Anyone have the courage to support/respond to these statements?

since my posts are not part of the "indulgence" of TSM.

-> Does the sproutarian man recommend that all of the fruit, veggie, potatoes, rice transportation cease around the world? Should all the people of the world simply survive on sprouts and seaweed? what about those not near seaweeds ?

-> How are pregnant moms, children, athletes to thrive on the sproutarian diet? Is this diet generally applicable or just for the sedentary spiritual type? and if so, of what use is it?

-> show the data indicating the phytonutrient comparison between sprouts and other veggies and fruits.

--> "all the store bought fruit available is ACIDIC in the body." (paraphrasing)

PROVE IT.

the below is just extra credit.
---------------------------------------


"clement is the brains of the raw food sproutarian movement and has finally given full credibility to this way of eating. At last we have the science and 55 years clinical research to prove that the sproutarian diet is the most health giving diet on the planet. "

3. show me one study that PROVES that the sproutarian diet is the most health giving diet on the planet. haven't seen one. money is not an excuse.



"a cheap manual wheatgrass juicer and start growing wheatgrass "

4. So crushing grass and sprouts in a machine is ok, not damaging at all? doesn't concentrate the SUGAR? and eating a whole fruit is bad because brian says so and because of alleged nutrient loss. Show the data for the nutrient losses from fruit. not the worst case scenarios, the best case scenarios. And then you must show that this inferior fruit is insufficient for human needs. SHow it or be quiet.


"big load of raw sprouts with algaes and take extra digestive enzymes"

5. so eat algae that is not fresh. and take digestive enzymes. and that is better than fresh fruit. not logical


"Sprouted organic meals don't cost much & avoiding the immoral supermarkets!"

6. no doubt farmers markets are immoral also? people making money and supporting themselves.. horrible.

"fresh food is half dead to almost dead anyway? People have been conned into thinking that store bought fruit and vegetables are good for them"

7. generalization. I often go in stores and pass on most of the foods. and yet I find enough that is good over the seasons.



"Most of these fruits and vegetables in the shops were picked days or weeks before they are sold in the shops and they lack any significant electromagnetic vibration (chi, life force)"

8. show me the difference in chi and the effect on the body.
quantify it.


"l can eat a nice nut meal that will fill me for $1. "

9. there are no nuts that are fresh and they are filled with antinutrients and are dehydrating.


"But if you want to elevate it and make the diet faultless and perfect by including sea vegetables and algaes (they have nutrients that land foods don't have, so they complement the diet perfectly and provide maximum nutrition)"

10. and yet they are not fresh.

"but these supermarkets and shops still sell these foods to humans because they simply don't care about people, they want profit and to keep their jobs at all costs. lt's time to wake up, become mostly independant and stop supporting these people. Start sprouting and send these people broke and shut them down!!! "

11. so shut down all the stores that provide food for people all around the world.
You do understand that there are humans who do not live where the produce is?

"> Even surviving on green juices, seed pastes, algaes and sea vegetables "

12.
crushing greens in a juicer is ok?
and seed pastes are not fresh.
and algaes are not going to be fresh




"Try not to keep eating fruit, this never leads to good places because you will be forever chasing your tail never feeling satisfied and just eating and eating and eating. "

13. And why is it that I am perfectly satisfied eating fruit? and i am not eating all the time? could it be that YOU didn't figure it out with the fruit available to you? and therefore nobody else can?


"kelp/dulse in flitered water"

14. not fresh

" Chlorella tablets"

15.not fresh not raw


">2 - 3 digestive enzymes"

16. why needed if the perfect diet

">Sprouted seed paste made from 5 - 6 tablespoons of sesame seeds or poppy seeds or sunflower seeds or flax seeds or a mixture, "

17. not fresh .


">That will fill you for many hours. "

18. one is not supposed to be FILLED on a raw diet, merely satisfied. I guess you never got to that point.

"One of the world’s leading bio-energetic doctors Professor Dr Valerie Hunt tested sprouted foods at UCLA in the 1970's and found that on average that sprouts like alfalfa, clover, broccoli (yes, the sprout is far more nutritious than the fully grown vegetable), sesame, sunflower, lentil, mung, adzuki, soy, fenugreek, and other soil-less sprouts are roughly 10 times as nutritious as the best freshly picked organic green vegetables such as broccoli, kale and spinach."

19. show the data. nutritious is only relevant with respect to amount of food that can be eaten and bodily needs. flooding the body with nutrients above its needs is pointless. even if sprouts are wonderful that does not mean that because something is good that it should be eaten in exclusion of everything else as there are other factors to take into account.


"I know that when l eat fruit l lack power and energy when compared to my usual sproutarian diet because the fruit is days to months old and lacks the vibrational frequency of freshly harvested food"

20. or maybe you're eating the wrong fruit.

"(fruit loses much of it’s nutrition and electrical frequency soon after it is picked from the tree)"

21. show the data


"But as soon as l eat the sea vegetables, algae and sprouts l kick into high gear straight away and never look back."

22. yes, salt can be stimulating


"the loss of enzymes, vitamins, mineral availability, phyto-nutrients, oxygen and electromagnetic vibrations (caused by an enzyme decrease), causes the food to become stripped of most of it's nutrition and electric frequency."

23. show the data

"> This results in many shop and farmers market foods lacking significant life force. Dr Hunt also tested this (electromagnetic vibration in foods) and found that plant food is virtually worthless after three weeks of being picked from the tree. "

24. show the data



"After reading hundreds of science studies on the problems associated with raw vegan foods l am left in no doubt that average raw vegans MUST be processing their foods via sprouting"

and yet here I am. And I roar. And there are others. and yet you hear nothing. but the sound of little sprouts growing.

bottom line. growing your own food is wonderful. eating only sprouts and suggesting that for all is ignorant and egotistical.

Suggesting that because here is some nutrient loss that FRUIT should not be eaten at all is ignorant.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2014 05:26PM by fresh.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> -> show the data indicating the phytonutrient
> comparison between sprouts and other veggies and
> fruits.

I will only present a few things here because you are asking me to present a lot of information, and being asked to present so many things will take a long time to do properly, that's why l will save most of the topics you ask about for my website so l only have to present the science, ideas etc once. Of course not everything can be proven by science, none-the-less, a reasonable case can still be put forward to argue certain points.


Here is a study showing that 16 sprouts have far more phyto chemicals than their vegetable counterparts, between 10 - 100 times the phyto chemical content. But, first, some highlight of the study:


Unexpectedly, 3-day-old sprouts of cultivars of certain crucifers including broccoli and cauliflower contain 10–100 times higher levels of glucoraphanin (the glucosinolate of sulforaphane) than do the corresponding mature plants


Preliminary experiments
indicated that inducer potencies (expressed per g of plant) of extracts of young sprouts of arugula, bok choy, broccoli, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, cauliflower, Chinese cabbage, collards, cress, daikon, kale, kohlrabi, mustard, turnip, and watercress ranged from 10 to 100 times those of mature field-grown plants. Similarly, in sprouts of eight broccoli cultivars, grown without exogenous nutrients, the inducer activity (nearly all of which arose from glucosinolates) per unit plant weight declined initially in an exponential manner from a maximum in the seed (Fig. 3) and continued to decline thereafter, approaching the values in mature broccoli heads after about 15 days


Notably, sprouts of many broccoli cultivars contain negligible quantities of indole glucosinolates, which predominate in the mature vegetable and may give rise to degradation products (e.g., indole-3-carbinol) that can enhance tumorigenesis. Hence, small quantities of crucifer sprouts may protect against the risk of cancer as effectively as much larger quantities of mature vegetables of the same variety


Yes...sprouts re-arrange the various phyto chemicals so the less desirable ones (in the mature vegetable plants) are greatly reduced and the most potent phyto chemicals are greatly increased. Perfect!!! Looking good for broccoli sprouts and not so good for the mature vegetable.


This is to be expected since most of the inducer activity of sprouts arises from sulforaphane, which is a monofunctional inducer (15). In contrast bifunctional inducers raise both phase 2 enzymes and certain phase 1 enzymes (cytochromes P450) via an aryl hydrocarbon receptor-dependent mechanisms


This is another great finding [above] because those enzymes are very powerful for converting harmful substances/radiation to far safer forms. Makes sprouted broccoli look a much better choice over the vegetable once again.



The dramatic quantitative differences
between the inducer potencies of young sprouts and mature crucifers grown from the same seed lots are associated with equally striking qualitative and quantitative differences in the glucosinolate profiles of these plants. Paired-ion chromatography confirmed that the major glucosinolates in mature broccoli are typically indoles: glucobrassicin, neoglucobrassicin (18, 25, 26), and smaller quantities of 4-hydroxyglucobrassicin (for example, see Fig. 4). Although the indole glucosinolate composition varied considerably among cultivars and even among different samples of the same cultivar, indole glucosinolates accounted, on average, for 67% of the total glucosinolates in extracts prepared from 7 broccoli cultivars


This finding above is not good for the mature broccoli vegetables. You want the indoles to be lower, not higher, but unfortunately the indoles in mature broccoli account for 67% of all phyto chemicals tested. Doesn't look so good for mature brccoli when compared with sprouted broccoli.

I have much more of the study to present that further puts mature broccoli in a poorer light when compared to sprouted broccoli, however the system is not allowing me to post anything else.

The study above will be referenced when l am allowed to post it. I will also present other studies when the system allows me to do so.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 04:16AM by The Sproutarian Man.

my statement on the phytos was not well phrased. it was in more in reference to your statement on your site regarding phytonutrients being very much lower in store bought fruits. and I have not seen any data to that effect. so if there is data there to support your statement that would be interesting.

and of course the whole phytonutrient thing is a bit muddled as to benefit/drawbacks and there is a lot unknown presumably.

the crux regarding phytonutrients is

1. evidence that the array of phytonutrients is critical to health and not simply shown in studies to be cancer fighting.

2. and that quality fruits and veggies have insufficient phytonutrients as you implied - presuming they are critical to health.

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> the crux regarding phytonutrients is
>
> 1. evidence that the array of phytonutrients is
> critical to health and not simply shown in studies
> to be cancer fighting.


It's the same old issue that is always presented, similar to how raw foods haven't been proven to stop cancer, you'll have to make up your own mind on that. Studies on phyto nutrients make a strong case to contribute to cancer fighting.

And given the important role that phyto nutrients play (I have a book that lists about 250 pages of peer reviewed science links all about the roles of phyto chemicals), it would be well advised to increase phyto chemical levels in this day and age. They play important roles like vitamins, but it looks like many of them can play an even more important role. And various phyto chemicals are said by scientists to play a more potent role than regular vitamin anti oxidants where the effect also lasts for much longer.


Sulforaphane works as a potent catalyst to boost Phase 2 enzymes in the body. These detoxification enzymes trigger ongoing antioxidant action for at least 72 hours. As a result, the indirect antioxidant activity of sulforaphane lasts significantly longer than that of direct antioxidants, such as vitamins C, E and beta carotene


I don't have time to look up the studies about post harvest fruits/veggies losing phyto chemicals, but this short study will give you some idea that it is an issue. FRESH food always - various science shows the consequences of store bought produce in terms of vitamin and phyto chemical losses. At the end of the day, if you want to buy store produce and the nutritional consequences that come with it, that is your business.

Changes in post-harvest phytochemical qualities of broccoli florets during ambient and refrigerated storage

A. Nath, B. Bagchi
[www.sciencedirect.com]


Also:

Title: Effect of postharvest handling practices on phytochemical concentrations and bioactive potential in wild blueberry fruit

Gustafson, Sally - Yousef, Gad
[www.ars.usda.gov]



Interpretive Summary: Wild blueberries contain a range of compounds with potential health benefits to humans. One group in particular is the group of compounds called polyphenolics. These compounds can serve as antioxidants or can help to reduce inflammation in people. Blueberries are a rich source of polyphenolics, especially when the fruit are freshly harvested. Because these polyphenolic compounds can be degraded by cooking or storage



This post will is the last conversation l have with you. I won't be reading anymore of your posts, so it is better to talk to somebody else.

I will present as much research as l can to back up my points in the future, still lots of work to summerise and do.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 05:46AM by The Sproutarian Man.

The case l have against veggies is more than what people may realise. Nutrient chelation is a key factor, and vegetables have a much lower level of this factor for various reasons. In time much will be said and presented about many many things regarding sprouts v's veggies.

The science also says that it is not the total amount of nutrients a food has that is of key importance, it's the bioavailability of those nutrients. So when we get good nutrient foods with bioavailability we come out with a winner of very high standing.

The potential for nutrient synergy, the chelation factors, the fiber etc all play a part. Carrot science is fascinating (a nasty old food), but when we chelate nutrients via enzymatic production, combine with high oil content foods, break down fibers via bacterias etc we can have a winner of a food instead of a partial loser.

ALLRIGHT!!! This should be an interesting Thread where 2 people can logically discuss the issues one point at a time.

Hey PL,

Pay attention - this is how an Honest Debate works where points are enumerated so they can be discussed one at a time. I've tried to do this with you on numerous occasions and you refuse to engage because you are a Dis-Honest Skeptic! I would not point this out, except you keep spewing the same old nonsense over and over and over. Since this is a Raw Vegan Website and you are neither Raw nor a Vegan, why do you come here if you are NOT WILLING to have an Honest Debate?

Peace and Love..........John

JR said> ALLRIGHT!!! This should be an interesting Thread where 2 people can logically discuss the issues one point at a time.


TSM said> This post will is the last conversation l have with you.

fresh says>

Well look at that JR, TSM has given up already ! Thanks for your response TSM, but many of the questions are not very difficult. First you say you will respond, then you say this is your last post. very weird.

TSM cannot even answer these 2 simple questions? why not?

-> Does the sproutarian man recommend that all of the fruit, veggie, potatoes, rice transportation cease around the world? Should all the people of the world simply survive on sprouts and seaweed? what about those not near seaweeds ?

-> How are pregnant moms, children, athletes to thrive on the sproutarian diet? Is this diet generally applicable or just for the sedentary spiritual type? and if so, of what use is it?

Now onto the brief post that TSM has made....


>Here is a study showing that 16 sprouts have far more phyto chemicals than their vegetable counterparts, between 10 - 100 times the phyto chemical content. But, first, some highlight of the study:


yes thank you, actually young veggies are recommended by most NH and 811 eaters.

so no disagreement there.

by the way, using TASTE gets us to the same place without all those studies.

and I clarified my question later, let's see if you answered it later.

here we are...

>I don't have time to look up the studies about post harvest fruits/veggies losing phyto chemicals, but this short study will give you some idea that it is an issue.


ALL I asked was for a quantification of the phytonutrient losses and their implication for health.
And you have no answer to that question. Do you know why?
Because it's virtually impossible to answer.
AND YET, you go around claiming that all store bought and farmers market and most fresh picked foods are LOW IN PHYTONUTRIENTS, HORMONES, OXYGEN, VITAMINS, MINERALS, and are unsuitable for eating.

AND STILL YET, you CANNOT QUANTIFY IT.
So I would suggest that you just that admit that you cannot do so,
and simply say that YOU CHOOSE to eat sprouts
BUT THAT YOU CANNOT PROVE THAT store bought, farmers market, and other fruits and veggies are insufficient for health or damaging.

ANY STUDY that simply claims that levels of X or Y are LOWER PROVE NOTHING!

why do you make me type in upper case all the time?

AND YOU EVEN IGNORE your claim about fruit being ACIDIC IN THE BODY.

Do you think that I am aggressive, negative, irritating?

In truth, what I am is a person who insists upon myself and others not making vague statements that can not be backed up by anything, just to sound like a new age health guru.


>FRESH food always - various science shows the consequences of store bought produce in terms of vitamin and phyto chemical losses. At the end of the day, if you want to buy store produce and the nutritional consequences that come with it, that is your business.

YOU HAVE NOT PROVEN ANYTHING WITH REGARDS TO THAT.
I am puzzled as to why you can't understand this.
Except that you simply want to protect your sprout niche.


from your study
>Because these polyphenolic compounds can be degraded by cooking or storage

WHERE ARE THE NUMBERS!
are you ANOTHER pseudo scientist?


>>>The science also says that it is not the total amount of nutrients a food has that is of key importance, it's the bioavailability of those nutrients. So when we get good nutrient foods with bioavailability we come out with a winner of very high standing.

good point. that leads us to fruits and young greens of all types.
not necessarily NO FRUIT and all sprouts.

there are just too many things wrong here but I'll try to write a metaphore. when I go to the gym, I see these people with notebooks and stop watches. They are information driven. Most of then get tired right away and don't last. The reality is that information can be amplified and some things exagerated. At the end, these people don't succeed. Well they only succeed at recording minutia. The final proof is in the results.

70 years old fruit eater.

[www.inspirawtion.com]

Phyto nutrients play such an important role in health, and a diet is much better when they are had at higher levels. Countless research papers show the importance of these substances because they are powerful fighters of disease and play important roles in disease prevention. It seems like they play an even more powerful role than vitamins. Later l will post some studies which demonstrate just how powerful they are in the diet. Whether they are classified as `essential' or not is irrelevant...with time the mainstream will catch onto how important and health promoting these substances are. Dr Brian Clement is saying suimilar things that l am...enzymes and phyto chemicals are of critical importance for health in the modern age because of all the assaults that the body suffers through heirs environment.


Why FRESH food? He is some post harvest science below. And yes, post harvesting can be devastating to phyto chemicals and vitamins. If you think refrigeration stops things declining, no.


Health-promoting compounds in broccoli as influenced by refrigerated transport and retail sale period

Song L, Thornalley PJ
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]


Highlight of the study:

These were film-wrapped and stored for 7 days at 1 degrees C to simulate a maximum period of commercial transport and distribution. After cold storage, inflorescences were kept for 3 days at 15 degrees C to simulate a retail sale period.

Results showed major losses at the end of both periods, in comparison with broccoli at harvest. Thus, the respective losses, at the end of cold storage and retail periods, were 71-80% of total glucosinolates, 62-59% of total flavonoids, 51-44% of sinapic acid derivatives, and 73-74% caffeoyl-quinic acid derivatives


Major phyto chemical loses above.



Now to be fair, packaging and refrigeration is quite sophisticated these days and greatly helps maintain loses, however post harvest handling is devastating to nutritional loses as is selling at retail temperitures typically on tables in typical shops and farmer's markets. Evenstill, decent losses of phyto chemicals does take place, up to one quarter after a week (see below).



Effect of storage, processing and cooking on glucosinolate content of Brassica vegetables

Song L, Thornalley PJ
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]


Highlight of the study:


Storage at ambient temperature and in a domestic refrigerator showed no significant difference and a minor loss (9-26%) of glucosinolate levels over 7 days


and if you think cutting up a salad and taking it to work is good, it's time to rethink this. Tearing lettuce or chopping veggies or fruit is one of the worst things that can be done.


Vegetables shredded finely showed a marked decline of glucosinolate level with post-shredding dwell time - up to 75% over 6h


So yes, we can clearly see that phyto chemicals are lost in store bought non fresh food. Below shows nutrient loses of broccoli refrigerated for 35 days at chill temperiture.


The Influence of Processing and Preservation on the Retention of Health-Promoting Compounds in Broccoli

F. Galgano, F. Favati et al
[onlinelibrary.wiley.com]


Highlight of the study:

In this work the effects of common household practices such as chilling, freezing, and cooking on vitamin C retention in broccoli (Marathon cv.), as well as their influence on the release of sulforaphane upon enzymatic hydrolysis of glucoraphanin by the endogenous enzyme myrosinase, were investigated. When chilled at 6 °C and 95% R.H. for 35 d, broccoli showed a vitamin C and sulforaphane loss of about 39% and 29%, respectively, while storage at –18 °C for 60 d resulted in similar losses, but mainly due to the blanching step


If it is causing these losses for veggies, what is it doing to unripe certified organic fruit that can be stored up to 3 - 4 months according to a farmer. They pick all the fruit, refrigerate it and then sell it over the coming months. They do this to save costs.


I'll post more post-harvest science another time. I have some good links saved up somewhere which talks about how badly the handling of produce negatively effects it. Also more info on shedding and refrigeration and room temperiture storing. Moral of the story...you are not getting the health giving food you think you are, it is only a stripped down version of it's original self.

To me, fruits should be eaten sparingly.,Veggies should be used sparingly as a flavour enhancer, not as a major source of nutrition. Veggies may have been o.k in the 1,800's when the environment was safer, but imo they don't cut it these days...we need to bring out the super powerful sprouts and use their super high phyto chemcials and freshness and enzymes.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 09:11PM by The Sproutarian Man.

The criciferous veggies study v’s sprouts continues (phyto chemicals). I have tried about 20 times to post the next parts of this important study, however the forum is not letting me. Hopefully it works this time. I will post bit by bit and have cut out some of the fancy symbols.

In contrast, in most 3 day old broccoli and cauliflower sprouts and seeds, less than 10% of total glucosinolates were indoles, and in many cultivars none could be detected. These sprouts contained primarily alkylthioglucosinolates: typically glucoraphanin with smaller quantities of glucoerucin and glucoiberin (3 methylsulfinylpropyl glucosinolate). The total glucosinolate contents are 22.7 and 3.37 for the sprouts and mature broccoli, respectively. Indole glucosinolates, however, accounted for only 3% of the total glucosinolates in these sprouts, compared with 68% of those in the mature plant. There are 20 times more methylsulfinylalkyl glucosinolates (glucoraphanin and glucoerucin) in the sprouts compared with the mature broccoli. A 100g serving of mature broccoli would, therefore, provide 108 of methylsulfinylalkyl glucosinolates and 229 of indole glucosinolates, whereas consumption of an equivalent quantity of methylsulfinylalkyl glucosinolates via a much smaller serving of sprouts (5 g) would result in the consumption of only 11.2 of indole glucosinolates

The more effective phytochemicals for fighting cancer are in the broccoli sprouts, where-as the less effective and potential "tumorigenesis" enhancing phytochemicals are in the mature vegetable. The mature vegetable does appear to be a very poor trade when it comes to both numbers of phyto chemicals and quality of phyto chemicals.

Part 3 of the study

This below says a lot...the things in the mature broccoli vegetables possibly has cancer inducing effects because of high levels of much less desirable phyto chemicals in fighting disease. It doesn't mean the broccoli will give you cancer, but it does show that the various phyto chemicals in high amounts in the mature vegetable might work against it's effectness as a cancer killer. Once again, sprouted broccoli has no such problem.

These differences in glucosinolate profiles between young sprouts and mature broccoli are of considerable interest and potential importance in devising chemoprotective strategies in humans. The methylsulfinylalkyl glucosinolates contained in high concentrations in sprouts are monofunctional inducers. Moreover, sulforaphane does not appear to be significantly genotoxic in that it stimulates neither unscheduled DNA synthesis in hepatocytes nor the formation of histidine revertants in the Salmonella typhimurium test. In contrast, hydrolysis of indole glucosinolates by myrosinase gives rise to bifunctional inducers, such as indole-3-carbinol and indole-3-nitrile, and to condensation products, such as 3,3-diindolylmethane and indole-3-carbazole, which bind to the aryl hydrocarbon receptor. Indole-3-carbinol is both an inhibitor and an enhancer of tumor formation in animals, depending upon the experimental system and the timing of administration in relation to exposure to carcinogen .Consequently, there are potential limitations to the use of indole glucosinolates as chemoprotectors in humans because they (i) are weak inducers of phase 2 enzymes, (ii) are bifunctional inducers that activate phase 1 enzymes, (iii) may have estrogen receptor binding activity, and (iv) are potential tumor promoter



CONCLUSIONS

Large quantities of inducers of enzymes that protect against carcinogens can be delivered in the diet by small quantities of young crucifer sprouts (e.g., 3-day-old broccoli sprouts) that contain as much inducer activity as 10–100 times larger quantities of mature vegetables. Moreover, the inducer activity arises primarily from glucoraphanin (the glucosinolate of sulforaphane) and such sprouts contain relatively low quantities of indole glucosinolates, which are potential tumor promoters. Because little is known of the metabolism of glucosinolates in humans, we have undertaken studies (to be published separately) that demonstrate efficient conversion of glucosinolates to isothiocyanates in humans in the absence of plant myrosinase.


From here (one of the leading studies done on mature veggies v's sprout counterparts), and clearly shows the phyto chemical levels and balances of the in the sprouts are greatly superior to the mature vegetables.

Broccoli sprouts: An exceptionally rich source of inducers of enzymes that protect against?chemical?carcinogens

Jed W. Fahey, Yuesheng Zhang
[www.pnas.org]


I have also seen somewhere in the research that the various `glucosinolates' in broccoli sprouts are the most powerful anti-cancer nutrients ever discovered in food. Are phyto nutrients important?...you bet they are!

And remember, they compared at least 16 sprouts to their phyto chemically inferior vegetable counterparts.



Broccoli sprouts: An exceptionally rich source of inducers of enzymes that protect against?chemical?carcinogens
Jed W. Fahey, Yuesheng Zhang
[www.pnas.org]



Here is another study which says that broccoli phyto chemicals are higher for sprouts than the mature vegetable

Natural antioxidants in purple sprouting broccoli under Mediterranean climate
Rodríguez-Hernández Mdel C, Moreno DA et al
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]


I could post study after study, but l hope you are now starting to get the picture that sprouts do appear to have far more discovered phyto chemicals than their vegetable counter parts.



I’ll just sign off with a simple study that shows that sprouting does increase phyto chemicals dramatically.

Effect of germination on phytochemical profiles and antioxidant activity of mung bean sprouts (Vigna radiata)
Guo X, Li T, Tang K, Liu RH
[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]


The highlights of the study

Germination of mung beans dramatically increased vitamin C content in mung bean sprouts in a time-dependent manner and reached the peak on day 8 of germination up to 285 mg/100 g DW, almost 24 times higher than the initial concentration in mung bean seeds (p < 0.05). On fresh weight basis, one serving of mung bean sprouts (about 104 g) provides 21.6 mg of vitamin C, which could meet 36% of Daily Value (DV). In addition, the germination dramatically increased total phenolic compounds and total flavonoids in mung bean sprouts in a time-dependent manner, up to 4.5 and 6.8 times higher than the original concentration of mung bean seeds, respectively. Quercetin-3-O-glucoside content was significantly increased in mung bean sprouts after germination. The total antioxidant activity of mung bean sprouts was increased by 6 times higher than that of mung bean seeds. Therefore, the germination of mung bean sprouts significantly increased phytochemical content, vitamin C content, and antioxidant activity



I will be presenting lots of research on phyto chemicals in future and also give a compelling case as to why fruits and vegetables are a very poor choice to be made in this day and age. The material l have on lipids, enzymes, probiotics in relation to breaking down the food matrix (food structure) will provide a powerful case against the argument for vegetables. Carrot science is fascinating too.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 09:39PM by The Sproutarian Man.

I'm willing to try TSM or PL's diets but if it doesnt work for me then I must be allowed to flog their bare backs with a bullwhip mercilessly every day for a month to make up for all the stress and dissatisfaction I went through.

Anon 102 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm willing to try TSM or PL's diets but if it
> doesnt work for me then I must be allowed to flog
> their bare backs with a bullwhip mercilessly every
> day for a month to make up for all the stress and
> dissatisfaction I went through.

You don't have to change it completely. Why not just add in some sprouted green juices, some sprouted chia/sesame, some sea weeds and chlorella. Some ferments would be good too.


I will post as much science as l can, and if l don't have the science l will still try to make a good argument to back up my view points. I am not just a sproutarian for the sake of it, there are very strong reasons why l eat this way. Some of the stuff l have presented is just the tip of the iceberg.

In time my website will be written correctly. The `vegan diet problems' section is 90% decent, but the `why sprouted food is best' section is a complete joke and rubbish, and will need to be completely written so it is respectable with good science links and balanced writing....l only wrote that originally to get something ip in writing, but now it needs to be done properly and to back everything up. The `sproutarian foods' section also needs a complete overhall and lots of science studies to be included. It will take a few years to do everything right...l am only 5% there at the moment...wayyy under quality, but that will change and it will become one of the most comprehensive online discussions of raw vegan foods on the internet. People need to know this important information because it is not presented anywhere in much detail from my observations over the years. It's about time the work was done properly.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 09:51PM by The Sproutarian Man.

And we go back to the old story....the British Food Journal reports that mineral depletion of the food supply is at an all time low. Eating a raw vegan diet in the old days might have been safer (assuming you had various foods available), but if you think the stripped down nutrient food we have these days along with anti nutrients is going to cut it...maybe it's time to do a rethink on this.

We need to get smarter these days, we are no longer living in the 1920's when food had higher levels of nutrients. We need to work on increasing bioavailability of nutrition along with adding sea plants to bring the full spectrum of trace minerals up. We also need to focus on green sprout juicing and sprouted seed pastes to boost that nutrition because veggies are not enough.

All minerals in food during the last 50 years has shown significant decline except one.


Historical changes in the mineral content of fruits
and vegetables

Anne-Marie Mayer
[www.grazetech.com.au]


I think it's time we started to wake up. Lots of SAD eaters report feeling good too, but what is the real story? It's not just about feeling good, it is about the whole nine yards...the activated 6th sense/spiritual, balanced mind, powerful mind....being master of your situation. Lots of people feel good, but we can move beyond that. Wigmore did it, l am doing it, we all can do it. More nutrition for the body, mind and to bring on an even higher level of functioning.

Thanks for those links sproutarianman.

1. While I understand that many people feel the same way as you regarding phytos and their medicinal effects, after some research I do not share those concerns about losses in storage because i do not feel they are critical as vit and min are, and neither do I share the need for phytos for medicinal purposes.

my concern is more for vits and mins but I was unable to find too much in pubmed, although I found a couple studies below.

I would like to know more about transportation time for produce. If anyone has info pls share. Problem is it will be highly variable.


The highest vitamin C, beta-carotene, and vitamin E losses were observed after 10 d, being similar in whole and fresh-cut mangoes. The antioxidant activity was not significantly affected by storage time. We conclude that fresh-cut mangoes retained their bioactive compound content during storage and their antioxidant and nutritional properties make them a good source of these compounds.

[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]



[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

The Sproutarian Man Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And we go back to the old story....the British
> Food Journal reports that mineral depletion of the
> food supply is at an all time low. Eating a raw
> vegan diet in the old days might have been safer
> (assuming you had various foods available), but if
> you think the stripped down nutrient food we have
> these days along with anti nutrients is going to
> cut it...maybe it's time to do a rethink on this.
>
>
> We need to get smarter these days, we are no
> longer living in the 1920's when food had higher
> levels of nutrients. We need to work on increasing
> bioavailability of nutrition along with adding sea
> plants to bring the full spectrum of trace
> minerals up. We also need to focus on green sprout
> juicing and sprouted seed pastes to boost that
> nutrition because veggies are not enough.
>
> All minerals in food during the last 50 years has
> shown significant decline except one.
>
>
> Historical changes in the mineral content of
> fruits
> and vegetables
>
> Anne-Marie Mayer
> [www.grazetech.com.au]
> J%20Mayer_minerals_nutrients_0.pdf
>
>
> I think it's time we started to wake up. Lots of
> SAD eaters report feeling good too, but what is
> the real story? It's not just about feeling good,
> it is about the whole nine yards...the activated
> 6th sense/spiritual, balanced mind, powerful
> mind....being master of your situation. Lots of
> people feel good, but we can move beyond that.
> Wigmore did it, l am doing it, we all can do it.
> More nutrition for the body, mind and to bring on
> an even higher level of functioning.

I did not find those numbers alarming at all.
they were very close plus some numbers went up

Vitamins and minerals have nothing on enzymes, phytochemicals, and electrical frequency Not to say they're not important, however.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 10:35PM by jtprindl.

Regarding phytochemicals:

[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov] - Apple phytochemicals and their health benefits.

Interesting enough, it says this: "Storage has little to no effect on apple phytochemicals, but processing can greatly affect apple phytochemicals".

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Vitamins and minerals have nothing on enzymes,
> phytochemicals, and electrical frequency Not to
> say they're not important, however.


Electrical freq? R u on the conductivity diet too?

fresh Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jtprindl Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Vitamins and minerals have nothing on enzymes,
> > phytochemicals, and electrical frequency Not
> to
> > say they're not important, however.
>
>
> Electrical freq? R u on the conductivity diet too?


Nope, it's what you get from raw LIVING foods you consume immediately after harvesting (ie sprouts, wheatgrass juice, wild fruit, etc)

Exactly jtprindl. We cannot discount the powerful roles of phyto chemicals. These days we need all the nutritional help we can get. And if sprouts have 10 - 100 times more phyto chemicals than their vegetable equivalents and are fresh, why not eat lots of those instead? Then, if you take a probiotic, digestive enzymes and sea weeds with those sprouts to increase bioavailability of nutrients to make up for what is missing in the soil, you can't do much better than that.

People can discount the posts made here all they like, but you can't get around the science of it all - the soils, the vegetables, the post harvest science etc.

And if you think the store bought produce and fresh produce makes no difference, then do an experiment. Find a house that doesn't eat fruit from their trees...pick their fruit and eat it for the day, then go back to store bought fruit. Observe the difference.

Try this. Grow your own vegetables, and store in the fridge for 3 weeks and then juice them. The next day or later in the day, immediately juice the fresh picked garden veggies ....observe the difference between the two. I've done these things, there is a difference.

People can try to get around the things stated in my posts here all they like, but you cannot write off the information and experiments that have been done. Store bought fruit and vegetables are inferior foods to their fresh counterparts, but even then, we need to increase bioavailability of nutrients to make up for the lack of nutrition in the soil.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2014 11:14PM by The Sproutarian Man.

Again nobody is saying there are no losses.
I dont know why ur repeating that

there is no evidence that it is insufficient.

What they are also doing at Hippocrates are using lots of electric treatments on people for healing (about three or four different machines) and the rapid and increased healing reported is said to be amazing.

We are bioelectric, so it stands to reason that we would respond to the right type of electrical frequency, and it also stands to reason why we respond poorly to other electrical frequencies like EMF waves from cordless devices such as mobile phones, smart meters, corldess phones, cordless remote controls, cordless laptops, modern day light bulbs etc.

Some recent ,mainstream science in EMF radiation. If you think this link scares you...apparently it goes much further down the rabbit hole than most of us could ever imagine.
[www.thesproutarian.com]

My link only talks about the mild stuff like sperm damage, tumour increases, behaviour modification and increases in brain proteins that has links to dementia, memory loss, agression and cancers. In the near future l am going to post further links which make those things seem like a picnic (John Rose has them because he can handle the truth). I will provide links which present the worst nightmare you've ever had, it will be guaranteed to ruin your day and present the grand daddy of all nightmares and make you want to curl up and cry like a baby, but we need to know. We can't just suck our thumbs and cry like babies with this onslaught, we need to get smart and get around it, and we can.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2014 12:25AM by The Sproutarian Man.

not for prindl or tsm

[apgaylard.wordpress.com]




>That’s why the natural hygiene diet kills you

brian says in the video.....

"people who talk about the natural hygiene diet SHOULD DIE ALSO"

what a jerk. spiritual guy, huh?


1. define natural hygiene diet.


2.how is robert lockhart living?

john kohler?

mike arnstein?

chris califano?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2014 01:00AM by fresh.

The Sproutarian Man Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Now listen to this video from 0:00 – 2:00. It
> talks about how eating three week old fruit and
> veggies is rubbish because the electromagnetic
> frequency has almost gone (it looks like Dr Hunt
> tested this). That’s why the natural hygiene
> diet kills you. This is why sprouts are the best,
> it’s fresh. WOW!!!
> Also listen to the video from 4:20 - 5:55 . Sea
> vegetables have the unique cell structure to hold
> onto the nutrients and have a very high
> electromagnetic frequency.


> We can also test the sea weeds. These sea weeds
> are not fresh, but they contain a special energy
> each time you have them. It is not just the
> nutrients in the sea weed doing this, why?
and it looks
> like Dr Clement and Dr Hunt is correct in that
> these special water plant foods (sea weeds) have a
> unique cellular structure that keeps the
> electrical frequency in tact for 2 years, where-as
> plant based foods don’t. That’s my experience
> exactly.



Plant enzymes can be preserved for years so long as the food is properly dehydrated. It's leaving the water content in them too long which kills the enzymes and causes the energy problems then rot. Dehydrate them properly and they will still be very nutritious, enzymes and all, for years and decades and even centuries if you want to take it into the realm of an art form.

For heaven sakes, really, the reason seaweed stays good for longer is because of the salt in the oceans it grows in that clings and desiccates the seaweeds when they are hung to dry. If seaweed was kept wet in a bag in your fridge it would lose it's nutrition just as quickly as any other water rich veggie - probably faster.



> . Imo, it is not the vitamins, minerals and
> phyto chemicals which is sustaining us, it is the
> electrical frequencies they attract.


Sure physics trumps biology, if that's what you're saying, but if channels are blocked or destroyed from the mineral kingdom on up through all the kingdoms it doesn't matter that we are embedded in a sea of living electrical frequencies, does it? And that is exactly what's happening.

We can't be more conductive by smiling or wishing really hard upon a star that we could be more conductive, IMO. These "law of attraction" and "abundance" new age mantras really are getting on my nerves. Not that having a good attitude isn't useful to attaining health.

The law of attraction is very real.

I was asked which links provide the nightmare. Here they are, well worth the listen.



The Cooking of Humanity
Quite an impressive man, he tries to be very careful not to verge on conspiracy.


[www.youtube.com]


But the nightmare kicks into high gear with these next two video. Try not to get scared, just do something about it. The lady below shows various supposed secret government documents we might be able to find also.

Deborah Tavares - Smart Meters at Oathkeeperss Meeting

[www.youtube.com]


DeborahTavares Refuse Smart Meters Conference 2012
It gets funny from 7 - 10 mins, but it kicks into high gear after that. Debras tone might make your teeth chatter. I don't get scared ever these days, but this made me scared. Sometimes the `so called' truth can be hard to handle. I do believe this lady may well be telling the truth. I bet John Rose got scared too. I bet jtprindl might get scared too. I bet nearly everyone will get scared when they listen to this lady.

[www.youtube.com]



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2014 01:45AM by The Sproutarian Man.

I haven't read the articles yet but there will be no smart meter on my house while I'm in it. I know enough about the subject to know not to allow that.