsupport.com]

TSM, have you read "Children of the Sun" or "Heathlful Eating Without Confusion"? In COTS, the people were eating super healthy diets and living close to nature where there was little pollution and great soil, yet had appaling longevity given their purity.

In Braggs book, he noticed the same thing probably why he regularly ate burgers. I expected to see amazing lifespan from those who went the "Dietary Distance" but am so far confused and disappointed at the results.

Sure, one can force themselves to eat any diet, but LONGIVITY speaks volumes in ny opinion. "Living" 70 years on sprouts is a failure.

WHY is Viktoras lossing his eyesight when has talked endlessly about the regeneration possible on a spouted vegan diet?

Do you see the disconnect?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 05:28AM by NuNativs.

>WHY is Viktoras lossing his eyesight when has talked endlessly about the regeneration possible on a spouted vegan diet?

I personally do not know Viktoras and have not read his books, but eating sprouts is not enough. You have to be totally engaged in the diet, life style, cleansing, thinking, drinking, rest, and many others. It is not enough the sing the virtues of the diet, you have to live it. Some think a specific green will heal them, that is not possible.

[www.globalpost.com]

RP said:
"It is not enough the sing the virtues of the diet, you have to live it."

I know of VK and he has lived it plenty on all levels more than most would endure. We need to be brave enough to acknowledge failure in the theory...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 05:49AM by NuNativs.

[www.flickr.com]

nunativs are you going to change your whole philosophy based on all those long lived veg/vegans? or is it back to the bacon?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 06:07AM by fresh.

NuNativs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TSM, have you read "Children of the Sun" or
> "Heathlful Eating Without Confusion"? In COTS, the
> people were eating super healthy diets and living
> close to nature where there was little pollution
> and great soil, yet had appaling longevity given
> their purity.
>
> In Braggs book, he noticed the same thing probably
> why he regularly ate burgers. I expected to see
> amazing lifespan from those who went the "Dietary
> Distance" but am so far confused and disappointed
> at the results.



What you call "super healthy diets" and what l call "super healthy diets" are likely two completely different things. I see very few diets in the raw vegan world as super healthy, and to me most diets are medicore at best, and it seems like people largely get mediocre results from these mediocre robot diets also. Surprisingly some do well living on mediocrity, but most don't.


>
> WHY is Viktoras lossing his eyesight when has
> talked endlessly about the regeneration possible
> on a spouted vegan diet?

Could be his increased needs for fatty acids, could be various reasons. Imo Vik isn't doing things as well as he could be, possibly.

A sprout diet is no guarantee of success. It is important to be able to tailor a sproutarian diet to one's individual needs, same goes with these other vegan diets, but no-one gets taught that, they get taught to eat high fruit diets like common robots, and people wonder why people fall off the wagon and get sick.

>
> Do you see the disconnect?

No.

www.thesproutarian.com

When you are not eating meat or fish and every food is washed and cleaned, you have to be careful in covering all of your nutritional requirements and also have a good working digestive system.
The mistakes some make is that they read the scientific literature of the value of a particular food like wheatgrass or kale and they would think eating that alone will bring miracle cure to their body. It is not enough.
We have damaged the body for so many years it takes a lot dedication and attention to details to cover all of the bases. It takes me a lot of effort growing the greens the sprouts, at least 30 minutes in the morning making juices and smoothies, same in the evening. Plus the gym, working with the sun, the water, the earth, the air.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2015 12:35PM by RawPracticalist.

The Sproutarian Man Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NuNativs Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > TSM, have you read "Children of the Sun" or
> > "Heathlful Eating Without Confusion"? In COTS,
> the
> > people were eating super healthy diets and
> living
> > close to nature where there was little
> pollution
> > and great soil, yet had appaling longevity
> given
> > their purity.
> >
> > In Braggs book, he noticed the same thing
> probably
> > why he regularly ate burgers. I expected to see
> > amazing lifespan from those who went the
> "Dietary
> > Distance" but am so far confused and
> disappointed
> > at the results.
>
>
>
> What you call "super healthy diets" and what l
> call "super healthy diets" are likely two
> completely different things. I see very few diets
> in the raw vegan world as super healthy, and to me
> most diets are medicore at best, and it seems like
> people largely get mediocre results from these
> mediocre robot diets also. Surprisingly some do
> well living on mediocrity, but most don't.
>
>
> >
> > WHY is Viktoras lossing his eyesight when has
> > talked endlessly about the regeneration
> possible
> > on a spouted vegan diet?
>
> Could be his increased needs for fatty acids,
> could be various reasons. Imo Vik isn't doing
> things as well as he could be, possibly.
>
> A sprout diet is no guarantee of success. It is
> important to be able to tailor a sproutarian diet
> to one's individual needs, same goes with these
> other vegan diets, but no-one gets taught that,
> they get taught to eat high fruit diets like
> common robots, and people wonder why people fall
> off the wagon and get sick.
>
> >
> > Do you see the disconnect?
>
> No.


you put down other diets a lot, yet your results are not so great.

yes, one must be careful with any diet. if so, then no need to put down other diets, since your diet is not automatic/easy/perfect.

Never mind me, l have always run down other diets since studying the sproutarian diet 20 years ago. None-the-less, l have greatly matured and mellowed, because these days my views are much more reasonable and rounded, and acknowledging that the best diet is the one which works best for the individual. But true, l do run down other diets, ALOT!

www.thesproutarian.com

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> [www.flickr.com]
> 2157626391925933/

[www.flickr.com]

nunativs biased?

Wow. You jump from fruitarian to eating animals. Aren't you aware that there is a huge gap in your thinking? From just common sense, you could add for example beans instead of animals.

NuNativs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The funny thing is, this type of eating has been
> going on for awhile. Read the book "Children of
> the Sun" Children of the Sun, and note that this
> lifestyle still hasn't produced centenarians from
> all the people who have lived the Life.
>
> Paul Bragg noticed the same phenomenon is his time
> after witnessing all the different "health"
> regimens going on.In his book "Healthful Eating
> Without Confusion" he noted that fruitarians and
> rawfoodists did not live long and that those who
> incorporated some animal foods in their diet had
> superior lifespan.