HELP ME!!
I have been in Transition for the last 2 years...
I started a daily log to help myself be accountable...
I was raw for about 15 days...

Old habits die hard...
I go all day raw but when at home in the evening or on weekends I cannot Stop eating grains - bread, cereal and the like with nut butters...



I fill up on fruit...

Yesterday I had:


a smoothie

8 celery stalks (supposedlyu the best sodium replacer)
3 banana's
3 asian
10 sharon fruit (like persimmons)
8 zucchini (spiralized to look, texture of angel hair pasta)
tomatoe sauce (dried tomatoes, fresh tomatoes, cilantro, dates, garlic, salt)

Seems to be too spicy for me now...I have 1 more jar of it in the fridge may throw it out!
pears

I was physically FULL but caved in about 10pm and ate:
Ate my husbands cereal (2 bowls) with almond milk (chocolate),
ate quinoa (2 cups),
ate a few wraps with sunflower seed butter and jam
then came back and had another bowl of my daughters cereal


The other day (weekend) I had an all day binge I mean NASTY sick to my stomach, but I just cannot stop until I feel sick!!

I NEED OEA but the n ight it's offered does not work for me!!

Please help me...you will only understand if you've been here, my friends and husband do not understand why I do this..

I know all the psycho reasons...
BLA BLA BLA...
I know, I know

I need strategies to deal with it!!

help!

Seems like you miss the sensation of being 'full' on cooked food. It's a mind dulling experience that some might even say is relaxing. Emotional bingers often don't know what to do with all of the energy that they have, and they try to tone it down by binging on cooked food.

Also, I don't know how active you are or not, but you didn't seem to get all that many calories during your raw day.

There are many, many different possibilities here. The best thing to do is go on being raw, and let it happen a number of times, where you binge, before you finally realize you don't need to do it anymore. Everyone goes through it. I did..... and I made it through.

Best,
Mark

i know the feeling of binge eating. for myself, i'll just try to grab a handful of chips or a bite of something cooked. that usually helps my cravings. i do eat alot of nuts which are high in fat. is that a good idea?

I hear you. Somewhere between 'binging' and being VERY comfortable consistently....THAT is yoru level. Be honest with that....and stretch from there. Set your VERY small goals....that you are prepared and willing and MOTIVATED to do every day....and work with those.

-You WILL succeed! Don't hold yourself to some guru's (or even what your own brains) idea of what you SHOULD be doing! LOL.

-David Z. Mason

it's great to hear encouragement. does anybody know how much "raw" fat is good to eat daily? maybe eating more will help binging? but how much is too much?

well rawrnr-i don't know if this matters but you are an exercise instructor. I have read your journal...i would eat everything in site that was not bolted down if i had your activity level.running 14 miles one day and pump class and spin class and all u do is so amazing.i don't know if this has anything to do with it.for u to be writing that u are eating too much must not be the norm for you.to me-i would be eating just like u do...if i did all u do.It seems for the most part like alot of raw and healthy foods.taylor

Is it just me who doesn't feel bad bingeing on healthy food like quinoa? It makes a change from bingeing on chocolate for me!

I have a bag of that quinoa that i just got and i was going to follow the recipe in that raw cookbook by Juliano...i don't even know what the stuff taste like.it must be good.

"A heart thats full up like a landfill"

You are not alone
David's right.... especially about your mind. Why would you want to listen to your mind when it's wrong, anyway?

rawrnr,

You might want to play with mono eating, like Uma and other on this forum are playing with, or on Doug's forum on vegsource, others are playing with also. To have an experience of what it feels like to be completely satiated on just one food, buy a case of bananas and let them ripen. Then, eat only bananas until you are full. And if you get hungry again, eat only bananas until you are full. Do this for a week and see if anything shifts for you. You might find that for the first time in your raw life, that you are completely satiated and without the desire for food.

I'm not an emotional binger but I did enjoy Victoria Boutenko's book 12 Steps to raw- she used to be an emotional eater and her book is written with that in mind. Maybe you'd find that it speaks to you?

rawrnr,

Here are some articles that might help you with emotional eating:

Nora Lenz's "Are We All 'Emotional Eaters'?"

My very own "Success on the raw foods diet"

Bryan -- Your advice works. I ate only OJ for two weeks and I had little desire to eat, insane energy etc. It was amazing. Unfortunately I haven't been able to do that again -- that was in June I believe. The day I gave in and had salad all hell broke loose... The next day I wanted everything! To this day I want everything. I'm good at work when I have my food layed out; OJ, smoothie, veggie juice, etc. But when I get home and have options, that's when I do myself damage. Or when I don't take the time to prepare anything: pre-washing, juicing, etc until I am really hungry. Than I grab the quickest and most nutrient dense food, nuts, dried fruit, bananas. The things I know to be the least healthy.

RawSun,

Read Uma's thread Mono Mission. She talks about having a similar sense of satiation that you described. Perhaps you can join her group of people who are playing with this right now.

I know what it feels like to eat and eat and be so physically full I feel several months pregnant, but still want more because something isn't satisfied!

Playing with mono-eating is helping me feel more satiation when I eat so I can feel like I got what i needed without having to stuff in so much volume! I am still new to it but so far I am liking the experience, and gradually starting to experience less emotional binge eating.

Love,
Uma

Dear Rawrnr,

I've had a lot of trouble with overeating in the past, but I'm doing very well these days.

For me what really helped was to be realistic and work toward a steady diet that I could sustain, so that I could develop a healthy HABIT of eating less.

Developing that HABIT is KEY. You can do that on raw. In fact for me I found it much easier to do it on raw than on cooked. But I had to make some compromises at least in the beginning. Monoeating may be healthy for the short term, but even if it is healthy for the long term, a person who is overeating now is probably not ready to SUSTAIN that radical a change. You can't develop a HABIT if you're doing something that you can't sustain.

You mostly need to work on a routine, just like with exercise, so that you can develop the habit of eating less. And those much maligned villains - nuts and seeds - will help you do that.

I unfortunately spent many long years on the approach of eating bananas or oranges to fill myself up, and then repeating that every time I got hungry again. In my experience, overeating ANY food, even the healthiest food is exactly the WRONG approach for a habitual overeater, because the problem is overeating, and that's what you have to get over. In the end, I would just binge on some cooked vegan grain food, because I was a habitual overeater. And I had a lot of space to fill (emotional as well as physical) because I'd filled it so many times before with a lot of bananas and a lot of oranges.

Emotion might be a route cause, but the cure comes from the knowledge that YOU are in the driver's seat. Focus on the cure.

Here's what I did to get into a routine of eating less:

I began by drawing a line in the sand, and never went beyond vegan.

I stopped being afraid to eat nuts and seeds. You will probably find you have a lot more control if you allow yourself to eat SMALL AMOUNTS of nuts, seeds and avocado. And it's not JUST the fat. Eating only avocados for your source of fat will not do it. Eat some nuts and/or seeds in addition to (or instead of) avocados. Limit their consumption (you will probably find you will not need a lot), but accept that at least for now, you will eat them every day that you want them. And eat at least just a little of them in the MORNING or early noon. That way, your body's desires (right or wrong) won't be building up on you all day long until you finally lose control and you're powerless to stop yourself from raiding the kitchen.

I began to eat dessert - raw style. After most meals I eat some sweet fruit, either an orange or a few dates, and that's my signal that I'm done. Then I go brush my teeth. By the time I finish brushing my teeth, I'm not hungry.

I started eating seaweed with my salads. Mostly dulse.

I recognized that I might binge regardless, so I kept vegetables in the house at all times. Then when I just HAD to eat something cooked, I'd steam my vegetables instead of eating pasta or rice or tofu (or in your case, cereal). That worked really well for me. Sometimes I'd put my steamed vegetables on a big salad. You can come up with your own thing, but it should be a vegetable, not a grain.

I realized that a meal like that was NOT terribly unhealthy - at least NOT COMPARED TO OVEREATING. You don't have to have the attitude that if you eat a few cooked peas, you might as well eat a chocolate cake. Even Arnold Ehret said something to the effect that,"a meateater who only eats a little can live a long and healthy life, an overeater - never".

Once I was able to control my overeating, I could let go of my steamed vegetable crutch.

And now I'm finally at the point to where I'm moving more toward 80/10/10. But I'm not giving up my seeds and nuts. I'm soaking or sprouting them, and that will give me much the same vitamin and mineral content, but less fat. I wasn't ready to do that a year ago.

One other thing just to remind you. Try never to get angry at yourself or blame yourself. You can never know all the forces at work in the Universe. It's not always your fault. Just try to focus on learning what you can.

I find EFT helps. Get the manual at www.emofree.com or get The No-Grain Diet Book by Dr. Joseph Mercola. Skip the actual diet part and just read the chapters about using EFT for cravings.

EFT stands for emotional freedom technique and if you work with it, you can overcome cravings related to emotional eating.

Exercise can help too. A quick spurt of exercise often gets rid of the craving. Sometimes I'll just run with the dog to the end of our property and back. Just takes a minute and the craving's gone.

I don't know how you feel about using healing mushrooms but reishi provides a lot of amino acids which are often missing when the brain has cravings. It can be taken in supplements or tea. According to Julia Ross there are little spaces where amino acids need to be and people who crave food just need to fill these. According to her book supplementing with amino acids will fix this within 24 hours. I discovered this by accident by using reishi and later read the book which explained it. I don't believe much in supplementation but reishi is in a category of its own and I'd consider it to be a food product but it's classified as a herb. I use a reishi/rooibus tea mixture that seems to supress the appetite slightly as well.

Sharon

Hi rawrnr,

I'd just like to add that monoeating could probably be part of a realistic and healthy routine if it's for just one or two meals during the day on a regular basis, rather than trying to monoeat just one thing all day long each and every day.

Do your own experimenting, but try to keep in mind that if you try something over and over again, and it doesn't work well for you, don't just blame yourself and keep on trying it. That could really put you into an emotionally dangerous cycle of low self-esteem. It's probably not your fault. You just need to try something new.

taylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have a bag of that quinoa that i just got and i
> was going to follow the recipe in that raw
> cookbook by Juliano...i don't even know what the
> stuff taste like.it must be good.


I didn't find sprouted Quinoa to be anything special. It's ok, but my biggest issue with it was that I don't seem to be able to digest it, maybe my system is too fast for it now?
I don't know, maybe thats normal.

Phil.

--------------------------------------------------

"Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it" (Chinese Proverb)

Thank you all for your responses...

I have tried the mono eating - eating 8,9,10 banana's wrapped in romaine in ONE sitting....then following it with bread or grains - I am a terrible ADDICT!!

I am a workout freak - I teach fitness classes and am training for a marathon.

I did the high nut thing...I cannot have them in my house!
I overeat nuts!!! I cannot stop almonds. I overeat seeds!
I have NO CONTROL!!


My INSANE work out schedule keeps me from REALLY blowing up, but I have gained 12 pounds since November!


I have been playing with raw for 2 years - always failing and binging on a weekly basis - it seems this drive for me to be raw has just made this disordered eating worse!

I do like the idea of steaming veggies....

Thank you all for your time and responses

rawrnr,

10 bananas might not be enough if you are doing such a high level of exercise. Dr Graham is also very physically active, and he eats 3500 calories a day. This is something like 35 bananas a day.

Its worthwhile to use the nutritional calculators to input your raw intake, and see if the calorie intake matches what you perceive your calorie burn to be. You may simply not be eating enough raw foods. For example rather than 10 bananas, you might need 15 because you are so active. Also after each workout, you may need to replenish your sugar supplies, so another snack or meal is necessary for you. Please look at fitday or nutridiary or nutritiondata to measure your raw intake and see if you are getting enough calories based on your activity level.

Hi Brian I feel so blessed to have you here - you know so much!!


I had 10 banana's in ONE sitting - 10 with 3 heads of Romaine!

THis did not include breakfast, dinner and snacks!

That was not for the whole day, I have been tracking my intake on Fitday - I actually bought the program!

I eat about 2500-3200 a day!!! Binging - I tracked it Sunday, was 3800 calorioes!!!

Eating too lttle is NOT a probelm, quite the opposite....

I fill up on fruit LOTS of it - AKA Graham, I am physically full, even uncomfortable full, but I still manage to get in 3-4 wraps covered in sunflower seed butter and jam!

I drive home every day 100% raw, go through the scenario in my head how I will NOT eat cooked, will NOT binge...but every tiime I walk in the door...that is what happens, sure I can put it off, and sometimes I do...until 9-10pm,,there I go PIG OUT and once I have one piece of anything grain basted THAT"S IT - I cannot stop!!!

I ma very down on my body image - I teach Physical education and fitness classes, I see myself as a walking ad for health and fitness, but now I see myself as a failure...
Funny thing is, I was leaner as a vegan once I began to make beans and pulses my primary food...my leanest actyally 120pounds - I am usually 128 currently I weight 142!!

People know I am on a raw (weird) diet and they are seeing me get BIGGER!!
OH I've had many comments from students and staff!!


PS IT IS NOT MUSCLE!!!

raw sun, sorry for this : what is the meaning of '' OJ''
thanks

Orange juice I believe

Yes OJ is orange juice

Thanks Bryan, I did just reread Uma's thread on mono eating, and now I know that I should give it a try.

Uma, do you eat only solids when mono eating, or do you ever drink juice instead?

I'm a juice fan, it's easiest to drink while I am at work. I usually drink Orange juice at around 11, then another juice, either veggie, or fruit or fruit followed with veggie at 3. Then I have dinner -- usually salad at 6. I find it hard to eat my veggies if they are not juiced or in salad - with fat in the dressing (oil or nuts).
After dinner I usually loose control.

Dear Rawrnr,

I'm so sorry to hear you're going through all this. I think you need to do whatever you can to regain control.

Probably staying away from cooked grains COMPLETELY is a good idea. I can't eat even a teaspoonful of any cooked grain without going wild. I've heard that something in cooked grains has a chemical effect that actually stimulates your body's appetite response. It sure does that for me.

I've had great success with sprouted wheat - a grain of course, but so different raw. I soak it overnight, then rinse and drain it for another night. If I really have appetite, I can eat sprouted wheat with avocado, followed by a few dates or an orange. An alternative that's not quite as good, but still acceptable is raw wheat germ (prepackaged). It's good on salad and really helps squelch the appetite, and it satiates the desire for cooked grain.

It's just possible - but of course I don't know for sure - that one reason you may tend to eat too much nuts or seeds (when you do happen to eat them) is that you deny yourself for too long. Then when you do eat them, your body says, "Wow, this is something I don't get to have very often, so I better scarf it up". I realize that's just a possibility, because I have no idea how often you eat them. But if it's nearly never, then the possibility is worth a thought.

You're in a vicious cycle: You know you tend to overeat so you try to eat only the light watery foods. But by eating ONLY the light foods, even eating a LOT of light foods, your body gets hungrier and hungrier until *BOOM* - you're in the kitchen eating your kid's cereal. Then you have to make up for it so you try to eat only light foods again ..........and on and on.

IMPORTANT: Instead of eating a LOT of something light for as long as you possibly can on any given day, try eating a LITTLE of something heavier (raw) earlier on in the day. Doesn't have to be the first meal, but maybe the second meal. Follow it up with some sweet fruit, then MAKE yourself go brush your teeth. Don't think about it, just do it.

You will have to PRACTICE moderation to learn it. Give yourself some regular opportunity to practice it when you know you won't go wild, like on a lunch break at work, or just before a workout. That's a good opportunity to eat just a little, so try eating just a few nuts or some sprouted grain along with your fruits and/or veggies. You will be less inclined to splurge the next time you eat.

I'd say try modifying your diet in whatever way will help you gain more control. If eating steamed veggies helps you, then do that whenever you feel you want to, but not JUST that. Avoid extremes.

I'm talking moderation here. Moderation is a good thing. I'm not even talking SAD moderation. I'm talking moderation on a raw food diet. That can't hurt you.

If you don't practice moderation, you'll never learn it. That means not too much, not too little, of ANYTHING. Sounds hard, but with practice, observation, and an open mind, it can be done. When you find you just can't help but overeat, try not to blame yourself or think of yourself as a failure. Try to consciously replace that thought with the thought that you just have more to learn, and then try to figure out what it is you're supposed to learn. That's probably one big, big reason we're here on the planet - to learn. As long as we know we have more to learn, we're on the right track, and we're not a failure - we're a success. Anytime we think we know it all, that's the only real failure.

hello rawsun,
my name is laura and i have the same problem as you. i know exactly what you are going through. it's very hard to overcome it. i wish i had words of wisdom but i do understand you.

Thank you all fo rthe thoughtful replies....

I will take the advice (it is wonderful)

I will try to replavce this habit w iht other ones...

I will try to let myself feel instead of numb

I cannot stand sprouted grains! I made a few breads from Alissa's book a few years back when I first started - YUK!!

I will try to keep away from them and maybe add some stemed veggies!\

I AM in a viciou and my body is paying BIG TIME! I just had a 100% raw day today

AND I feel bloated and gross, like there is a brick in my stomach!

LISTEN to my body!!

Thank you all

I don't see why people want to blame this kind of thing on emotions. If you are coming from a lifetime of cooked starches as is the case for most of the people on this planet, it's not always going to be easy to make the transition. Some are more successful than others.

Further, I think it would be very difficult to consume double my current kcal load on a low fat raw f+v diet. I consume massive amounts of f+v as it is and my activity level is considerably lower than yours.

Maybe instead of aming for 100% raw, you could still keep your cooked starches and aim for more raw, gradually increasing your raw and gradually decreasing your starches until you find the point that you can sustain without binges. Also you can experiment with nongrain starches such as sweet potato, winter squash, or cooked sweets like beets (delicious!) etc. They are not so unhealthy and better than grains.

YES I guess I could, BUT i've been transitioning for 2 YEARS!!

I did the dehydrated stint,
I did the juice/Master cleansing (4 times)
I was 100 % (with dehydrated foods) in the past...the beginning of my journey

I do not want dehydrated foods any more - they are unappealling to me, so much so that I threw out most of what I made...

Sprouted graind are GROSS IMO

I will maybe add steamed veggies such as broccoli and maybe peas and yams back in and see...

Maybe it is not emotional, but it sure is HABIT - not hunger!