Instead of engaging the argumentative people and the name callers, you can choose to ignore them. People go back and forth for pages upon pages on this forum calling each other idiots. You DO have a choice in the matter! Instead the name callers are joined by other name callers and it escalates. This isn't isolated to two people and it takes more than one to keep it going.

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Utopian Life Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I am not an 80/10/10. I think you have me
> > mistaken with someone else. But regardless,
> that
> > doesn't change the fact that you violated the
> > rules. You claim you had no choice but to do
> so.
> > Uhm, you could have just not posted? Went for
> a
> > walk? Ate an apple? Talked to a human in
> person?
> > No choice? Riiighhhht. Talk about
> dogmatic.....
>
> Then have panchito or jr screaming at you for 5
> pages that your diverting and not answering his
> questions.
>
> cant win either way.


--
maybe talk to a friend, therapist, or a mental health professional about these issues with these people you have chosen to have a longstanding relationship with. get rid of what doesn't suit you.

Lol what are you even on about ?

Maybe you should talk to a therapist, with your deep issues that you can't handle anyone not eating the same way you do.

To the point you actually hate me, i can feel the hate off you utopian. You, John, Fresh, panchito at times, you can smell the hate a mile off from these members and that includes the way they treat other raw vegans, all because someone eats differently or doesn't eat as much fruit as you, or eats more sprouts big deal lol.

Yet im the one who needs a shrink.

Maybe i do need my head checked to have ever wanted to hang around here for so long, trying to help people.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2014 01:42PM by temp.

I don't hate you. I feel sorry for you. You seem to have an addiction that is not serving you. You say you are leaving this forum permanently but respond to posts within 1 min of there being posted.

about 99.9+% of the world doesn't eat the way I do. I'm cool with that. Obviously. LOL Considering how long term I am. and healthy and fantastic and fit and strong. I'll take my body and mind over someone else's any day. Yes, I can quite handle being me.

Utopian Life Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't hate you. I feel sorry for you. You seem
> to have an addiction that is not serving you. You
> say you are leaving this forum permanently but
> respond to posts within 1 min of there being
> posted.
>
> about 99.9+% of the world doesn't eat the way I
> do. I'm cool with that. Obviously. LOL
> Considering how long term I am. and healthy
> and fantastic and fit and strong. I'll take my
> body and mind over someone else's any day. Yes, I
> can quite handle being me.

I thought thats what a conversation was ?

If you weren't asking questions and posting in here addressed to me or about me, i wouldn't be responding.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2014 01:44PM by temp.

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Lol what are you even on about ?
>
> Maybe you should talk to a therapist, with your
> deep issues that you can't handle anyone not
> eating the same way you do.
>
> To the point you actually hate me, i can feel the
> hate off you utopian. You, John, Fresh, panchito
> at times, you can smell the hate a mile off from
> these members and that includes the way they treat
> other raw vegans, all because someone eats
> differently or doesn't eat as much fruit as you,
> or eats more sprouts big deal lol.
>
> Yet im the one who needs a shrink.
>
> Maybe i do need my head checked to have ever
> wanted to hang around here for so long, trying to
> help people.

--
quoted since "temp" or "powerlifer" edits posts every 30 seconds. lol

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I thought thats what a conversation was ?
>
> If you weren't asking questions and posting in
> here addressed to me or about me, i wouldn't be
> responding.

------
you'd just be responding to someone else. after stating multiple times you are leaving permanently. Why don't you just make up another username and stay since you aren't capable of leaving this forum and you have your gripes you want to keep repeating about it over and over and over and want to continue to take jabs at people. Do you feel better yet?

No because i no longer wish to be part of this forum, which is why although this was just a temporary ban, i want prana to make it a permanent one. I am done with having to tread on egg shells to have a discussion on nutrition, without worrying some faction of the forum is going to get upset and start their crap.

Your not much different than my other fans, your always there to humor me it seems hanging over my every post ?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2014 02:00PM by temp.

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No because i no longer wish to be part of this
> forum, which is why although this was just a
> temporary ban, i want prana to make it a permanent
> one. I am done with having to tread on egg shells
> to have a discussion on nutrition, without
> worrying some faction of the forum is going to get
> upset and start their crap.
>
> Your not much different than my other fans, your
> always there to humor me it seems hanging over my
> every post ?

Darn it, I wish you could ignore these insufferable trolls who have learned how to push everyone who doesn't walk in their lockstep way's buttons and stay. Just refrain from saying raw vegan doesn't work. I think you can do that and you do have a lot of knowledge to offer that benefits people here. Please don't let these bullies get under your skin and dictate your actions. You have a lot to offer.

<<<Darn it, I wish you could ignore these insufferable trolls who have learned how to push everyone who doesn't walk in their lockstep way's buttons and stay. Just refrain from saying raw vegan doesn't work.>>>

ANYONE WHO COMES TO A RAW VEGAN WEBSITE AND SAYS THAT A RAW VEGAN DIET DOES NOT WORK IS THE TROLL!!!

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No because i no longer wish to be part of this
> forum, which is why although this was just a
> temporary ban, i want prana to make it a permanent
> one. I am done with having to tread on egg shells
> to have a discussion on nutrition, without
> worrying some faction of the forum is going to get
> upset and start their crap.
>
> Your not much different than my other fans, your
> always there to humor me it seems hanging over my
> every post ?

You do not have to wait for Prana to make it permanent.
You can just stop posting...
It is certain that you are not going to reply to this post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2014 04:43PM by CommonSenseRaw.

Personally I appreciate Powerlifter's point of view and advice in that everyone needs to be well documented in regards to the diet he wants to follow and in relation to his own health. Not everything that works for someone is good for someone else.

I think we are all grown-up people and we are able to look for ourselves and make the right choices. Who would keep eating in a certain way if he clearly sees that the respective diet is harming him?

My point is that we should respect each and everyone's dietary choices and be supportive of the diet that suits each and one of us. We don't have to impose our own diet to another person nor to discourage someone in following a certain way of eating. You know what they say: "you don't realize something it's wrong or right until you try it yourself". At least this is what works for me: I would rather try something for myself and learn from my own experience (but still taking into account the eventual warnings or the pros), than blindly following someone's advice without even questioning it.

However, this being a raw vegan support forum, I think we should aim to going into that direction. I also think that by now we have all the information, both pro and against the raw vegan diet, so everyone should decide by himself from now on.

IMO and for me, I think it's very encouraging reading about raw vegan people and their diet and lifestyle, this is what motivates me, and I like reading about people I can relate to. But at the same time, being vegan is also very important, as it implies a cruelty-free lifestyle.

I think that on this forum it's enough room for all of us, as long as we respect each other and the forum's rules. We must remember that a society without rules is a society ruled by chaos.

I believe that the insults and name-calling and fights have no place here, they are time-consuming and put us in a negative mood.

So let's make this forum again the nice lovely place where I felt like home from the first time I came here

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Raw vegan for life. Vegan for the animals. Raw for my health.

Bye Chris.

Yayyy! So glad you're gone powerlifter. Raw food didn't work for you? We got it. Now, please stay gone.

P.S. We didn't ask for you to save us



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/24/2014 08:14PM by rawfoodrawfood.

when is the party?

jtprindl Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Then ill wake up with a PM from some random
> member saying my posts led their daughter to
> getting the right help and now shes well or that
> there eczema cleared up and so on and so on. Then
> i realize its worth the stress of putting up with
> the clowns."
>
> But you have to realize that you could be doing
> the complete opposite when you state that a vegan
> diet is impossible. People may actually believe
> you and go back to unhealthy habits like eating
> animal products. You could say something like
> "sustaining yourself long-term on a 100% raw vegan
> diet is challenging and must be well-planned, so
> beware".. and then list the potential dangers, but
> flat-out stating it is impossible is a lie and a
> disservice to those who aspire or are currently
> living this way. Since you're into weight
> training, maybe you could use 100% raw vegan
> bodybuilders as inspiration. A lot of raw vegans
> do look emaciated, but that's not automatically
> the diet's fault (there are emaciated SAD people
> too), there are different variables in every raw
> vegan diet, but there are also raw vegans who are
> just as muscular as people on high meat-eating
> diets as well.

Well said, but of course now he is denying this entirely.

John Rose Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> <<>>
>
> ANYONE WHO COMES TO A RAW VEGAN WEBSITE AND SAYS
> THAT A RAW VEGAN DIET DOES NOT WORK IS THE
> TROLL!!!


Yeah, slam, that's not only true but funny lol and we all need a little funny don't we?

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's an evidence-based article for you guys on
> the short-comings of a vegan diet and the common
> nutrient deficiencies.
>
> All referenced with proper scientific studies.
>
> 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet
>
> Cya Paul and others. Prana you banned my other
> account as requested, please permanently ban this
> one also.

You're not gone... you're never gone. Are you unable to comprehend this powerlifter? No one cares about your stupid scientific reports... just... go... away

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's an evidence-based article for you guys on
> the short-comings of a vegan diet and the common
> nutrient deficiencies.
>
> All referenced with proper scientific studies.
>
> 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet
>
> Cya Paul and others. Prana you banned my other
> account as requested, please permanently ban this
> one also.

Oh my gosh I can't believe you are quoting a study from 1988, I expected more from you. I think you should be banned for that alone lol. I think you should follow Brian Clement if you want to really learn something, then come back here and tell us what you "think" or "believe" afterwards. You should also examine why you need people to listen and believe in what you believe in. You are clearly trying to impose your "BELIEFS" upon other people who have come here to learn about raw-foodism. I appreciate your intellect and nutritional knowledge but your close mindedness and ignorance are intolerable. Your beliefs are your beliefs and that's all. They are not based in truth they are only supported by random studies by people who have other agendas in mind. Studies are studies and that's all, a person or researcher needs to use some common sense and take a long look at society to come up with a better answer.

Personally I know when I kill an animal I feel horrible about the act and that is worth more than any study you, or ignorant people like you (including doctors) could ever quote. They don't even talk about the diet that they were on in that study, and if they did they surely wouldn't talk about the evolution of man and how this all relates to the outcome of this study. In the end you should be smart enough to not repeat over and over that a "Raw Vegan diet will not work in the long term." I think that quote is pretty accurate to what you have said over and over right? Which has been proven WRONG by people like Brian clement. B.C. has good B-12 levels and IS 100% vegan, if you wish to talk with him I sure he would be happy to hear from you. They have webinars at [therealtruthabouthealth.com] you can call and speak with him live. I think it is every third Thursday a month.

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's an evidence-based article for you guys on
> the short-comings of a vegan diet and the common
> nutrient deficiencies.
>
> All referenced with proper scientific studies.
>
> 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet
>
> Cya Paul and others. Prana you banned my other
> account as requested, please permanently ban this
> one also.

Raw vegans do not want to be saved.
That was one of the response abouve



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2014 05:27PM by RawPracticalist.

rawfoodrawfood Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> temp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Here's an evidence-based article for you guys
> on
> > the short-comings of a vegan diet and the
> common
> > nutrient deficiencies.
> >
> > All referenced with proper scientific studies.
> >
> > 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet
> >
> > Cya Paul and others. Prana you banned my other
> > account as requested, please permanently ban
> this
> > one also.
>
> You're not gone... you're never gone. Are you
> unable to comprehend this powerlifter? No one
> cares about your stupid scientific reports...
> just... go... away


Well, that's just mean, but funny too lol, and I'm all about the funny, whoo hoo!

Why is Brian Clement so pudgy? [imgur.com]



Superjuice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> temp Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Here's an evidence-based article for you guys
> on
> > the short-comings of a vegan diet and the
> common
> > nutrient deficiencies.
> >
> > All referenced with proper scientific studies.
> >
> > 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet
> >
> > Cya Paul and others. Prana you banned my other
> > account as requested, please permanently ban
> this
> > one also.
>
> Oh my gosh I can't believe you are quoting a study
> from 1988, I expected more from you. I think you
> should be banned for that alone lol. I think you
> should follow Brian Clement if you want to really
> learn something, then come back here and tell us
> what you "think" or "believe" afterwards. You
> should also examine why you need people to listen
> and believe in what you believe in. You are
> clearly trying to impose your "BELIEFS" upon other
> people who have come here to learn about
> raw-foodism. I appreciate your intellect and
> nutritional knowledge but your close mindedness
> and ignorance are intolerable. Your beliefs are
> your beliefs and that's all. They are not based
> in truth they are only supported by random studies
> by people who have other agendas in mind. Studies
> are studies and that's all, a person or researcher
> needs to use some common sense and take a long
> look at society to come up with a better answer.
>
>
> Personally I know when I kill an animal I feel
> horrible about the act and that is worth more than
> any study you, or ignorant people like you
> (including doctors) could ever quote. They don't
> even talk about the diet that they were on in that
> study, and if they did they surely wouldn't talk
> about the evolution of man and how this all
> relates to the outcome of this study. In the end
> you should be smart enough to not repeat over and
> over that a "Raw Vegan diet will not work in the
> long term." I think that quote is pretty accurate
> to what you have said over and over right? Which
> has been proven WRONG by people like Brian
> clement. B.C. has good B-12 levels and IS 100%
> vegan, if you wish to talk with him I sure he
> would be happy to hear from you. They have
> webinars at [therealtruthabouthealth.com]
> you can call and speak with him live. I think it
> is every third Thursday a month.

rawfoodrawfood Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You're not gone... you're never gone. Are you
> unable to comprehend this powerlifter? No one
> cares about your stupid scientific reports...
> just... go... away

HH, I am not sure what a persons body type has to do with anything, that's kinda prejudice isn't it. Brian is about 70 and living a very good life, writing books teaching something he is very passionate about every day. He runs THE most successful natural healing center in the WORLD! and has built literally a small town based on it. The HHI center encompasses a large area with multiple houses and town-homes devoted to housing people that are staying there. They used to even rely on local hotels for overflow because of so many people wanting to visit. They can accommodate around 80 people on campus I believe. So I am not sure what pudgy has to do with it? what will you be doing and what will you look like when you are 70? LOL

I asked a simple question, why is he pudgy? This is a health forum. Pudginess is not usually associated with people who are healthy or who know the way to health. The logic is pretty basic and straightforward. Instead of a straight answer, we get your butt-hurt ego making a display of itself.

temp Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here's an evidence-based article for you guys on
> the short-comings of a vegan diet and the common
> nutrient deficiencies.
>
> All referenced with proper scientific studies.
>
> 6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet...

Just thought I'd mention that the "6 Common Nutrient Deficiencies On A Vegan Diet" are all easily correctable, but do require an effort on the part of conscientious vegans.

IMO, temp/powerlifter's contribution to this forum has been in advocating for awareness of some nutrients often lacking in a vegan diet.

Vegan diet is far from "impossible" though. My husband and I have both been entirely vegan since 1986, and we are healthy and fit. For nearly 100% of that time, my diet has been raw. As long as people like us (and others here) have this personal experience to cite, any message stating that vegan diets are "impossible" will lack credibility, and may often jeopardize the quality of further discussion - unfortunately.

Information and discussion can be very helpful. I've learned a lot on this forum, and I hope we can move ahead with consideration of our common purpose.

Sorry your feelings were hurt. The straight answer was in a question: "I am not sure what a persons body type has to do with anything" it's that simple. Adding his age and as much as he does, as active as he is...is a better indicator of health isn't it? Not to mention his blood-work that he is so passionate about. Brian is excellent at reading blood-work and will do so for free for LIFE after you attend HHI. IMO you cannot judge someones health by there "body type" Look around, I know many people who are pretty fit and in crap health. I also know people who are in excellent health but have large body's and carry a bit of weight. After a certain age it is hard to not be a bit pudgy for some.

Never judge a book by it's cover.

back at ya PL, and best wishes to everyone here.

suncloud Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> back at ya PL, and best wishes to everyone
> here.

And best wishes to you, too, Suncloud!

I hope PL will start a forum sometime and let us know when/if he does. I would very much like to join in there.

I think that your answer about people having different body types with different results would have sufficed from the start.

Still, I think that most would agree that a flatter belly is more indicative of optimal health and someone who really knows what they're doing. We can't get away from the creation of estrogen via male belly fat. This is not a good thing for men.

Superjuice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry your feelings were hurt. The straight
> answer was in a question: "I am not sure what a
> persons body type has to do with anything" it's
> that simple. Adding his age and as much as he
> does, as active as he is...is a better indicator
> of health isn't it? Not to mention his blood-work
> that he is so passionate about. Brian is
> excellent at reading blood-work and will do so for
> free for LIFE after you attend HHI. IMO you
> cannot judge someones health by there "body type"
> Look around, I know many people who are pretty fit
> and in crap health. I also know people who are in
> excellent health but have large body's and carry a
> bit of weight. After a certain age it is hard to
> not be a bit pudgy for some.
>
> Never judge a book by it's cover.